Debbie's Silkies

[janiedoe]

Sorry for the delayed response!

You are correct that Lavender x Buff would produce a black bird, likely with moderate to heavy buff leakage depending on the genes that the buff parent has. When a bird is 'split' to something, typically that's referring to a specific gene, not a full pattern. So Buff split to lavender just means that it's a Buff bird that carries the lavender gene, not that it has the genes to produce a solid Lavender coloration in its offspring. Such a bird could come from crossing Blue Cream to Buff.

Thank you!

 

[Debbie292d]

Shucks, I try my best anyway View attachment 3877705




Looking at that group picture of the chicks in post #844, genetically I see EWh and eb partridge, and the little black chick is most likely E or ER. The two-toned ones appear to be eb/eb, while the others look to me like they are either EWh/eb or EWh/EWh.

If that hasn't lost you entirely, a little bit of context: these are e-locus genes, the group of genes that generally determine the overall arrangement of pigment in the feathers.

In some breeds, Buff is based on EWh, sometimes with dominant white to disguise any black leaking through in the tail and wing feathers. EWh gives fairly even coloring, and it tends to give solid-colored chick down, usually yellowish to reddish, sometimes with spotting or slight striping on the head and back. Buff based on EWh tends to be more of a 'pure' buff color in adult plumage, that soft orange color all the way down the feather, maybe only getting a bit paler in the downy part of the feathering.

Some other breeds' Buff varieties are based on eb partridge, which tends to give them a richer orange color and they tend to have darker, blackish or grayish down feather coloring underneath their buff exterior feathering. This gene also makes the chicks sort of a deep brown to brown-orange color, hence the 'b' in eb, sometimes with striping or just a two-toned sort of appearance on the back as you've observed with some of yours. The ones colored like this are generally more likely to show black in the tail and wing feathers as adults, and potentially the neck feathers as well, depending on other genes at play that are not possible to predict at this stage.

Buff in general is a pretty genetically complex color, and that complexity is compounded by a few factors in Silkies, particularly that silkied feathering tends to hide or blur the expression of color leakage or other incorrect genes so that they are less obvious or sometimes not really visible at all in the adult plumage. Buff Silkies in particular tend to hide a lot of heterozygosity and random genes, from my understanding, which is why you can get such variance in the chick down coloring of Buff Silkie chicks as you're seeing.

So in other words, while there may be a variety of genetics in those chicks, it's entirely possible they'll still all feather out Buff (the exception being that black-colored baby, of course), just with varying shades of the color and potentially with black showing through in the wing and tail on some of them. I hope that helped some--and that it wasn't way more information than you cared to have dumped on you!

Wow, thank you. Yes, this was over my head a bit, especially the first paragraph with all of the letters.

I reread it twice. I'll be reading it again.

This will be so much easier when next spring I see what I've got and have you suggest who to breed to whom; then, we'd at least know the parents of what's hatched out.

I was after buffs from this breeder, but I know she sent others, just was at a loss as to what. I'm glad you think I have a bunch of buffs coming up here, even perhaps those darker red two-toned ones as I knew those had to change into something else. It'll be interesting!

Thank you so much for your insight!

 

[Nomadicus]

Blue Boy our blue satin rooster has a very strange crow now. He starts out like a normal rooster in tenor mode and near the end he has a Tarzan call that he finishes with. Got to get him on Video now. He's acting more like a ladies man every day.

 

[pipdzipdnreadytogo]

Wow, thank you. Yes, this was over my head a bit, especially the first paragraph with all of the letters.

I reread it twice. I'll be reading it again.

This will be so much easier when next spring I see what I've got and have you suggest who to breed to whom; then, we'd at least know the parents of what's hatched out.

I was after buffs from this breeder, but I know she sent others, just was at a loss as to what. I'm glad you think I have a bunch of buffs coming up here, even perhaps those darker red two-toned ones as I knew those had to change into something else. It'll be interesting!

Thank you so much for your insight!

Of course! Always glad to help if I can when it comes to genetics and identifying chicks!

Oh, if there's a possibility that other colors were included, then some of those chicks could very well be just that. Buff having a wide variety of expressions means that it can also resemble several other varieties, especially Red and sometimes White, so it's likely you could have some of those in the mix as well. Maybe some Partridge, too. But any of those chicks, other than the black one of course, could potentially feather out as Buff, too. You may just have to wait and see on them!

If you keep track of which ones have which chick down coloration, then if you do end up with many Buffs, you at least can group them up for breeding by the ones with similar genetics using that as a guideline. In theory that would mean getting more of the same kind of chicks as the parents were rather than a wide variety like this, but of course any potential heterozygosity (that is, them not being pure for genes and potentially hiding recessive ones) might still throw you some surprises no matter how carefully you plan it out!

 

[Debbie292d]

Of course! Always glad to help if I can when it comes to genetics and identifying chicks!

Oh, if there's a possibility that other colors were included, then some of those chicks could very well be just that. Buff having a wide variety of expressions means that it can also resemble several other varieties, especially Red and sometimes White, so it's likely you could have some of those in the mix as well. Maybe some Partridge, too. But any of those chicks, other than the black one of course, could potentially feather out as Buff, too. You may just have to wait and see on them!

If you keep track of which ones have which chick down coloration, then if you do end up with many Buffs, you at least can group them up for breeding by the ones with similar genetics using that as a guideline. In theory that would mean getting more of the same kind of chicks as the parents were rather than a wide variety like this, but of course any potential heterozygosity (that is, them not being pure for genes and potentially hiding recessive ones) might still throw you some surprises no matter how carefully you plan it out!

I have the tiny zip ties and shall put them to use before they change too much.

I already was excited about these, but you've made it even more interesting and intriguing!

 

[Slothinc]

Debbie, I’ve been away for a bit but just saw about your beautiful babies!! I am so glad you got some very beautiful looking buffs in there! And I had to laugh about them being so fluffy that a 3rd NN managed to appear for you. I am excited to see how these babies grow out!!!

 

[Debbie292d]

Debbie, I’ve been away for a bit but just saw about your beautiful babies!! I am so glad you got some very beautiful looking buffs in there! And I had to laugh about them being so fluffy that a 3rd NN managed to appear for you. I am excited to see how these babies grow out!!!

Thank you!

Yes, that was my surprise after looking them over a bit, voila, now we have 3 NN's. Ah, well, I will grow these all out to when I can see what they are and can sex them. If those NN's are cockerels, I'll find good homes for them. If pullets, I'll have to see when the time comes. These sure are awesome though! Thanks for the tip! If I need anything in the spring, I'd go back to her again.

 

[RememberTheWay]

Curious at what stage of grow out are you guys able to evaluate for overall body type? I have some birds I need to sort through that were hatched in March/April and was wondering if I could do evaluations on them now or if I really should wait longer?

 

[Debbie292d]

Curious at what stage of grow out are you guys able to evaluate for overall body type? I have some birds I need to sort through that were hatched in March/April and was wondering if I could do evaluations on them now or if I really should wait longer?

About 4 months old for me. That's when I pretty much know what they are and what they're going to be. They still have some growing to do, and more coloring could come out on them yet, but that's about the age I can be sure.

 

[2ndTink]

About 4 months old for me. That's when I pretty much know what they are and what they're going to be. They still have some growing to do, and more coloring could come out on them yet, but that's about the age I can be sure.

Same, at 16 weeks you get a good idea. They can keep filing in, wings may molt out better or worse that fall, but it depends on what your goal is too.