Cornish Thread

[AbeBot]

People can post anything they want here, but as a recognized Cornish breeder in both the ABA and APA, I am saying they are not Cornish. Most serious Cornish breeders don't come to BYC, so a lot of input here is from people that are new to Cornish. I don't care what people do with their chickens, but I do care when they post inaccurate info about Cornish. That kind of post should be posted in a CornishX thread. This is the Cornish thread, not the hybrid Cornish thread or the "project" Cornish thread or the mongrel Cornish thread.
I post these kinds of responses because most of the people that come here to BYC are newbies and unfortunately they believe most of what is posted here.

Thanks for your input.

Walt

Nobody said they were Cornish. The post asked CORNISH BREEDERS what they thought. There were no claims that might confuse new poultry enthusiasts. You might have had nothing to say.

I'm looking forward to reading about and seeing pictures of these Greylegs, if not here then somewhere else. The name itself makes it pretty clear that they are not Cornish, and pictures may be pretty useful in explaining the differences between Cornish and other chickens, so here would be fine with me. As far as them being just another cross or hybrid; I have no idea if these are F1 or F2 crosses, or if their originator has invested his time, sweat, and tears in many generations of breeding to get them stabilized to breed true.

Thank you for the well-considered answer. I am sure the poster will be happy to have this bit.

As someone who has what I call a "mediocrely average" cornish project going on, I forsee your comments as pretty detrimental to the Cornish suriviability.

To expand upon your comments about being a huge waste of time-- I think it's a huge waste of time promoting the breed if nobody ever chooses to do the next step: and that's establish new breeders.

I'm a current paid member of the ICBA (I wonder how many other posters on this thread and the BYC are?), and just got my new blue newsletter about two weeks ago, however, I'm thinking I won't be a member next year- I have yet to see a benefit of being such.

I am in this same frame of mind. I have some decent birds and yet as I try to improve them according to standard I also enjoy projects. I enjoy hearing about projects and I enjoy weighing in on projects involving breeds I grow.

I'm not changing the breed, just trying to raise some Cornish for myself. The birds I was sold, trace back to hatchery females, I can't complain though I've been selling hatching eggs from them to backyarders like crazy.

I don't have much interest in doing something unique, but b/c my birds aren't up to par- I've resorted to joining the big medicine project for BLR birds. I see no reason in even trying to raise quality Cornish, let alone trying to buy some to do such an endeavor.

Just trying to make the most with what I've got.

Thank you- I believe there are many differing viewpoints and different types of user on BYC, especially on threads which focus on a particular breed. THAT is the broadest of thread types. ALL things Cornish.

I like to try to select for more eggs and better fertility while adhering to standard. I enjoy the different colors a lot.

 

[fowlman01]

Bot: nice selective reading on your part.......they do say they are Cornish and this is when I disagreed.

There is this thread https://www.backyardchickens.com/t/316007/red-laced-cornish-x-and-project-talk-pics-p-8 that is specifically here for you project people. Everyone wants a breed named after them or to be famous in the poultry world...I understand..... just keep it in the proper thread because we have lost some good subscribers.

In addition someone was running down the Cornish club in the Cornish thread........I believe that is considered trolling on BYC.

Walt

 

[aviangems]

Walt, I think you are being too hard on KFCacres. I agree that maybe they should start a thread titled "New cornish Project / Variety or something to that effect, but there are other ways to say that.

KFacres, Your dime your your time - so if you have lots of resources and time to dedicate to this project knock yourselves out.

I can tell you that progress in projects comes slowly and sometimes you end up going backward. Be careful you don't spend an eternity going nowhere.

I have buff cornish bantams. They are a project. I got one bird from another persons project and started with him. It was not easy and they are still not up to par with the more "common" colors. But I like them. I think they are a beautiful variety and I like the challenge. I have no hope of them beating darks or whites or so on but I can assure you that they will be the best buff bantams for years to come.

 

[aviangems]

KFacres,

AS far as the cornish club (ICBA) I think that you are totally off base.

The club is made up of some great individuals and some not so great individuals ( like everything). The members are probably your best bet in acquiring quality stock to either raise or to use to improve your project.

I don't find a whole lot of value in the newsletter but it can give you some interesting insights. 1) there have been some good articles on breeding in past ones 2) the points leaders are there for each variety - this will tell you who you should be aiming to beat if showing is your thing 3) show results are listed - again showing you who is out there that you should strive to have better birds than 4) Contact information for members provided is a way of finding the individuals who have what you might want to get 5) there are other positive aspects as well

Additionally, as a member you can receive the yearbook with pictures of people's birds so that you can see the quality of birds around you.

