Developing My Own Breed Of Large Gamefowl For Free Range Survival (Junglefowl x Liege)

[Bigtom Turkey]

They look great!

 

[FeatherTay]

I'm creating this thread as a journal for a breeding project I've been planning for some time. I would like to take my small junglefowl hybrids that I've been raising for the last year and a half and increase their size and attitude substantially. They've already proven themselves to be great survivors in the predator-dense Florida woods. But they're very small and their practical use for meat and eggs is limited. Not totally non-existant, but not ideal. I'd like to have a larger version that's three times the size and has some more anti-predator fire. A bird that can respond to a predator in other ways besides simply being agile and avoiding being caught. To some degree, this bird already exists in the American gamefowl (albeit not as large as I'm imagining). But I want to utilize my junglefowl which have proven their hardiness. I've been compiling genetic materials over the past year and refining my junglefowl. Here's where' I'm starting:

1. My junglefowl hybrids. Their info is located in this thread:
https://www.backyardchickens.com/th...ngle-fowl-in-the-american-deep-south.1309995/

Here is my chosen bullstag to sire my F1s:

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I have many junglefowl hybrid stags, but this one is my favorite that has survived two major rounds of culling. He has an athletic build and good feathering and so far I like his attitude. Human aggression was a problem in my first generation birds that I've seemed to have purged from the next generation. Of course only further generations will tell for sure. I call this bullstag "Number 1" because of a picture in which I labeled him "1" of several stags.

2. The Liege. I obtained 3 quality Liege pullets just recently. Originally I was going to avoid using the Liege in my project, but I've been so impressed with them I think they'll suit my purposes fine for my F1s. I actually wasn't expecting to find Liege on a farm near me, but low and behold I was surprised. Big thanks to hydlemour and Didby57. I don't yet have good pictures of the pullets, but this afternoon I took a quick video of one of the pullets right after a rainstorm in the breeding coop I'm going to keep them with until I get a hatch from them and Number 1.

I want to see how much of the JF traits will pass on to the F1s. So far the JF traits seem to dominate anything I cross them to, including leghorns, Wyandottes, and OEGB. The Wyandotte cross I have running around is the first one I've produced that involved breeding the JF to something other than a straight comb. I presume that I'm going to lose the straight comb on these F1s, but I suppose that also depends on what is floating around in the background of the Liege.

I have aseel on my farm I'm keeping in my back pocket in case I need to breed more fire into them, but I also understand that may introduce a whole slew of other traits I may not want. My brother is going to undertake a project crossing aseel to both Liege and the JF, so we'll compare notes on our F1s to see what we like best. My original plan was to use the aseel for my F1s to the JF, but my choosen strain of aseel isn't showing the size I want. I'm guessing the aseel I have are going to top out around 5lbs at the most. I also have access to some straight Americans if I decide the next gen needs them.

I'm thinking to get the look somewhat close to what I want, its going to take junglefowl x Liege, then Junglefowl x F1. I should get some straight combs on the next gen. It will depend on how much size will be sacrificed on the next gen of crosses. Of course, if I like the F1s right off the bat, I'll formulate a plan to lock the traits in.

I'd love for my final bird to look mostly like my JF hybrids just much bigger. But I also want a functional bird first and foremost so selection for appearance is secondary. A definite must is for my final bird to be able to launch itself high up into a tree to roost. I basically want the final bird to do anything a wild turkey can. I have a few JF stags with abnormally large wings I may have to cross in. I can see a definite difference in vertical take off between the birds with very large wings and those with normal wings. All of them can fly up to roost fine but the big winged birds can shoot straight up into a large pine to the branches of their choosing in the first flight. That's going to take bigger wings on the Liege and also shaving a few pounds off.

The bullstag to sire your F1’s looks exactly like my ayam ketawa cockerel. Is that not what he is?

 

[Florida Bullfrog]

The bullstag to sire your F1’s looks exactly like my ayam ketawa cockerel. Is that not what he is?

No, he is a junglefowl/gamefowl hybrid I call a Cracker gamefowl. Up to this point he hasn’t sired any of these experimental birds. I have two concurrent large gamefowl projects going and the only one that I’ve actually got chicks off of is the aseel to the Liege. This fall I hope to put the Cracker cock (he’s grown now) over large bodied Blueface American games and a big Blueface stag I have over my best Cracker hens. Then I may put the Cracker over the Liege. But I think the way I have it set up now are the best matches for the genetics I have access to.

 

[SunflowerKing]

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I've got the Aseel x Liege free ranging. They seem to be thriving. I originally put them behind an electric fence and they simply flew right over it. They're strong flyers and good foragers. So far I am impressed.

