Dog Warning Reminder

[steveholtam]

I see lots of posts about dogs and chickens with people having various tips about how to get the chickens and dogs happy together. From introducing the dogs to the chicks early on and lots of supervised exposure and the like. Well yesterday evening my 10 year old beagle, whom has been around my three chickens, from 6 days old, and for the past two months killed my favorite hen.

I have built a really good coop and run, and that is where the chickens live most of the time. This coop/run combo is very robust, and they are very safe inside of it. But I also have a nice little garden with a smaller fenced area to keep my dog out. Since the hens are now about 2 months old, and much bigger, I figured they would be a bit safer out of the run and into the garden. They really love the garden since it is full of bugs, weeds, plants and the like. Much more natural then the run which is just dirt.

Well yesterday I had the three ladies out in the evening as normal. I heard a loud chicken commotion and ran outside to see my dog chasing one of them down the side of the house, and another running across the yard. I quickly grabbed these two up and put them back into the safety of the run. I went looking for the third, hoping she was hiding in the tomatoes or something.

Sadly, she was in the garden with what appeared to be a broken neck. It was very sad. My dog had pushed her way under a 4 foot length of pressure treated 4x4 that had the chicken wire attached to it. From the first sounds of commotion to when I got to the garden was about 30 seconds.

So just as a warning, please be very careful of your dog(s). My dog showed nothing but simple curiosity about the chickens. She always seemed more interested in what I was feeding them then the chickens themselves. She is an old, fat, half blind beagle that looks about as harmless as any dog can. In just a few seconds though, she was able to kill a chicken. If I had taken another 60 seconds I am sure I would have no chickens left. I was really mad at the dog at first, but I know it is not her fault. Dogs kill chickens. I thought I was lucky and just had one of those dogs that I read about her that "protect" the chickens. Nope...

Take care and enjoy your chickens! Just be very aware of the many threats that exist for these poor stupid birds we enjoy so much.

Steve

 

[TurtlePowerTrav]

Steveholtam, I appreciate you not taking the defensive with all the advice given on this thread. So many post wanting help and such and then get all defensive when we all try and help. Thank you

 

[leadwolf1]

I'm sorry you disagree. I've been training dogs for over 20 years. Things can and do happen. Those are true and factual stories. They did happen. If you think every dog can be trained to be perfectly safe with your chickens or, anything for that matter then, I'm sorry, but someday you are going to be in for a rude awakening.

I am giving advice, the same as you. Just because our experiences differ doesn't mean either of us are wrong.

edited by staff

 

[steveholtam]

So you think that a dog that has never killed a chicken can't out of the blue decide to kill a chicken? Would that be the same as a dog that has never bitten a human until it has bitten a human? I highly doubt that leadwolf fabricated a story about a dog that decided to kill chickens three years into being near them. There are no absolutes when it comes to behavior, chicken, dog or human. People for no reason walk into public places and kill humans.

I respect your feelings on how dogs can be beneficial. But the fact is that dogs can also be threats, the intent of this thread. It is better to be safe then sorry.

edited by staff

 

[Haunted55]

The thousands of years of breeding has involved dogs that are multipurpose. The business of bred for single purpose use is recent as in last couple hundred years or so. A few notable exceptions like sight hounds and the larger LGD breeds used for herding ruminants have been around longer but none can approach the longevity of the village dog. I STATE AGAIN NONE. Most of our extant domestic breeds can trace at least part of their ancestry to those village dogs that looked a bit like the Australian dingo. They are not derived directly from a wolf. Those animals guarded the village / homestead from strangers and predators. Livestock of all sorts where kept by many such human populations. Chickens, free-ranging I stress, were also present. Look on internet for pictures of village dogs and chickens or goats. You will often see dogs out with the other species. Or take yourself out to some third world country that approximates how dogs where kept for many thousands of years. The dogs in many instances would in our society be called strays or do not report to a specific owner yet all members in that community at some point or another invested in training those dogs not to molest the other species of interest to the people. In some instances those same dogs also aided with hunting but would come back and leave livestock alone. If a village can do it with dogs lacking a pedigree, then anyone can if they have an open mind.

