Fermenting troubles!

[lazy gardener]

I have seen what you refer to as Kahm in my ferment when it has been covered with water. Either way, I consider it to be harmless, and part of the natural flora that makes up my SCOBY. SCOBY IMO does not always take the form that you show. It depends on where it is growing, and if it exists as it's own "jellyfish like" clump or is integrated through the culture material. Still, imo semantics. You can call it a TOmato, I'll call it a toMATO.

 

[Smuvers Farm]

I have seen what you refer to as Kahm in my ferment when it has been covered with water. Either way, I consider it to be harmless, and part of the natural flora that makes up my SCOBY. SCOBY IMO does not always take the form that you show. It depends on where it is growing, and if it exists as it's own "jellyfish like" clump or is integrated through the culture material. Still, imo semantics. You can call it a TOmato, I'll call it a toMATO.

Well, with your semantics, I hope someone doesn't stir kahm yeast into kombucha, thinking it will grow into a SCOBY..... comme si comme sa!

PS. Whether it's called a TOmato or toMATO, it's still a TOMATO, not a tomato and an apple which, through semantics, are still both fruit.

 

[Sara Ranch]

2 cents. Yep, here's my two cents.

I have also adopted chickens with severely cut beaks. I noticed that they couldn't do crumble well. They all had issues with weight, feathers, eye sight, mites/lice, etc. (The chickens have been here long enough that I know their beaks are never going to grow back.)

At the time I adopted them, I was doing crumble and pellets (organic, non GMO).

I switched over to fermented feed for everyone - the chickens, the ducks, and the turkeys. After doing it for a bit, I felt that I needed to take a time out and hit the reset button. I posted my questions on BYC.

* I have 4 five gallon buckets of fermented feed going at all times.

* the amount of feed I go through varies, depending on a lot of factors. I may go through one bucket or I may go through three buckets of feed in a day.

* I also have multiple flocks, multiple food needs, multiple feeding stations, rough terrain, not so easy to access pastures, and a lot of animals! (Yes, I am still open to providing forever homes to more animals that need it.)

* I buy 18% or 22% protein feed, depending on what is available.

*I buy various other things, like oats, legumes, etc to feed the animals.

* In the five gallon buckets, I add water from the tap (I have a water softener and a black light/UV filter system) and I add feed. JUST feed.

---- When I use pellets, some stuff settles, some stuff rises to the top. The pellets puff up. I stir two to three times a day. Pellets seem to make more feed than crumbles BUT my guys seem to be hungrier on the pellet fermented feed than the crumble feed.

---- When I use crumbles, the stuff sinks to the bottom and becomes a heavy sludge. This is where stirring is so beneficial.

---- I stir before I scoop out the feed using a 4 cup measuring cup.

* In separate, large tupperware containers, I soak the oats, the legumes, and everything else dry I am giving the animals. I scoop that out using a one cup measuring spoon and put it in the food dishes/food containers. The stuff doesn't get moldy. Sometimes it will ferment - get bubbly. I go through it fast enough that fermenting seldom happens.

* I currently have ten feeding stations. The places that are easily accessible to me with an easy walk, I put the feed (goodies plus fermented feed) directly into the food containers and take it out. The places that are not easy to access or are a bit of a walk, I put the food in plastic containers with lids and delivery that way. MUCH easier than how I had been doing. (I so needed to hit the reset button to work smarter not harder.) --- I deliver the food in the morning BEFORE I let the animals out.

* The feed doesn't really smell. Yeah, there's a warm yeasty smell sometimes. Once, and only once, there was a bad smell. I was the only one who could smell it. When I hit the reset button, I washed all the buckets out and let them dry before starting again. I do not wash the buckets in between batches.

* I always leave a little feed at the bottom of the bucket to help the new batch get going.

* I cover the buckets with dish towels. The flies still manage to get in and drown when I take the towel off. That's ok - extra protein.

* I use to go through 35-40# of dry feed a day. I have more animals now, bigger and older now, than the dry feed days. I go through a 40# bag of feed in about 2-3 days now.

* I supplement the feed (as I did before) with oats, legumes, rice, etc. I soak all the dry stuff separately! I also supplement (as I did before) with fresh fruits and veggies.

Stir the feed BEFORE you scoop it out.

Soak the grains/seeds separately and mix into the food container.

If you have any questions, please email me.

 

[igorsMistress]

It is now technically "floaties" from here on out in my kitchen

It's the science experiment in my house.

I believe that this is a case of semantics. Why argue the words? Kahm is a type of yeast. SF, please correct me if my google search on Kahm is not correct.

