Diarrhoea - not worms

[Bamabexchicks]

Having bathed Betty in warm water with Epsom Salts, she seemed to enjoy being cleaned. She is a bit more lively, scratching for food and re-establishing her pecking order. I put Canestan on her rear and a little in the vent opening, as we did with Nella a few years ago.

Plan is now to clean her daily and apply the cream (not sure if it's called the same elsewhere but it is an antifungal cream mainly used for treating thrush).

Fingers crossed. Will do both her and Scarlett tomorrow. Only had time to do one of them today as I had to go to work. But, overall, despite it only being done today, there looks to be improvement in her overall wellness.

By the way, I googled pictures of vent gleet. The pictures were exactly what she looks like.

Good going! Hope you see improvement on all counts!

 

[MandS]

Quick update.

She is not herself and lethargic for varying chunks of the day, but she is eating and scratching around. We cleaned her yesterday and today her backside was better with less poop on fewer rear feathers, but it was still there. So another clean and more Canestan. Her skin is quite red and irritated. Not broken skin but clearly red and splotchy.

Also, the vet called me last night to say the Baytril had arrived. I said that, having sought advice on here - and also hearing that not only in the UK but in the US as well, it is not licenced for laying hens )ie you can't eat the eggs after), I told we were not going for it. I also said that I thought (as I had done when I went in with Scarlett) that it was vent gleet. He then asked "what is that?" Now I don't think he's not a great vet, because he is, but he hadn't heard of it, which explains why he dismissed my suggestion of Canestan over a week ago and put Scarlett on antibiotics (which haven't done a thing other than mean we cannot eat her eggs for a fortnight). But he thanked me and said that it had given him something to research. Once again, I am not criticising him or doubting his ability, he has been marvellous to us and our girls for years, even operating on them from time to time. In British terms, "A good bloke".

Finally, just a quick question. Does vent gleet make some birds feel under the weather? Scarlett couldn't care less, whereas Betty is definitely not herself.

 

[Bamabexchicks]

Quick update.

She is not herself and lethargic for varying chunks of the day, but she is eating and scratching around. We cleaned her yesterday and today her backside was better with less poop on fewer rear feathers, but it was still there. So another clean and more Canestan. Her skin is quite red and irritated. Not broken skin but clearly red and splotchy.

Also, the vet called me last night to say the Baytril had arrived. I said that, having sought advice on here - and also hearing that not only in the UK but in the US as well, it is not licenced for laying hens )ie you can't eat the eggs after), I told we were not going for it. I also said that I thought (as I had done when I went in with Scarlett) that it was vent gleet. He then asked "what is that?" Now I don't think he's not a great vet, because he is, but he hadn't heard of it, which explains why he dismissed my suggestion of Canestan over a week ago and put Scarlett on antibiotics (which haven't done a thing other than mean we cannot eat her eggs for a fortnight). But he thanked me and said that it had given him something to research. Once again, I am not criticising him or doubting his ability, he has been marvellous to us and our girls for years, even operating on them from time to time. In British terms, "A good bloke".

Finally, just a quick question. Does vent gleet make some birds feel under the weather? Scarlett couldn't care less, whereas Betty is definitely not herself.

Here is a very informative article on vent gleet.
https://www.birdhealth.com.au/vent-gleet

 

[MandS]

Thanks. Interesting. The article is pretty bleak in some ways and also suggests that antibiotics are used. I will persevere with the anti-fungal approach (no roo present) and treat individual birds. In our case the antibiotics haven't made a scrap of difference, whereas the Canestan seems to be reducing it a bit at a time. I guess I can re-assess that tomorrow when I clean the two of them again.

It is interesting that it talks about posture and apparent wellness. As I mentioned, one couldn't care less and lays every day as normal, but the other is an unhappy bird. Thanks for providing the link. This is a bit of a learning journey.

 

[Eggcessive]

If I were you, I would get the Baytril whether you use it or not. It is a great antibiotic for internal laying and salpingitis in chickens. Yes, there is an egg withdrawal, but many people use the eggs after about 2 weeks. She may well have a fungal infection or candida albicans (your vet might be more familiar with that term,) but if she has a reproductive problem, the Baytril may help. You can still use the canestan, which is similar to nystatin or medicatatin here in the US.

