Examples of Different Base/Ground colors for Mille fleur and Porcelain patterns?

[RememberTheWay]

I am starting a mille fleur satin silkie project and a porcelain project with them.

I've seen that mille fleur can be created using several different "ground" colors and or "bases". Meaning one could use Partridge, duckwing, Wheaton and maybe birchen (but can't remember if that one was included of not).

Anyways what I am curious about is for those of you who either have done color projects where you created mille fleur or porcelain especially if you used more then one base can you talk about your experiences with the different bases please? What was your favorite? Least favorite? Are their better bases to use for porcelain projects ?

Does anyone have photo examples of how the patterns turn out for both mille fleur and Porcelain using various genetic bases? I would love to see them.

I'm part of a FB group that advocates for basically only using partridge bases. She also claims that Wheaton causes unstable mottling.

I would like to get others opinions on this topic and hear about everyone's experiences. I don't particularly like all the porcelain birds I see online and I am especially curious to know if maybe it has something to do with original base the bird was on before lavender was added that creates the patterns I like and the ones the I don't

Photo borrowed from the internet and edited to only include plumage color for an example

Edited to remove "Columbian" from the above list- not sure why I even added it because I knew it wasn't a base my research last night had my brain scrambled a bit I guess

 

[Amer]

Partridge is the best base for making mille fleur. Columbian isn't an E base, it's a gene found in all mille fleur birds. Also mille fleur can't be made on birchen but it sounds like you figured that out.

 

[RememberTheWay]

Partridge is the best base for making mille fleur. Columbian isn't an E base, it's a gene found in all mille fleur birds. Also mille fleur can't be made on birchen but it sounds like you figured that out.

Thanks. I did actually know that about Columbian and edited the post to reflect that.

Here's a question can a bird be split between two bases? I think I've seen that? Like where it's partridge and birchen? And if so could you potentially use a split bird to create non splits or are subsequent offspring all going to be splits?

I have seen people say that partridge is the best base but I've also heard that D'uccle mille fleur is based on Wheaton. And I know personally a lot of D'uccle has been used in this new color project. The background color on a mille fleur bird that is partridge is usually much darker (from what I've seen in the group) and more brown while others are more gold I'm assuming a different base? But I am most curious about how the different bases change tones once the lavender gene is introduced and if maybe one is better for my project?

I have some birds here that are satin silkie project birds and am trying to figure out if any will work or not.

 

[Amer]

Thanks. I did actually know that about Columbian and edited the post to reflect that.

Here's a question can a bird be split between two bases? I think I've seen that? Like where it's partridge and birchen? And if so could you potentially use a split bird to create non splits or are subsequent offspring all going to be splits?

I have seen people say that partridge is the best base but I've also heard that D'uccle mille fleur is based on Wheaton. And I know personally a lot of D'uccle has been used in this new color project. The background color on a mille fleur bird that is partridge is usually much darker (from what I've seen in the group) and more brown while others are more gold I'm assuming a different base? But I am most curious about how the different bases change tones once the lavender gene is introduced and if maybe one is better for my project?

I have some birds here that are satin silkie project birds and am trying to figure out if any will work or not.

They can be split for different bases but bred to make homozygous birds.
D'Uccle mille fleur is partridge. I don't know how the bases change tones with lavender.
The main thing is, partridge provides the amount of black you need for spangling while wheaten does not.

 

[RememberTheWay]

They can be split for different bases but bred to make homozygous birds.
D'Uccle mille fleur is partridge. I don't know how the bases change tones with lavender.
The main thing is, partridge provides the amount of black you need for spangling while wheaten does not.

I think I will need to gather some examples photos to illustrate the differences I'm speaking about in the color project groups on regular mille fleur but I also see differences in the porcelain project birds too which makes me think it has something to do with original base it's on.

Another question I've been thinking about recently is the gold/silver thing. From what I understand all birds are based on gold or silver, and only males being able to be split to both at the same time. So from what I understand about "self blue" lines at show it is preferred that these birds be based on silver not gold. That it produces a much more even color then gold based lavender birds. But with a regular mille fleur project - at least in these groups- it's advised to use a gold base not silver. I also wasn't sure if with self blue the silver advise only applies to solid lavender birds and not necessarily Isabella and porcelain line too.

Off course if this sounds silly- forgive my ignorance. I am still learning and while I am getting a decent grasp on some genes others are proving more difficult to sort out mentally and work out how they all interact together.

 

[RememberTheWay]

All photos were borrowed from the internet groups and are examples that I could find to show the difference in colors and patterning. Can someone explain to me why they are different and how I would go about achieving the different kinds of if one is actually "more desirable" as far as quality goes over another? Are there separate genes at play as well? If there are, are any of theme desirable or undesirable for a porcelain project?

 

[NatJ]

But with a regular mille fleur project - at least in these groups- it's advised to use a gold base not silver.

Yes you must have a gold base to have Mille Fleur chickens. There's no other way to get the gold color. Unless you want Silver Mille Fleur (white with black dots), which is obviously a different variety.

I also wasn't sure if with self blue the silver advise only applies to solid lavender birds and not necessarily Isabella and porcelain line too.

The lavender gene dilutes gold to a cream color. That is what you usually see in Isabella and Porcelain birds. Changing that gold to silver would give a different color variety. I would guess the silver version of a Porcelain would be called a Silver Porcelain. I don't know what to call the silver version of an Isabella.

Another question I've been thinking about recently is the gold/silver thing. From what I understand all birds are based on gold or silver, and only males being able to be split to both at the same time.

Yes, assuming that the only "birds" you are talking about are chickens. Other species might be different.

So from what I understand about "self blue" lines at show it is preferred that these birds be based on silver not gold. That it produces a much more even color then gold based lavender birds.

I've read similar things about Blacks and about Blues (blue gene rather than lavender gene), so it's apparently somewhat common for people to say that gold vs. silver makes a difference in color varieties where it isn't supposed to be visible at all. I don't have any personal experience to confirm or deny it.