"SCOBY" is actually an acronym: Symbiotic Culture Of Bacteria and Yeast. So, SCOBY can be a combination of Kahm, other kinds of yeasts, and bacteria. A natural SCOBY will develop simply by allowing your feed to be exposed to the yeasts and bacteria floating around in the air of every home.

So, why make this more confusing than it needs to be. The old timers made sour kraut from natural "floaties". They also preserved other food items from natural "floaties". It has been a well recognized method of food preservation and enhancement for thousands of years, across all cultures.

Thank you

 

[PirateGirl]

Well, with your semantics, I hope someone doesn't stir kahm yeast into kombucha, thinking it will grow into a SCOBY..... comme si comme sa!

PS. Whether it's called a TOmato or toMATO, it's still a TOMATO, not a tomato and an apple which, through semantics, are still both fruit.

But it's safe for chickens to eat both right?

 

[MasAhora]

When I first started with FF it took me a while to get my system right and to feel confident.
A year on and its a breeze. Poop odor is also much milder!
I have an adult flock of more than 20 and a baby flock of around 10 at the moment so do 2 types of feed and feed twice a day.
Takes up a small portion of my kitchen bench and maybe an extra 5ish minutes than the dry feed each day.
I always scoop a bit off the top each morning (the light greyish scoby - can look a different colour depending on feed type) this goes into a bowl water for the next batch.
After feeding I return with dry feed, add the scoby and more water then stir occasionally when walking by and the next batch is ready overnight.

When I add seeds its just before feed time and I mix them into the mix or scatter them on the ground for a treat.
You'll figure out what works for you -dry, FF, wet or a combination.

I started with giving mine FF and dry feed for a few weeks/months until we all got used to it, they decided they preferred the FF and so do I.
I especially like it in hot weather (we get very hot summers and hydration can be a challenge).

I also give the Mamas with new chicks some dry and some FF - most Mamas go straight to the FF but a couple go to the dry first and after a few weeks go to the FF first. Kinda interesting to observe.

Irrespective of your decision, don't forget lightly scrambled eggs now and than can be great for a chicken needing a boost.

I did notice when I fermented a mostly corn crumble feed that the whitish surface mold formed really lovely intricate patterns and smelt nicer - but I only use that particular feed if I can't buy my regular balanced option.

What adds to my time is that my 4 cows and my dog all LOVE FF and I often have to stop and give them a spoonful.

 

[lazy gardener]

But it's safe for chickens to eat both right?

yes.

What adds to my time is that my 4 cows and my dog all LOVE FF and I often have to stop and give them a spoonful.

I have a hard time keeping my dog out of the FF.

 

[oldhenlikesdogs]

My dogs love my chicken feed straight out of the bag. They also love chicken poop straight out of the chickens. In my experiences dogs aren't exactly good judges on what tastes good or what's good for them to eat.

 

[igorsMistress]

I am happy to know I'm not the only one chasing the dogs out of the chicken food!

 

[CayugaJana]

I use a couple small plastic containers with lids. Like others have posted, I clean them out weekly. I also don't like having yeast as my culture. Lactobacilli are native to the gut and a lot less likely to over breed in the gut causing the host problems. I personally have problems when my body gets too "yeasty". So again that is why I only like lactobacilli in my feed. The way I do this is by putting a small scoop of yogurt in my feed every week. This gives the good bacteria the chance to breed and dominate over other microbes. And like other posters, I only ferment for 24-48 hours. My birds like a thick oatmeal consistency. When I continually inoculate my feed (yogurt), it doesn't stink and I don't have mold.

The cons to FF- It is more time consuming. If you want to leave for days at a time and not have to worry about feeding your flock, FF isn't the way to go. I had a tote that I cut circles out of the sides so the ducks could stick their heads in and eat. The dry food would last for over a week without refilling. You can't do this with FF. You also have to be aware of what the feed looks like.

Pros- It can be better for them. The bacteria in my feed decompose part of the feed that the ducks can't digest. This makes the ducks able to digest more of the feed and pull more nutrients out (we all know what corn looks like coming out). Making them eat less because more nutrition is available to them. Their poop also smells waaaay better!!!!

So to answer your question, I buy a small container of yogurt once a week and add a scoop to my feed. This prevents mold growth because the there is so much yogurt bacteria in the feed that nothing else has a chance to grow.

One last thing, I respectfully disagree with the comment about yeast being a kind of mold. They are two separate things. Not even close to the same thing.