FERMENTED FEEDS...anyone using them?

Discussion in 'Feeding & Watering Your Flock' started by Beekissed, Mar 30, 2012.

  1. bluerat

    bluerat New Egg

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    Fermented is digested a lot better I started doing it after finding my birds weren't thriving on dry mix and water. They immediately began thriving and have been since.
     
  2. Audio51

    Audio51 Chillin' With My Peeps

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    I have 4 BC Marans that are all laying but none of them have ever squatted. I don't know if it's a breed thing, but come to think of it, my Buff Orphington is also laying and has never squatted.
     
  3. LeslieDJoyce

    LeslieDJoyce Overrun With Chickens

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    If you have roosters, they might be squatting for them instead of for humans?
     
  4. Audio51

    Audio51 Chillin' With My Peeps

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    No roosters. I guess I'm not "man" enough for them.......which makes sense since I am a woman! [​IMG]
     
  5. ChickenCanoe

    ChickenCanoe True BYC Addict

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    I'm sorry. The powdered starter I'm using contains the following:
    Bacillus subtilis
    Lactobacilus acidophilus
    Pediococcus acidilactici
    Pediococcus pentosaceus
    Saccharomyces cerevisiae

    It was formulated specifically for chickens based on research in Egypt.
    It can be used mixed with water or feed for all poultry and waterfowl.
    I see no reason it wouldn't be valuable as a FF starter.

    The kefir I'm using contains:
    L. acidophilus
    B. bacterium lactis
    L. lactis subsp. Lactis
    L. lactis subsp. Cremoris
    L. lactis subsp. lacti biovar. Diacetylactis
    L. mesenteroides subsp. Cremoris
    L. delbrueckii subsp. Bulgaricus
    L. delbrueckii subsp. Lactis
    L. rhamnosus
    L. casei
    S. thermophilus

    Thanks for the studies.

    Chicken feed is primarily cereal grains. Corn is often the #1 ingredient in the US.
    Various cereal grains are used around the world, depending on wheat grows better there and is the cheapest.

    I think any could be used as long as the container guarantees live active cultures.

    Same here. When beginning FF, I didn't trust the good cultures would establish before the bad ones.
    I found some other studies and if I find them in my favorites, I'll post them.

    I think the difference in animals in the study is of monogastric (swine, poultry) as opposed to ruminents. (cattle, goats
    Monogastric herbivores (horses, rabbits) are hindgut fermenters. Ruminents are foregut fermenters.

    http://www.ksgrains.com/sorghum/MiloMania04.pdf

    As Leslie said, it's more rooster related than breed.
    Squatting really has nothing to do with egg laying but a desire to be bred.
    Without a rooster, the animal husbander is seen by the hen as the man of the house regardless of whether the tender is male or female.
    A hen that doesn't squat has either had the attention of a hen or just doesn't have a breeding interest.
    Non-squatters will still lay just as many eggs.
    IME, squatters will usually come from DP breeds that aren't with a rooster.
     
    Last edited: Feb 15, 2014
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  6. LeslieDJoyce

    LeslieDJoyce Overrun With Chickens

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    Yeah ... I was just having a "moment." I casually mention the words "food grade bucket" in a post and inspire pages of posts thoroughly shaming me for it. One of which was the top rated post of the day yesterday. Boy did that leave me feeling stoooooooopid.

    Then I go to the effort of not only providing links to, but (on demand) typing up (from my sick bed, so using an iPhone, which isn't the easiest way to post to this forum) a rather detailed explanation for two GREAT research articles that actually quantify the nutritional boost of fermented grains ... grains that are included as primary ingredients in poultry rations in many parts of the world ... and discuss specific fermenting procedures, only to get told it isn't relevant. [​IMG]

    Nobody even "liked" my posts.

    This pity party I'm throwing for myself could be due to a Seasonal Chocolate Deficiency. I think our bodies have adapted to receiving a chocolate infusion on February 14th, and I never got mine. [​IMG] I could probably apply for disability. [​IMG]
     
    5 people like this.
  7. Audio51

    Audio51 Chillin' With My Peeps

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  8. ChickenCanoe

    ChickenCanoe True BYC Addict

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    What was the problem with food grade buckets?

    I use pickle buckets (food grade) for everything food or water related.
     
  9. LeslieDJoyce

    LeslieDJoyce Overrun With Chickens

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    I might be missing something here, but ... both studies analyzed different aspects of fermentation of grains from a nutrition/food safety perspective that seems to me to be entirely independent of any animal species. The baby-food study DID discuss how appealing the food was to humans, but that part of the study had no bearing on the results of the nutritional/safety analysis.

    One relevant correlation between these studies and what we're discussing here in this thread is that for human babies in Nigeria and farmed poultry & pigs, what the fermentation of the grains is attempting to do is overcome the nutritional deficiencies of a grain-based diet for an omnivore. The Nigerian study indicates that the traditional concept of fermenting cereal grains is nutritionally sound -- the study proves that fermentation increases the overall protein content of the cereals, and fills in some of the missing amino acids, and makes the food safer (and tastier, but that part of the study isn't as relevant). The information this study provides is important for any omnivore restricted to a grain-based diet (like babies, who have to be fed and can't explain their "cravings", or farm animals who can't do their own shopping and have had their forage range drastically limited).

    Fermenting cereal grains for omnivores is an easy, natural solution to a serious problem which has somehow managed to stump modern science.

    Publications from the UN describe how wide-spread the traditional practice of fermenting cereal grains and other foods is throughout much of the world. They might not have always had amino acids in mind when developing the traditions, but I'm sure the results of fermentation were obvious enough that the traditions developed. I'd like to see more studies about the specific nutritional boosts of fermentation, particularly fermentation of cereal grains. Yes, I'd love a study of a standard soy-based poultry ration ... that would be icing on the cake.

    I think it is marvelous that Beekissed has brought the idea of fermented feed here ... and when she gets back I'm going to ask her how she thought of it.
     
  10. LeslieDJoyce

    LeslieDJoyce Overrun With Chickens

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    Apparently anyone using a food grade bucket is being "silly" (and possibly lazy) for wasting time/energy/money/concern on that as any bucket will do (if you scrub it enough) & we're all going to die anyway and there are more important things to think about. And, no, it doesn't matter if you got the food-grade bucket for free, or accidentally purchased it without knowing it was "food grade." You're just as silly as anyone who went out and bought a food-grade bucket on purpose.

    Of course I might be exaggerating a bit, but that's the gist of it. [​IMG]

    I'm really being a brat right now. Someone needs to send me to my room. Stat.
     
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