Disregarding Local Chicken Laws

[dainerra]

Illegally makes us all sound like criminals. Its not much different than having 3 dogs when the limit is 2. And people walk around with multiple dogs all the time!

well, technically speaking it DOES make you a criminal since a person who breaks law is committing a crime. It's really no different than a speeder who is "only 5-10 mph over" or the guy who only has "1 drink to unwind" Do you know what happens to the person who gets caught with 3 dogs instead of only 2? The county comes in and confiscates the dog. It goes to the pound and if it doesn't get a new home within 2-3 days it's killed.
For me, it's not something I could ever do because, frankly, I get caught every time I even think about doing something wrong. And then what happens to you? Stress and fines and going to court. And then, after you've exhausted your resources, what of your birds? They aren't pets to anyone else and if they get confiscated they are more likely to end up on someone's dinner table than in a cozy backyard coop. Or even in the best case scenario, living in conditions that many here wouldn't approve of. And, if you have kids? what of them? Do you want to sit the example that it's ok to follow only the rules that you agree with? Remember that example you've set the next time they wander home 2 hours after curfew with no phone call to let you know they were safe. After all, they are just breaking an "unfair rule" just like you.

Not picking on Jenny, she just made the statement above. But I know a lot of people who seem to think that it's ok to bend the rules when it goes against something "harmless" that they want to do.

 

[chickortreat]

well, technically speaking it DOES make you a criminal since a person who breaks law is committing a crime. It's really no different than a speeder who is "only 5-10 mph over" or the guy who only has "1 drink to unwind" Do you know what happens to the person who gets caught with 3 dogs instead of only 2? The county comes in and confiscates the dog. It goes to the pound and if it doesn't get a new home within 2-3 days it's killed.
For me, it's not something I could ever do because, frankly, I get caught every time I even think about doing something wrong. And then what happens to you? Stress and fines and going to court. And then, after you've exhausted your resources, what of your birds? They aren't pets to anyone else and if they get confiscated they are more likely to end up on someone's dinner table than in a cozy backyard coop. Or even in the best case scenario, living in conditions that many here wouldn't approve of. And, if you have kids? what of them? Do you want to sit the example that it's ok to follow only the rules that you agree with? Remember that example you've set the next time they wander home 2 hours after curfew with no phone call to let you know they were safe. After all, they are just breaking an "unfair rule" just like you.

Not picking on Jenny, she just made the statement above. But I know a lot of people who seem to think that it's ok to bend the rules when it goes against something "harmless" that they want to do.

If you cannot discern between a "criminal" and someone who does not bow to every ridiculous ordinance passed by some willy-nilly town council, then there's not much use in having this discussion. You really classify someone who does not wear his/her seatbelt with a violent offender?

As to kids, I teach my children to think for themselves.

Take, for example, the Marine sergeant who was discharged because he said he would not obey an un-Constitutional order. Why discharge him? EVERY man in uniform should feel the same way. Oh I've heard the arguments.....soldiers are to obey orders, not judge the orders. Funny how folks don't think too highly of Hitler's SS troops for "obeying orders", ain't it?

Laws/rules/regulations/orders are not always what they seem.

 

[20736]

OK, I have chickens in my backyard. Have had turkeys (still do), ducks, geese as well.
In my rural county we have mixed zoning. Some of us can have birds; some can't. I can.
I have had experience helping friends avoid "imperial entanglements."
The bird owner has to be smart about it, and know how the system works. That's all.
Most animal control agencies are understaffed and overworked.
It pays to be smart.
I wish everybody had hens. It would be a better world,eh.

 

[chickortreat]

OK, I have chickens in my backyard. Have had turkeys (still do), ducks, geese as well.
In my rural county we have mixed zoning. Some of us can have birds; some can't. I can.
I have had experience helping friends avoid "imperial entanglements."
The bird owner has to be smart about it, and know how the system works. That's all.
Most animal control agencies are understaffed and overworked.
It pays to be smart.
I wish everybody had hens. It would be a better world,eh.

More hens and less politicians/busybodies.........sounds Utopian, eh?