I became a life member the first or second year because it is a breed that I really like and who better to learn from / get ideas of what to do or not to do than from individuals who are at the top of their game.

I have made some good friends in the ICBA and lots of good acquaintances. I have been able to acquire people's "culls" to assist with improving my projects. I have gotten SUPER white laced reds from Brent Bryan, THe best blues in the country from Mark Beasley and super darks and whites from some of the top guys in the country. I am indebted to many of these guys and greatly value all of the help they have given me. NONE of this would have been possible without the ICBA.

 

[Cedarknob]

I have buff cornish bantams. They are a project. I got one bird from another persons project and started with him. It was not easy and they are still not up to par with the more "common" colors. But I like them. I think they are a beautiful variety and I like the challenge. I have no hope of them beating darks or whites or so on but I can assure you that they will be the best buff bantams for years to come.

Buff Cornish have already been accepted both in large fowl and bantam. I've only seen the LF variety, but have seldom walked through the bantam section of shows and there are surely some somewhere. However, I do hope you succeed with breeding your own line.

 

[fowlman01]

Walt, I think you are being too hard on KFCacres. I agree that maybe they should start a thread titled "New cornish Project / Variety or something to that effect, but there are other ways to say that.

KFacres, Your dime your your time - so if you have lots of resources and time to dedicate to this project knock yourselves out.

I can tell you that progress in projects comes slowly and sometimes you end up going backward. Be careful you don't spend an eternity going nowhere.

I have buff cornish bantams. They are a project. I got one bird from another persons project and started with him. It was not easy and they are still not up to par with the more "common" colors. But I like them. I think they are a beautiful variety and I like the challenge. I have no hope of them beating darks or whites or so on but I can assure you that they will be the best buff bantams for years to come.

I only have one speed...lol

I sponsored the LG buff female in this issue of t he APA SOP. In my opinion the Cornish is one of the hardest breeds to improve...you add buff to that and you really have your work cut out for you. Buff is such a beautiful color on a chicken......looking forward to seeing your progress.

Walt

 

[fowlman01]

Buff Cornish have already been accepted both in large fowl and bantam. I've only seen the LF variety, but have seldom walked through the bantam section of shows and there are surely some somewhere. However, I do hope you succeed with breeding your own line.

Chris Tamayo out here in CA has some bantams, but they are a work in progress.

Walt

 

[kfacres]

Walt, I think you are being too hard on KFCacres. I agree that maybe they should start a thread titled "New cornish Project / Variety or something to that effect, but there are other ways to say that.

KFacres, Your dime your your time - so if you have lots of resources and time to dedicate to this project knock yourselves out.

I can tell you that progress in projects comes slowly and sometimes you end up going backward. Be careful you don't spend an eternity going nowhere.

I have buff cornish bantams. They are a project. I got one bird from another persons project and started with him. It was not easy and they are still not up to par with the more "common" colors. But I like them. I think they are a beautiful variety and I like the challenge. I have no hope of them beating darks or whites or so on but I can assure you that they will be the best buff bantams for years to come.

i think you pretty well nailed it. i would venture a guess, and say that of the people who visit this site, I've got about as much general livestock background as any- just the way I was raised. You've got to have passion and enjoy what you are doing, to be producing nationally competitive livestock in 2 species already- to remain in this game; especially considering this drought we are in.

I forgot to mention above, that my wife has a goal of making white cornish from what we have; WLR females and BLR males which *MIGHT* carry white recessive. We did a test mating of the bluer one to a blue silkie (have 3 of them for incubators, only non- cornish chickens on the place), and it yielded one single solid white chick, and a bunch of blue ones-- so I hope that male atleast carries white.

Obviously I have time, and am willing to hatch eggs, between my selling of hatching eggs, and my own incubator, I believe we have maybe ate a dozen cornish eggs this year. Clearly, with a project such as the one I'm in to make whites-- I've got time... Heck, I don't even know for sure if they carry white-- and I know it will be nearly impossible to rid of the dominate white in the WLR.

As far as the comment about trolling- ha is what I'll say. As a paid member, I would suspect that I can say whatever I want about that association, as long as it's gospel truth.

Now, I'll sit back in my own little world, and continue to laugh at the people promoting the breed, and trying to establish new breeders-- yet they won't sell anything.

 

[spangledcornish]

i think you pretty well nailed it. i would venture a guess, and say that of the people who visit this site, I've got about as much general livestock background as any- just the way I was raised. You've got to have passion and enjoy what you are doing, to be producing nationally competitive livestock in 2 species already- to remain in this game; especially considering this drought we are in.

