Dead rats and secondary poisoning?

[Howard E]

I believe my cat may have been sick from eating half a baby rat after I put out poisoning. Full recovery though. He never half ate a rat before either, he usually eats an entire rat. This one he brought half the rat to me before he hid for a day and a half (what cats do when they get sick). Poisons are not the best method for getting rid of rats but sometimes its the only one that works.

Can you recall what bait was being used? As in actual brand name and/or product?

 

[Howard E]

This is the chemical in 99% rodent bait sold where I live, and apparently the worst for causing secondary poisoning...

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brodifacoum

What I find strange, is, at least where I live, there is all this rqt bait for sale, most far more toxic than needed to get rid of the rats, and none of the places thqt sell it offer vitamin K. You can get it from a health store but i had to ring around.
I wonder why places that sell it dont also sell a vitamin K treatment. I know from when I worked at the vet clinic that time is of the essence if a pet consumes poison, so surely if people had vit K on hand, whether its primary or secondary consumption, they could treat their pet as soon as they suspected, rther than delaying till they get to a vet, or because of the cost delaying till their pet has symptoms (prob too late then)
I wonder...why dont the rat bait companies sell the bait with a vit K antidote so any pet owner who suspects poisoning can give that straight away.

Interesting article in Wiki........

However, when I do the math, and see the amounts of lethal amounts of poison it takes to kill a rat and the size of a rat.......and amounts to harm other mammals and birds in relation to their size, it seems unlikely that there is enough poison left in a rat to kill a cat or dog. Perhaps yes with some of the smaller raptors? Perhaps if they ate a bunch of them? What seems more likely is if they bypassed the rat and managed to find the bait itself and ate that? A good reason to use lockable bait stations.

What was also interesting was the references where humans had intentionally ingested the baits and that didn't kill them. Perhaps because they all sought treatment?

 

[Howard E]

I've used eaton, ramik, tomcat, just one bite etc.
I've personally saw my dogs chewing on and playing with dead rats numerous times and never had one die or become sick.
I don't know if they've ever actually eaten one and doesn't seem like they do or want to so that might be the reason they've been fine.

This seems to be the most typical response from dogs and cats. They play with them....or may kill a sick one and all that goes with that, but in general, do not eat them. Perhaps a feral animal might, but most pets that are well fed......don't.

 

[Molpet]

This seems to be the most typical response from dogs and cats. They play with them....or may kill a sick one and all that goes with that, but in general, do not eat them. Perhaps a feral animal might, but most pets that are well fed......don't.

Ha
Are you thinking they don't eat mice in general? Or don't eat sick ones? My dog just kills them, but the cat was another story.
I have found a coil of mouse guts in the bed, stepped on a mouse head and numerous times found a few pieces in the house or on the steps.. dry food is always available. Your mileage may vary

 

[Howard E]

Yup, the old cat and mouse game.

I now have 4 barn cats and not much evidence of rats or mice in the barn and have never seen a snake, so likely the cats are doing a number on any would-be tenant mice. I also see them out in the fields stalking field mice. I have no clue what they do with them.

Our old neighbors had 3 house cats they often let outside to roam......he told me that one spring one of them had brought him over 40 moles. Left them by the front door. Caught em......but didn't eat them.

So yes, some eat em, some just kill em and some lazy cats just lay around. And I think the same could be said of dogs.

So I would agree that what happens to sick poisoned rats and mice likely does vary with the temperament of the dog and cat in question.

And since that appears to be the case, if bait blocks are used, a person had best be careful which ones if they are concerned their pet may be eating the dead rodents they find.

Perhaps a product like this?

https://www.belllabs.com/bell-labs/product/us/pest-control/terad-sub-3-sub-blox

Works on rats and mice, yet has a low secondary risk to animals and birds.

 

[Compost King]

I do not recall the brand name of the rat poison, I went out to the storage shed to look but the packaging it came in was thrown away as I keep it in secure metal cans so nothing gets into it. Its treated as hazardous a material here. Its green pellets the size of dog food and probably would smell delicious to cats and chickens. Its likely the most common sold rat poison, I got it at True Value.

My cats do not eat mice at all because they are well fed. They eat rats because apparently rat meat is really good. despite being well fed I watched one of my cats catch and devour a rat instantly. Other animals he leaves for me at the carport. I used to feed the mice he caught to the chickens who love eating them but now I dispose of them because rat poison was deployed and I can't retrieve where I deployed it because I can't get to the location... only digging animals can to this location. This has me worried that eventually my cats will eat one of these digging animals, I partially regret using it now, but I am glad the rats are gone.

 

[aart]

Its treated as hazardous a material here.

So label/packaging should be kept with it....just sayin'

 

[Compost King]

I know the hazard, besides I can walk to true value and read the package if I need to its just a 1/4 mile away.

 

[aart]

I know the hazard, besides I can walk to true value and read the package if I need to its just a 1/4 mile away.

Yeah, but still...it's a good habit.

 

[Compost King]

true, its a good habit or organized people, and for disorganized people like me throwing away packaging after it is used is a good habit. I do save instructions that come inside of packaging if it requires me to make a purchase to read it again. If its on the outside packaging I use the hardware (or any) store as a library. Downside is that the library closes at night if I suddenly need to read something.