Deerhen Project

[E flowers]

Ok I'm trying to recreate the white pattern red wheaten on the calculator and for some reason I can't get back to it. What am I doing wrong? I typed in Rhode island red and wheaten maran getting this.

The offspring are just black pattern red duckwing.

 

[E flowers]

The offspring are just black pattern red duckwing.

Nevermind I figured out how I did it again! I did wheaten maran (BPG/Wh) roo x white pattern red columbian(E^wh/E^wh) which made a white pattern red incomplete columbian and bred back to the wheaten maran roo giving me a 1/16 chance to get the white pattern red wheaten.
Once I have a white pattern red wheaten pair F1 (most likely siblings). I breed them to each other and get my F2 with 9/32 chance. Then I breed those F2 siblings to get the WPR/Wh F3 with a 50-50 chance!

 

[E flowers]

Nevermind I figured out how I did it again! I did wheaten maran (BPG/Wh) roo x white pattern red columbian(E^wh/E^wh) which made a white pattern red incomplete columbian and bred back to the wheaten maran roo giving me a 1/16 chance to get the white pattern red wheaten.
Once I have a white pattern red wheaten pair F1 (most likely siblings). I breed them to each other and get my F2 with 9/32 chance. Then I breed those F2 siblings to get the WPR/Wh F3 with a 50-50 chance!

Is the wheaten maran rooster black pattern gold wheaten or black pattern red and does that matter?

 

[NatJ]

Is the wheaten maran rooster black pattern gold wheaten or black pattern red and does that matter?

Gold or red probably does not matter much, but he does need to be wheaten and not duckwing. The roosters look alike, at least until you add other genes that affect the pattern, but the hens look different.

 

[NatJ]

Would RIR x cubalaya x white leghorn work?

Probably yes.

I would probably cross White Leghorn hen with either RIR rooster or Cubalaya rooster, then cross daughters to the other of those roosters. That gets rid of all the sex-linked genes from the Leghorn (probably Silver and maybe barring), and should give you about 1 in 4 chicks showing white patterned red something, with variations in the "something." Another 1 in 4 chick should show black patterened red (something), with the other half of chicks being either black or white.

 

[Klutch]

Can't you throw some Isa Browns into the mix?

 

[E flowers]

Probably yes.

I would probably cross White Leghorn hen with either RIR rooster or Cubalaya rooster, then cross daughters to the other of those roosters. That gets rid of all the sex-linked genes from the Leghorn (probably Silver and maybe barring), and should give you about 1 in 4 chicks showing white patterned red something, with variations in the "something." Another 1 in 4 chick should show black patterened red (something), with the other half of chicks being either black or white.

So like RIR roo x WL hen. Then cross the offspring with a cubalaya roo. Then take the white pattern red "Something" F1 roos and hens and breed those to get F2 and so on?

 

[NatJ]

So like RIR roo x WL hen. Then cross the offspring with a cubalaya roo. Then take the white pattern red "Something" F1 roos and hens and breed those to get F2 and so on?

Yes, that's what I was thinking.

 

[E flowers]

Yes, I think that is pretty much what I meant.

Have you played with the Chicken Calculator at all?
http://kippenjungle.nl/chickencalculator.html

You can change the genes in the dropdown boxes, and the picture of the chicken will change. It can also predict results from crossing the chickens, but I don't use that feature as much.

The default genes in each box are marked with +
This means they are the wild-type genes, found in the original wild junglefowl ancestors of chickens.

Those default settings are pretty much the ones that a Welsummer would have.

For White Leghorns, the first box changes to E/E
That is "Extended Black," which spreads black all over the chicken.

And White Leghorns have I/I instead of i+/i+
That is Dominant White, which changes black to white (I think the "I" is because it "inhibits" black.)

Because E and I are both dominant genes, the first generation of crossed chicks will show both of those traits (black all over, with the black turned to white.)

The next generation is when you get chicks of types 1,2,3,4 in the chart you drew. 1 is chicks who inherited both E and I, 2 have E with i+, 3 have e+ with i+, and 4 have e+ with I (the combination you want.)

There are some other genes that White Leghorns usually have that are different than Welsummers, but the main ones should be eliminated if you start with a Welsummer rooster and a White Leghorn hen, then use just the daughters from that cross to breed with more Welsummers.

That is because of how the sex chromosomes work in birds: Males have ZZ, with one Z inherited from each parent and one Z given to each chick. Females have ZW, with Z inherited from the father and given to each son, while W is inherited from the mother and given to each daughter.

Among the known genes on the Z sex chromosome, the Welsummers have all the ones you want. The mixed daughters inherit a Z chromosome from their Welsummer father and a W chromosome from their Leghorn mother, so the only Z chromosome they have is the one you want (the one that originated with the Welsummer rooster.)

What is the combination for the Welsummer rooster?

 

[NatJ]

What is the combination for the Welsummer rooster?

That was buried among things in the response you quoted:

The default genes in each box are marked with +
This means they are the wild-type genes, found in the original wild junglefowl ancestors of chickens.

Those default settings are pretty much the ones that a Welsummer would have.

So just figure that the Welsummer has all the genes marked with a + and none of the others.