These birds look incredible. Your Youtube videos have inspired me and changed my way of thinking when it comes to free range chickens on the homestead. Thank you, God Bless you!

I was wondering if you had an estimation of what the weight and size of these birds will be at the end of their maturation? Thanks again.

 

[Florida Bullfrog]

These birds look incredible. Your Youtube videos have inspired me and changed my way of thinking when it comes to free range chickens on the homestead. Thank you, God Bless you!

I was wondering if you had an estimation of what the weight and size of these birds will be at the end of their maturation? Thanks again.

I don’t yet have an estimate as to where they will end up. Both parent breeds are slow to mature. However these are maturing fast in terms of developing sexual characteristics. Faster than I remember the pure aseel maturing. I think they will easily surpass the size of the aseel. The pullets already are larger than the grown aseel hen was. How much larger they will be, I do not know. They seem like they are growing by the day.

 

[SunflowerKing]

I don’t yet have an estimate as to where they will end up. Both parent breeds are slow to mature. However these are maturing fast in terms of developing sexual characteristics. Faster than I remember the pure aseel maturing. I think they will easily surpass the size of the aseel. The pullets already are larger than the grown aseel hen was. How much larger they will be, I do not know. They seem like they are growing by the day.

Excellent! I am very interested in seeing this breed continue and perhaps interested in buying into the final product. I think that your ideas could really revolutionize/revitalize the market. Stick with it!

Would breeding with a black jersey giant destroy the "survival" characteristics of this bird? It was a passing thought I had. Jersey giants appear to be very broody and could potentially add to a self-replicating meat bird system with larger genetics? Also, from what I have read black is the best color for chickens to scare hawks because they might be mistaken for crows.


If I was to create a breed I would try to create a large, self-replicating, meat bird that deters predators... which is essentially an idea you gave me. Thanks, God Bless! Christ is LORD!

 

[Florida Bullfrog]

Excellent! I am very interested in seeing this breed continue and perhaps interested in buying into the final product. I think that your ideas could really revolutionize/revitalize the market. Stick with it!

Would breeding with a black jersey giant destroy the "survival" characteristics of this bird? It was a passing thought I had. Jersey giants appear to be very broody and could potentially add to a self-replicating meat bird system with larger genetics? Also, from what I have read black is the best color for chickens to scare hawks because they might be mistaken for crows.


If I was to create a breed I would try to create a large, self-replicating, meat bird that deters predators... which is essentially an idea you gave me. Thanks, God Bless! Christ is LORD!

The Jersey Giant was my original choice for this project to cross to my Crackers. I originally didn’t know the Liege existed, and when I learned about the Liege I didn’t think I was going to realistically have access to them. Thus when I got ahold of some Liege I changed my plans.

The Liege do not go broody that I have seen, so if the Jersey giants do that would be a plus. I am hoping the broodiness of the aseel has passed to my hybrids.

 

[SunflowerKing]

The Jersey Giant was my original choice for this project to cross to my Crackers. I originally didn’t know the Liege existed, and when I learned about the Liege I didn’t think I was going to realistically have access to them. Thus when I got ahold of some Liege I changed my plans.

The Liege do not go broody that I have seen, so if the Jersey giants do that would be a plus. I am hoping the broodiness of the aseel has passed to my hybrids.

I think the liege was a happy accident then! Id happily donate to you so you could get some black jersey giants also and take the experiment further? So long as you make more videos documenting this particular breeding experiment. Do you have any interest in this?

I have to think that eventually this current cross plus a black jersey giant may yield results. Id be happy in donating 100$ just to see this come to fruition. I wish I could do this myself but I am still a year from being able to move to a more rural setting due to work circumstances.

 

[SunflowerKing]

The Jersey Giant was my original choice for this project to cross to my Crackers. I originally didn’t know the Liege existed, and when I learned about the Liege I didn’t think I was going to realistically have access to them. Thus when I got ahold of some Liege I changed my plans.

The Liege do not go broody that I have seen, so if the Jersey giants do that would be a plus. I am hoping the broodiness of the aseel has passed to my hybrids.

the goal would be to find specifically broody black jersey giants.

Here is someone giving testimony at their broody tendencies... https://www.self-reliance.com/2017/08/jersey-giants-the-triple-purpose-chicken/

 

[Florida Bullfrog]

I appreciate the offer, but I make enough when I sell hatching eggs off the Crackers to cover my costs. If these projects don't bear the fruit I want then I'll try some JGs.

I forgot to mention that concerning black, I don't necessarily believe it repels predators. But I do believe that mottled black has a camouflage advatange in the woods of the Southeast. This was somewhat proven by the creation of the Carolina bantam. I have personally noticed that birds that are mostly black with light spots mixed throughout blend into the dark hardwoods here better than natural junglefowl colors.