Dual purpose bird or straight meat bird?

[cukooformarans]

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Sorry for the confusion... I meant I thought it was typical for a Buff Orpington Rooster ...

 

[GhostRider65]

My BO's came from a hatchery, and I would also say they are smaller than most breeder birds I have seen, I think I'll be lucky if they weigh 5 lbs, and they are 19 weeks. But then again they are using all there feed to chase each other around all day so they are not putting on any weight.
My 9 week old babies seem to be meatier than they are, my Delawares and BR are anyway, and they have been trying to breed the hurt rooster for over a week now and have been crowing since 5 weeks old. Next time I order Straight run they will be either BR or Delawares, they also seem to have a better proportion for breasts meat as well, I'll take some pictures tomorrow so you all can see the difference.

 

[Flyboy718]

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I was thinking about a red or black broiler from Ideal Hatchery. Anybody have any experience with these birds?

 

[AlbionWood]

If economy matters, the CX win hands-down. They convert feed to meat more efficiently than any other bird. Under ideal conditions, you can get almost 1 lb of dressed carcass for 2 lbs of feed. Most of us don't match that in our yards, but it's not hard to get 1:3 or better. With DP birds it's more like 1:4 or 1:5.

There are a lot of complexities to this question and you have to be careful to get accurate information. DP birds have a BIG size difference between pullets and cockerels, and it hardly makes sense to butcher pullets anyway (the eggs are more valuable than the meat). So really you are only going to get meat from about half the DP flock. Whereas the CX have been bred for uniform size - pullets are only a little smaller than cockerels - and they all go into the freezer at the same time. You have to be ready for that, and the CX require more care to raise successfully.

We've done both, and likely will do both in the future, because they are really very different experiences all the way through. It's hard even to compare them. The way you raise them is different, the carcasses are different, processing them is different, the meat tastes different. It's kind of like asking whether pork is better than beef.

 

[AlbionWood]

Here's what I mean about the carcasses being different. Delaware cockerel on the left, CX pullet on the right:

The Delaware was slaughtered at 18 weeks and made a 5 lb carcass. The CX was done at 8 weeks, 5.5 lbs.

We've pretty much given up on roasting the DP birds, because the breast always gets overcooked before the thighs are done, and it just isn't the best way to prepare them IMO. The CX are perfect for roasters. On the other hand the breast filets from the DP birds make the best fried chicken we've ever tasted. On the other other hand, the legs from the DP birds are too tough and stringy for anything but stewing, and even the thighs require slow-cooking or pressure-cooking to tenderize. On the other other other hand, I can't wait for the apples to ripen so we can make our own smoked chicken-apple sausage from the DP thighs!

 

[eatmorechicken]

awesome pic thanks!

 

[eatmorechicken]

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Did you watch fiddler on the roof before typing your reply?

 

[cukooformarans]

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Albion Wood, I think you said it most accurately when you said there are a lot of complexities to this question. While the Cornish X may be meatier, they still cost more to feed. (Especially for us because, as I said before, our birds free range.) That didn't work out as well with the Cornish X. Not only are they not as active, they have a tougher time getting away from predators. We lost like 20 in one day when they were ranging b/c something got in the yard and they couldn't get away. Not to mention, when I cook chicken for a meal, I normally cook one chicken (when cooking for my family of 3). Heritage or Cornish x ... either way there is plenty of meat for the meal and everything else works around that. And believe it or not, with sides or if it is a part of another dish, leftovers tend to work out about the same. Maybe for some people the size difference makes a bigger difference? I guess we just eat more veggies when there is less yummy chicken

Not to mention, if you save a rooster and few hens for breeding purposes, you get eggs PLUS you can hatch your own chicks and save the expense of ordering them. (Admittedly, this does increase food cost some but that is countered by the yummy fresh eggs and the free ranging IMO.) I totally agree on the meat being different though. We have done both and will stick primarily with the DP for the reasons listed above and so many others. However, DH told me yesterday he wants to order some Cornish X for roasters in the near future.

PS-Do you have a recipe for chicken-apple sausage?? That sounds YUMMY!

 

[AlbionWood]

Cuckoo, did you include the 20 birds lost to predation in your calculations for feed cost? Even when free-ranging is factored in, it's hard for me to understand how the cost per pound of meat could be lower for DP birds, unless you really have some excellent foraging grounds. Our DP birds forage as well, but they still have to eat a lot of chicken feed. (Our CX actually did forage a little, especially when they were younger, because they were raised by broody hens. It was hilarious to watch, like parents trying to get their kids to put down the video game, get off the couch and go play in the street!)

If it's really possible to get the cost of feed down to something comparable for either DP or CX, that makes the whole question even more complicated. Normally the one thing you can really count on is that the CX are going to produce the most meat per $. It is true that you can't supplement their feed much with table scraps or garden vegetables - they just don't like to eat those. My DP flock goes absolutely nuts for kale, but the CX were indifferent to it.

Otherwise it sounds as if your experience is pretty similar to mine. We both intend to continue raising both kinds of birds (though to be honest, I'm thinking the next batch of meaties might be FRs, just to see if the extra month gives them better flavor). And we find that growing our own meat and vegetables has caused us to eat more vegetables and less meat; and we have discovered that we actually enjoy the meat more in smaller portions. Our typical meal now includes about 4 to 6 oz of meat per person, it is the flavor we savor and not the bulk. I think our eating habits are shifting to follow the proportionate effort it takes to put the food on the plate, if you follow me - we'll eat cabbage and kale by the pound, meat by the ounce.

P.S. We'll use the chicken-apple sausage recipe from Bruce Aidells' Complete Sausage Book. I'll try to remember to post it here when apple season arrives and we actually make some.

P.P.S. "If I were a wealthy man..." Well, actually, I am feeling pretty wealthy, with about a half-ton of potatoes in the ground, a yard full of chickens producing 16 eggs a day, and a freezer full of meat. So all day long I "Biddy-biddy-bum".

 

[homesteadapps]

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You may feed a DP longer but you are feeding them the same to less the amount of feed of a Cornish.

Please see my previous post https://www.backyardchickens.com/forum/viewtopic.php?pid=7114236#p7114236

DP like a White Rock or Buckeye from good breeder stock should easily give you a 4.5 to 5 lb dressed bird somewhere between 18 to 20 weeks.
In this time they should only use 14 lbs of feed total (not free ranging). Feed to meat ratio 2.97 lb to 1 lb

Hybrid Cornish will eat anywhere from 16 to 20lbs of feed for 8 weeks and will normally dress out around 5.5 to 6.5 lbs. Feed to meat ration 3.33lb to 1 lb

We usually figure at 20 lbs for 8 weeks for the Cornish X for all of our budgeting.

You just can't compare most hatchery stock to breeder stock for meat.

The feed numbers above come from documented research at a university. See the previous post for our own experience.

The real cost savings of a sustainable flock is that you do not have to purchase new chicks each year.