 

[cottagecheese]

OP, your vet is pure gold if he can admit to his mistakes... (Just an attempt at humor, ignore if it's not funny, but there is a kernel of truth in this joke.) That article is really something, it shows up high on google and it is where I got the hint about metronidazole . It starts out really well, explaining the stress factor, going into details, but then takes a strange turn recommending 'blanket' antibiotics . What about those with a fungal infection, aren't antibiotics yeast's best friends? Or parents in some cases. And then OMG 'cull if they don't respond to treatment'. Without even giving them a chance...

 

[Ebony Rose]

...Does vent gleet make some birds feel under the weather? Scarlett couldn't care less, whereas Betty is definitely not herself.

Could be.

Years ago, when I had this problem with my flock, I had to buy over the counter medicine at the pharmacy for *coughs* human female itching and odor, looking specifically for products that contained metronidazole. I had a rooster in the flock, so all them, not just the 'one' suffering were treated. Since this is in effect an STD, or can be, I treated them all; no Pass-Around-Patty goin' on around here!
Getting medicine at the feed store is limited here in Panama, and diagnosing a disease at the vet (if you can find one that will even look at a chicken) is a guessing game at best. As we all know, for example, respiratory infections in chickens can be of many many varieties... yet taking a bird to the vet here with a respiratory infection gets you a diagnosis of "moco"... period. No distinction to WHAT type of respiratory infection, absolutely NO clarification. "moco" means mucus. After paying my left arm for the vet fees, it sure would be nice to get a real diagnosis... I mean... telling me that my bird is sick and has mucus is the same as telling me nothing I already didn't know.
By the way, I don't bother with the vet here anymore; I come straight to BYC.
I've also learned to research what human medicines are equivalent to the needed avian medicines out of necessity, as the vet & feed stores often won't carry what I really need, or offer it for ten times the price of the same stuff at the pharmacy.

Sure hope your girls get to feeling better pronto!

 

[MandS]

Again, thank every one of you for your comments and advice. Seriously, this site is essential for any chicken owner.

I suppose it is panic that kicks in. I thought it was vent gleet but before we've never had a bird that was so ill looking. So I went to the vet because I truly believe that if you have pets (and our girls are pets) then it is your responsibility to do something about it because they can't. It's why I run to the vet occasionally because I feel out of my depth.

I think the Byatril advice is good. When I lost Honey last year, we had umpteen visits and she had quite severe ascites at the end, needing to be drained about every fortnight. But I guess it was a reproductive disorder originally which is why he suggested a long term under the skin contraceptive. Sadly she died and that hit me hard. I had tried everything and, thank God we were financially able, we didn't stint on vetinarian help. But Baytril may have helped. I know we will never know that but it is a good piece of advice to have. The situation at the moment, and why I have declined Baytril, was the suggestion we gave it to the whole flock - with something legal I had to sign to say we would never eat their eggs again. That didn't make sense and actually having chickens that you have to throw away every egg they have laboured to produce is in itself utterly senseless.

Thanks again to you all. You are a great bunch of folks on here.

 

[Eggcessive]

I would never give Baytril or any other antibiotic to the whole flock. But having a bottle of Baytril around when you cannot see a vet is handy. I do not use antibiotics much at all on chickens or other animals. I do recommend the best one for the bacteria that someone might need if they ask about one. People overuse antibiotics without knowing what is wrong.

Many hens suffer from the vague symptoms of reproductive disorders—poor appetite, runny poops, weight loss, possibly an enlarged lower abdomen, sometimes waddling or preferring to sit, and separating themselves. If my hen does that, I try to get them eating, check the crop to see if it is emptying normally, but I don’t use an antibiotic. It is usually too late when you see symptoms. But I do necropsies to look for what went wrong.

 

[MandS]

Another day....

Both Scarlett and Betty have much cleaner backsides. Betty was all fluffy and clean again with just a small trace of poop around her vent. Both of them seemed to have less irritated skin. Betty also a lot happier. So it is looking quite positive at the moment.

Flick on the other hand (who does not have vent gleet - or at least any signs of it) is not eating again. Have even tempted her with blueberries and she turned her nose up. Don't know what to do, so gave her a shot of chicken vitamins and will do so for another two days to see if she picks up. 2 days ago she was eating and had a fairly full crop. Today it is basically empty at the end of the day. This is one area I am stumped.