Enhanced Protein Feed - Winter?

[Apis mellifera]

I think this is a a bit over the top. So there is more Ca than fly larvae, well I would think Ca weighs more. You didn't get an answer, so you are dissing the product. I have no idea how much fly larvae is in it. I do know that insect protein is the wave of the future, judging by studies that have been going on for several years. Using soy protein is not sustainable & neither is fish meal. I will give Purina credit for being the first that I know of to include insect protein & I look forward to the day when more feed companies do the same. I have heard Kalmbach is working on it & I'm sure others are too. I refuse to feed a 20% protein feed exclusively, when I know it is just more soy. Glad you took the time to ask Purina.

It doesn't go by weight. In there reply they told me that there is more Ca than BSFL.

 

[Cindy in PA]

It doesn't go by weight. In there reply they told me that there is more Ca than BSFL.

Ok, then why does everyone claim animal feed tags go by weight of most to least? Good to know.

 

[Apis mellifera]

Ok, then why does everyone claim animal feed tags go by weight of most to least? Good to know.

I'm not sure to be honest. You can check post #72 and judge for yourself. But what I do know is I was told by Purina that there is more calcium than BSFL. So it would seem that there's an insignificant amount of animal protein. Why is it a secret how much animal protein vs vegetable protein in the product?

 

[Folly's place]

Feed tags do go by weight, from heaviest to lightest. That's why I wondered if those larva were dried or not, because the water weight is significant.
Mary

 

[Apis mellifera]

Feed tags do go by weight, from heaviest to lightest. That's why I wondered if those larva were dried or not, because the water weight is significant.
Mary

Its a dry product. If the Calcium is 3.25 to 4.25% of the 40 lb bag and BSFL is listed after it that would say the amount of larva is almost nothing, correct?

 

[Folly's place]

The weighing is done with the raw ingredients, before mixing and processing.
That's why 'real meat' or 'whole chicken' is listed first on pet food labels, because it's 70% to 80% water, not like 'meat meal' which is 10% water by weight. Deceptive, IMO, but people buy into it all the time.
I agree that there's not a lot of larva in that feed, either dry or live weight, but there's more if it was listed as dry weight.
Mary

 

[Apis mellifera]

The weighing is done with the raw ingredients, before mixing and processing.
That's why 'real meat' or 'whole chicken' is listed first on pet food labels, because it's 70% to 80% water, not like 'meat meal' which is 10% water by weight. Deceptive, IMO, but people buy into it all the time.
I agree that there's not a lot of larva in that feed, either dry or live weight, but there's more if it was listed as dry weight.
Mary

Interesting, thank you. Too bad, it shouldn't be this difficult to understand what is actually in the feed. I would love to know how much of the 16% protein is animal but we will probably never know. Funny thing is about 3 years ago Purina was working on a bee feed called "Hearty Bee" and the protein source was animal protein of all things! What was the source? Chicken blood! Honey bees are not omnivores and do not need or thrive on animal proteins. It wasn't received well in the beekeeping community. Its ironic that they want feed bees animal protein and chickens vegetable protein.

 

[Ghosty]

I fed high protein feeds to my chickens for quite awhile, due to raising guineas as well. What I noticed was that the poop was much stickier and stinkier. I now feed 16% layer and all flock, and will stay at 18% for chicks. JMO. I free range.

 

[Mossy Dell]

On the contrary. Protein needs remain relatively steady year round. They need more energy in winter than in summer. That comes from carbohydrates, starches, sugars and fats.
An adult bird (depending on the bird's size needs about 21 grams of protein a day. Perhaps a bit more prior to and during the productive season. A bit less when they are out of production.
Excess protein from what they can use for body function and maintenance is wasted. It puts a burden on the liver and kidneys to expel it and it ends up in the bedding as ammonia.

On the contrary, I've read experts say to increase protein in summer because when it's real hot they eat less. What's real hot? 86F and up. They eat to meet their energy needs, so energy is always important, but they select more high energy feeds in winter, if they can.

The feed-more-protein-in-summer is counter-intuitive and may not be true if they have access to good range. There is a lot of protein in tender growing grass, bugs. The hard thing to gauge is how fresh the range is—if they range out from a coop, they cream a wide area. There is still protein but they do have an impact on bug numbers and can overgraze.

 

[centrarchid]

When I up the protein level during heat of summer, it is to counter the decrease in feed intake as related to energy need. When temperatures get up high enough where energy need goes down, the chickens consume less feed as it appears energy is what they base feed intake regulation on. I look at is as reducing energy rather than increasing protein to keep the protein and other nutrient intakes high enough.

Free-range chickens with access to sufficient high quality forages are capable of exercising some food item selectivity that animal nutrition scientist have not even started to explore.