Do you have any idea how this was accomplished? Trust me, if you tried to train dogs, the way they did, today, you'd find your little butt in jail. A little pat on the head or a treat handed out didn't get those results. An open mind? Yes I agree and I really think you should have practised that yourself. After reading through the posts it appears to me you just wanted a platform to spew. That's great but it still hasn't solved the original problem or answered the question as well as Leadwolf has done.

 

[sourland]

Welcome, sorry for the circumstances. A lesson that all should pay heed to. Good on you for understanding that it was not the dog's fault.

 

[TurtlePowerTrav]

Do not take this wrong, it is not my intention to "rag" on you. Beagles are bred to hunt small to medium sized game. Chickens fall into this category. Sometimes instinct overrules training in dogs. I know that herding breeds are much more accepting of chickens and less likely to kill one. Also LGD are bred to protect livestock. Hunting dogs are always a risk when it comes to being around chickens. My neighbor has an Asalopso and Chiuahaha so I am always watching if they come near my fence. Although they are scared to death of my large Australian Shepherd, who would never hurt another dog. I am sorry for your loss though. Good luck with your remaining bird. And also note that now your Beagle has hunted and gotten a thrill kill it will most likely try again. Be ever watchful of the dog.

 

[dainerra]

to add on to what Turtle said above, 2 months is no where NEAR enough time to train a dog to be safe around chickens - especially unsupervised. At 2 months in, my dogs are still on a long line and are never allowed around the birds unsupervised.

 

[ReikiStar]

I would suggest putting a hotwire around any area your birds will be spending time. Letting the dog get zapped whenever it tries to approach the chickens would be a useful "negative reinforcement" for your dog.

Agree with Turtle that the dog's breed needs to be taken into account and some dogs will simply never be able to be unsupervised around birds.

 

[CuriousKitten]

I see lots of posts about dogs and chickens with people having various tips about how to get the chickens and dogs happy together. From introducing the dogs to the chicks early on and lots of supervised exposure and the like. Well yesterday evening my 10 year old beagle, whom has been around my three chickens, from 6 days old, and for the past two months killed my favorite hen.

I have built a really good coop and run, and that is where the chickens live most of the time. This coop/run combo is very robust, and they are very safe inside of it. But I also have a nice little garden with a smaller fenced area to keep my dog out. Since the hens are now about 2 months old, and much bigger, I figured they would be a bit safer out of the run and into the garden. They really love the garden since it is full of bugs, weeds, plants and the like. Much more natural then the run which is just dirt.

Well yesterday I had the three ladies out in the evening as normal. I heard a loud chicken commotion and ran outside to see my dog chasing one of them down the side of the house, and another running across the yard. I quickly grabbed these two up and put them back into the safety of the run. I went looking for the third, hoping she was hiding in the tomatoes or something.

Sadly, she was in the garden with what appeared to be a broken neck. It was very sad. My dog had pushed her way under a 4 foot length of pressure treated 4x4 that had the chicken wire attached to it. From the first sounds of commotion to when I got to the garden was about 30 seconds.

So just as a warning, please be very careful of your dog(s). My dog showed nothing but simple curiosity about the chickens. She always seemed more interested in what I was feeding them then the chickens themselves. She is an old, fat, half blind beagle that looks about as harmless as any dog can. In just a few seconds though, she was able to kill a chicken. If I had taken another 60 seconds I am sure I would have no chickens left. I was really mad at the dog at first, but I know it is not her fault. Dogs kill chickens. I thought I was lucky and just had one of those dogs that I read about her that "protect" the chickens. Nope...

Take care and enjoy your chickens! Just be very aware of the many threats that exist for these poor stupid birds we enjoy so much.

Steve

Old and half-blind animals are notorious for getting startled and defending themselves before they realize what startled them. Many humans and other companions get bit every year because of this. The same applies to animals who are a bit under the weather!

With ANY smaller/vulnerable animal, always be extra cautious with older and/or visually impaired animals, however loving they may have been the past 10+ years.

imho: part of the problems are also the fact that more people are getting chickens for the first time. This results in dogs that were not raised with chickens suddenly sharing the yard, and humans with said intruding chickens. These dogs weren't raised knowing that chickens are seriously _not prey_, and jealousy over the human(s) would also be as much of a factor as with any other animal being introduced to the pack.

again imho: if it isn't a trained livestock guardian, in good health, it's interactions with the chickens should always be closely supervised.