Diary & Notes ~ Air Cell Detatched SHIPPED Chicken Eggs for incubation and hatching

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How often should they be turned? Sorry Total Newb!!
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Dont be sorry! LOL Have you had a look at the hatching 101 article? I have used every bit of info in that article so far! below is a paste from it, and will explain turning and why!
https://www.backyardchickens.com/a/hatching-eggs-101



Setting Eggs & Turning
It is important to ALWAYS wash your hands before handling your hatching eggs!
It is likewise important to SANITIZE your incubator AND equipment before AND after use!

Omphalitis, yolk sack infection is caused by a bacterium that enters through the porous egg shell and easily kills embryo's and newly hatched chicks. Unfortunately, incubation conditions are ideal for breeding bacteria as well as incubating eggs.

Only add room temperature eggs to your incubator to prevent SWEATING. Sweating/Condensation weakens the egg's natural defense mechanisms, providing an ideal environment for the growth of bacteria and penetrated through the shell pores and kill the embryo. Eggs can be laid on their sides or placed in turning tray with pointed end down/big air cell end up. For shipped eggs, please refer to SHIPPED EGGS section of this article.

Mark eggs, using a pencil, with an X on one side and an O on the other.
Make sure to turn the eggs at least 3 times a day, 5-7 it is best to turn the eggs for an odd number of times each day (i.e., 3, 5 or 7 times). The longest period that the egg remains in one position is during the night hours. Turning an odd number of times will alternate the nights that the same side of the egg is uppermostTurning by hand they should always be turned an odd amount of times and move them to a different part of the tray to protect them from temperature variation. You basically roll the eggs with your fingers/palm from X to O.


Turning the egg prevents the embryo from touching and attaching to the membrane inside the egg which could cause abnormal growth. The most convenient way to turn eggs is to purchase an egg turner. This also helps you to maintain a consistent humidity, since your incubator does not have to be opened the recommended 5-7 times for hand turning eggs. If the eggs are not placed on their sides, they should be placed at an angle so the small ends are in the downward position. Setting upright/vertical and then day 18 laying horizontal for actual hatching helps a chick hatch 1-2 hours earlier. Take extra precautions when turning eggs during the first week of incubation. The developing embryos have delicate blood vessels that rupture easily when severely jarred or shaken, thus killing the embryo.

When adding Eggs the temperature will immediately drop. DO NOT ADJUST THE THERMOSTAT, or risk accidentally cooking them. Wait 2/4 hours and if the temperature is still low, make a small adjustment, as small as you can. (Note: Small adjustments on the manual Styrofoam incubators make BIG changes!)



A Critical Period for the Turning of Hens' Eggs
http://dev.biologists.org/content/5/3/293.full.pdf
During incubation we try to mimic the natural conditions in the nest. Egg turning prevents adhesion of the embryo to the inner shell membrane. It stimulates the rate of development of the area vasculosa (the membrane which grows around the yolk and is rich in blood vessels). The area vasculosa is important for sub-embryonic fluid formation, as well as for yolk uptake later in incubation. It allows normal transfer of albumen proteins into the amniotic fluid, promoting optimum use of the albumen. It supports the growth of the chorio-allantois (the blood vessels right under the shell) to maximize oxygen absorption.
Embryos in unturned eggs grow at a lower rate compared to embryos in eggs turned each hour over 90˚. It facilitates movements of the embryo into the normal hatching position and reduces the incidence of malpositions in unhatched embryos.
Advice

Check the turning device before the start of each incubation cycle, as turning failures, depending on the moment of occurrence, are detrimental to results. Check and maintain the turning device regularly, to prevent a breakdown during incubation. http://ps.fass.org/content/85/8/1433.full
 

A Critical Period for the Turning of Hens' Eggs
http://dev.biologists.org/content/5/3/293.full.pdf
During incubation we try to mimic the natural conditions in the nest. Egg turning prevents adhesion of the embryo to the inner shell membrane. It stimulates the rate of development of the area vasculosa (the membrane which grows around the yolk and is rich in blood vessels). The area vasculosa is important for sub-embryonic fluid formation, as well as for yolk uptake later in incubation. It allows normal transfer of albumen proteins into the amniotic fluid, promoting optimum use of the albumen. It supports the growth of the chorio-allantois (the blood vessels right under the shell) to maximize oxygen absorption.
Embryos in unturned eggs grow at a lower rate compared to embryos in eggs turned each hour over 90˚. It facilitates movements of the embryo into the normal hatching position and reduces the incidence of malpositions in unhatched embryos.



So, with shipped eggs we dont turn during the most critical time. how many of those chicks that need assisting or fail to progress after pipping do you think are stuck to the shell?

just a thought.
 
Quote: You know this has crossed my mind many times, HOWEVER, it seems that I dont see many quiters to be honest. perhaps they are too early death to even notice? I do crack every clear egg open and dont see even a tiny ring of death at day 10.

If I have a live embryo at day 7 I typically have it go to lockdown. There are very few quiters and if I do get one its from a very dirty egg. I have tried turning gentlty in cartons as well as NOT turning and my conclusion REGARDLESS of what a few people say is that if its a rolling air cell (end to end) its shot and couldl weep, stink or remain clear. A loose air cell will do one of two things...

reattach awkwardly to be saddle weird shaped and hatch if fertile

or

it will be UNVIABLE if you candled and the liquid looks sorta thick and blobby at the air cell line

My conclusion is that if you keep it upright it can have a possiblity of reatachment and NOT get all blobby on you, however knowing the details inside the egg as seen below and how delicate some of those internal chalaza are its a miracle we get any to hatch! And I am starting to believe it already has a fate BEFORE you set them! So I choose to not turn for 48 hrs and take my chances of the two evils! Hope I made some sense???????


UNDERSTANDING what goes WRONG with SHIPPED EGGS
The yolk of an egg is held in place on each end by what is called Chalaza. These are delicate cords that keep the yolk centered in the egg. When you crack open an egg, you notice a white stringy thing on the yolk, this is the Chalaza. When eggs are shipped they encounter postal handlers that toss the packages, sorting machinery, bumpy vehicle rides, temperature changes and possibly X-ray Machines! So by the time the eggs get to you they are pretty much scrambled inside. So if you are going to buy eggs and have them shipped to you, be aware that the viability drops TREMENDOUSLY. There are rare instances when they ALL arrive safely but it is always a gamble.




http://www.geauga4h.org/poultry/egg_parts.htm
 
Hey Sally, with the information above, what should I do if the air cell never reattached? It's not rolling, but it moves side to side. I let the egg settle for 48 hours and then I didn't turn it for the first 24 hours of incubation. Now I'm turning normally, 180 dgerees and the air cell moves each time. By the way, I'm talking about my sebastopol goose egg.
 
Hey Sally, with the information above, what should I do if the air cell never reattached? It's not rolling, but it moves side to side. I let the egg settle for 48 hours and then I didn't turn it for the first 24 hours of incubation. Now I'm turning normally, 180 dgerees and the air cell moves each time. By the way, I'm talking about my sebastopol goose egg.
it rolls?
 
Morning of day 22....still no other pips or peeps.Is that pretty normal?
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Hopefully I get a couple more or my little lone chick will be lonely. The one with the cracked shell still looks the same.
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