I forgot to mention above, that my wife has a goal of making white cornish from what we have; WLR females and BLR males which *MIGHT* carry white recessive. We did a test mating of the bluer one to a blue silkie (have 3 of them for incubators, only non- cornish chickens on the place), and it yielded one single solid white chick, and a bunch of blue ones-- so I hope that male atleast carries white.

Obviously I have time, and am willing to hatch eggs, between my selling of hatching eggs, and my own incubator, I believe we have maybe ate a dozen cornish eggs this year. Clearly, with a project such as the one I'm in to make whites-- I've got time... Heck, I don't even know for sure if they carry white-- and I know it will be nearly impossible to rid of the dominate white in the WLR.

As far as the comment about trolling- ha is what I'll say. As a paid member, I would suspect that I can say whatever I want about that association, as long as it's gospel truth.

Now, I'll sit back in my own little world, and continue to laugh at the people promoting the breed, and trying to establish new breeders-- yet they won't sell anything.

I would have to disagree with you about established breeders not willing to sell, over the past few year when we have had quality birds to sell we have got birds to people, there is the numbers thing, but I would say that I have helped at least get 5 new breeders into quality Dark LF in the past two years, and I believe I was willing to help you out at one point but things did not work out. I do think it is unfair to say that, I know Avigems has got bird to others, and know plenty of others when they have the birds are willing to work with ohter that are going seriously work with the breed. The biggest kicker is timming and hatching as far as getting birds, for example last year we had lots os standards to share with others this year we don't have that many so I will not sell many if any.

 

[Minniechickmama]

I would have to disagree with you about established breeders not willing to sell, over the past few year when we have had quality birds to sell we have got birds to people, there is the numbers thing, but I would say that I have helped at least get 5 new breeders into quality Dark LF in the past two years, and I believe I was willing to help you out at one point but things did not work out. I do think it is unfair to say that, I know Avigems has got bird to others, and know plenty of others when they have the birds are willing to work with ohter that are going seriously work with the breed. The biggest kicker is timming and hatching as far as getting birds, for example last year we had lots os standards to share with others this year we don't have that many so I will not sell many if any.

I am one of those people that you have helped get some quality birds, Adam. They are wonderful and putting out some very nice young stock. My only problem is the ratio of male to female (LOL!). I swear, my ratio has been 8:2 in favor of the boys this year! But, that just gives me some good eating for the coming year. I did have to put one down today that had been limping around a little. When I checked him over, his legs were full of infection from something, I have no idea what. I put him down, cut them open and saw what I already suspected was the problem and got rid of him. Otherwise, I have about 35 little beefcakes out here. I love seeing their heartshaped backs getting wider and wider!
I also have some of Imwalles BLR project birds, a Black Laced pullet and a Splash Laced cockerel. I am not crazy about her, but she is workable. I DO like the cockerel and will be working him with some of the girls that are coming up.
I have 4 girls from kf, 3 WLRs and 1 DC. The WLRs are the much better birds for true Cornish type but took a lot longer to grow than the ones from spangled. One of those has awesome color to boot! The DC is too leggy, BUT if I put her under one of my good boys from spangled, I think I will see improvement.
Personally, I think working your own strains is half the fun. Anyone can go out and buy the best and claim them as their birds, but if you didn't breed them to achieve that level on your own, where is the glory. I like to get at least something that is workable and build on it using a few really good specimens. Thanks to spangled, I am doing that now.
This fall I am looking at which clubs I need to join, but I know that ICBA will be one. I like to believe that I have quite a few years to work with my birds before I have to throw in the towel. So, you guys can count on seeing me around. Whether I will get to big shows, I don't know. My first goal is to build a noteworthy flock, and the second is to help others truly interested in building up the breed to get a start with them. However, for the first couple of years, I will probably be a little selfish because I don't want to start selling anything unless it meets the quality deserving of being called Cornish. I have hatchery birds that are part of a meat project, but I make it quite clear to those looking that they ARE hatchery birds.

I do want to say though, this last week was our county fair. My kids took some Buckeyes that were pretty darn good quality but looked a little rough from lack of space to really separate them out. The judge is a production guy from here in MN. I was a bit ticked that he had almost nothing to say about the Bucks except that "you don't see too many of these around". I got the distinct impression that he had no idea what to look for on those birds. THEN he went over to a trio of DCs, that though they were in excellent condition as far as feathering and such to show, they were clearly hatchery birds and not even close to the standard. He placed those pretty high in the class of about 30 pens. Imagine my shock and annoyance. He did a pretty crappy job with ducks too this year, but that is another story for another thread.
It is a bit annoying that a judge would give kids reinforcement to raise birds that are so far from the standard by placing them so high in a show.
On a positive note, it is nice to see someone local who is interested in Cornish to raise.