 

[dainerra]

If you cannot discern between a "criminal" and someone who does not bow to every ridiculous ordinance passed by some willy-nilly town council, then there's not much use in having this discussion. You really classify someone who does not wear his/her seatbelt with a violent offender?

then go to that town council and have them changed. The title of this section is ".... how to change them" not "how to avoid getting caught and just do as you please"

Not a violent offender if you don't wear your seat belt. But neither is the guy who embezzles $10,000 from his company. Or any of a thousand other things that are illegal - if they aren't killing or maiming your neighbors we should all be free to do as we please?

When we shop for houses (or anything really) WE decide where to spend our money. We decide which local government is going to be supported with our tax dollars and what shop owners will get our business. So do your homework. Want chickens? Find a home in a community where chicken-keeping is legal. You already own a home and learned about the joy of keeping chickens but it isn't allowed? Go to the council and get the law changed - there is a ton of info right here in this forum on how to do it.. Shoot, get yourself elected to the council and have an even bigger voice.

By your arguments, the police shouldn't go tell my neighbor to turn off his booming stereo at 2am on a Wednesday night. After all, he isn't hurting anyone else; the neighbors who actually have jobs to get up for just need to deal. And so what if he is high as a kite - he's sitting in his own living room; he's not hurting anyone.

 

[chickortreat]

The fact that you quoted only the first paragraph leads me to believe that you understand more than you let on.

I believe that as long as a person does not infringe on the rights of others, he can pretty much do as he pleases. I'd rather live next door to someone who is "high as a kite", as you put it, that minds his own business, than next door to a deacon that can't keep his nose out of other folks' business. But that's just me.

Loud music at 2 AM.....that's infringing on others. Embezzling.......also infringing. Owning 8 chickens when only 4 are allotted.....sadly, this falls short of a felony in my opinion. Somehow, I don't think Alcatraz was built with illegal chicken owners and folks who don't wear their seat belts in mind, whether you can discern between them all or not.

 

[Jenny1]

The law in Phoenix where I live is that I have to ask my neighbors permission if they live within a certain number of feet of the coop. I can have hens, if I ask my neighbors. So, what if a new neighbor moves in? WHat if I position the coop exactly 50 feet from both neighbors? Etc. Truth is: I didnt ask. Because really, they could change thier minds later and call. It really wont make a difference. I think this is something that needs to be done wth thought and respect. The letter of the law versus the spirit of the law

 

[mistyt14]

They just passed the law here that we can have 6 hens, and have to pay a fee of $25 a year for a licence. i was given 4 hens right now they are at my mom's on the ranch till we get the coop built and ready. I have one neighbor that is against it, they live across the street next to the house where the cops are always at. I hate to tell her my chickens will be a lot quieter than that plus she can't see them from her house

 

[dainerra]

Loud music at 2 AM.....that's infringing on others. Embezzling.......also infringing. Owning 8 chickens when only 4 are allotted.....sadly, this falls short of a felony in my opinion. Somehow, I don't think Alcatraz was built with illegal chicken owners and folks who don't wear their seat belts in mind, whether you can discern between them all or not.

what about the fact that your neighbors chose to live in a place that doesn't allow chickens because they don't want to live near someone who owns them? They don't want to hear hens cackling or roosters crowing. They spent a LOT of money to buy a home and I would bet that they consider a neighbor who breaks the law to be infringing on their rights to enjoy their own property.

This is especially true of homeowners associations. Home prices are more expensive and there are usually yearly dues as well as monthly fees to live there. Why do people pay them? Because they want to know that there are strict rules saying that the neighbors can't leave the yard to go to weeds and to have 2 dozen junker cars sitting in the back yard. They like knowing that they won't come home from work one day and finding that the guy down the street painted his house purple with yellow polka dots. And, to live there, you agree to certain rules and restrictions on your own behavior. Really, that is the same as being part of any community since man lived in caves - you agree to conform to certain standards to live with the group. There are so many areas that allow people to keep a backyard flock in town not to mention rural areas where you can almost literally do anything you please so why not live there instead of imposing your own values on other people?

 

[chickortreat]

Good points, but what if the one wanting the chickens was there first? I don't consider chicken ownership to be a great infringement on others, seeing as how most folks who want chickens aren't interested in having 50 or 60, but usually only a few for eggs. I still say anyone should be able to own a few, providing they own their house/land. I could see some restriction on apartments, perhaps, but there are even apartments that allow pets.

And, having worked in neighborhoods for nearly 30 years, I can say barking dogs trump chickens for noise any day of the week.