Eggbound? Something else?

[OwO]

Okay so it sounds like it could be Egg Yolk Peritonitis which would cause the Ascites fluid, however draining it can introduce bacteria into her abdomen if the syringe is not sterilised. It's also strange that you were unable to get any fluid out and instead got blood - perhaps you stuck it in too far? If it is EYP then you can get her a suprelorin implant which, after about a week or two, will cause her to stop producing eggs for around 4-6months, after which you may have to replace it, depending on how she is acting. However this implant is very expensive and the last one I used cost me £200.

 

[ia02]

Thank you all for the input. Her condition progressed quickly downhill today and we decided to put her down tonight. She was obviously suffering. It was sad but she let us know it was time so we had to listen.

The paralysis continued to get worse, and the symptoms became more like Marek's, in my experience. We are going to do a necropsy tomorrow to see what we can find.

I definitely still feel like EYP is a possibility. We also found one roundworm egg in a fecal sample. Worms could have contributed to the stress, although it doesn't appear to have been a huge infestation.

I will update after the necropsy.

 

[rebrascora]

So sorry to hear that you needed to end it for her but it certainly sounds like the right decision. It may seem a bit morbid, but could you take some photos of the necropsy, particularly of anything that looks abnormal and post them along with a brief description of chicken and symptoms on the following thread, so that those of us who have an interest, can improve our knowledge.

Many thanks

Barbara

 

[ia02]

My vet friend will be doing the necropsy. I'll see if she can share some photos. Can you link the appropriate thread to post them to?

 

[rebrascora]

Yes, I just searching for it and intending to edit my previous post but here it is:-

https://www.backyardchickens.com/th...-contains-xxx-graphic-necropsy-photos.823961/

 

[ia02]

Final Update: Upon necropsy we have what we believe to be a solid diagnosis of Egg Yolk Peritonitis. I was very surprised to find out that she had no visible tumors or masses, despite what seemed like so many Marek's-like symptoms. My vet friend found that she had a lot of yolk in the abdomen. Yolk plus the symptoms seems like a solid EYP diagnosis. I can't help but think that if we had gotten her full of antibiotics earlier then maybe we could have saved her.

Can anyone point to a good source of info on how to recognize, treat and most importantly prevent EYP in the future?

 

[MyHappyGirls]

I'm so glad you got to find out what happened to her I have researched EYP ALOT! I have not found anything that prevents it umfortunatley but I do believe that we can try our best by feeding organic Non GMO feed fresh water and possibly some homeopathic remedies. It seems like a genetic thing that occurs randomly & there doesn't seem to be a way to find out is happening until it's too late. There are some cases where EYP is caught early enough to save the hen & I have heard of two homeopathic remedies that treated the EYP. I had a hen that started having sour crop about a year before she had EYP & ascites, & she didn't come into lay after molting & maybe If I knew then what I know now, I could have helped her live longer by trying other homeopathic remedies or forcing her into another molt before she got too weak. It is just so hard to tell with chickens you have to watch them VERY close! It would be very interesting to find out if a molt would help because it might reset the hens body? There just isn't enough research published online about preventing EYP, maybe in the next few years there will be more solutions & us Hen lovers won't have to go through losses from EYP.

 

[MyHappyGirls]

I think you did your best! By the time the hen has all that build of of yolk in her abdomen I think antibiotics just prolong it, we gave our hen antibiotics for a month & she got ascites again then she got vent gleet & more crop issues. It's a sad and difficult thing to deal with when you are attached to them!

 

[rebrascora]

Thanks for the update on necropsy result. There is no way to prevent internal laying, other than hormonal implants to stop ovulation once it is discovered. It is only a matter of time before infection sets in causing EYP or heart/lung failure from build up of pressure on them from the mass of yolks inside them. Detecting internal laying early can depends on a number of factors. If you have a mixed flock it is sometimes easier to identify when a particular hen has stopped laying than in a single breed flock that lay uniform eggs. Monitoring hens that otherwise look like they should be laying (ie plump red comb.... perhaps visiting nest box and singing egg song without producing an egg) for weight gain and abdominal swelling. Usually, they look healthy and you don't realise there is a problem until you start to see the wide stance, upright penguin walk and find the swelling which of course is often disguised by their feathers. By then, things are pretty well progressed though. I lost a hen a couple of months ago to it, that I noticed had the penguin walk and swelling at least 9 months previous, but her condition improved during the winter when she moulted and was no longer ovulating. As soon as her comb became red and fleshy in spring, the swelling started to increase, clearly as a result of her egg laying system coming back into gear and more yolks being deposited in her abdomen. She didn't get an infection but the pressure on her organs took it's toll.
I don't think they will ever get back to laying eggs properly once they have started internal laying because the weight of the mass of eggs in their belly, pulls things even further out of line, making it more difficult still for the eggs released from the ovary to drop into the oviduct and take their proper course.
The superlorin hormone implants have been extremely useful in treating this problem but at hundreds of pounds/dollars every 6 months or so, it's a very expensive business, which my budget just doesn't run to and of course the mass of yolks that have already accumulated are still at risk of developing an infection.

It could still be that Marek's caused her to suffer EYP. There doesn't necessarily have to be a tumour. Marek's compromises the immune system, so infection is more likely to become an issue in many different parts of the body.

 

[Goldnmine]

I'm so glad you got to find out what happened to her I have researched EYP ALOT! I have not found anything that prevents it umfortunatley but I do believe that we can try our best by feeding organic Non GMO feed fresh water and possibly some homeopathic remedies. It seems like a genetic thing that occurs randomly & there doesn't seem to be a way to find out is happening until it's too late. There are some cases where EYP is caught early enough to save the hen & I have heard of two homeopathic remedies that treated the EYP. I had a hen that started having sour crop about a year before she had EYP & ascites, & she didn't come into lay after molting & maybe If I knew then what I know now, I could have helped her live longer by trying other homeopathic remedies or forcing her into another molt before she got too weak. It is just so hard to tell with chickens you have to watch them VERY close! It would be very interesting to find out if a molt would help because it might reset the hens body? There just isn't enough research published online about preventing EYP, maybe in the next few years there will be more solutions & us Hen lovers won't have to go through losses from EYP.

What are the homeopathic treatments for EYP? I have a hen who I was told has it and I can't afford the shots or spaying (the 2 options the vet gave) I have changed her diet and going to try cutting her day light hours to force a false winter to try and get her to stop laying. I keep hearing and reading this usually doesn't even well but I'm not ready to give up till she's really bad off.