Fermenting troubles!

[Pyxis]

Like I said in my other post, it takes me longer to grind my coffe beans and make my coffee every morning, than doing my FF.
Please tell me what takes so long, to do the FF. I must not be doing it right, because I only spend a few minutes a day on it.

For me, it would take too much labor and time. I have a lot of birds that I need to feed, over fifty and of various species and ages, in multiple coops, etc. So, I would need to keep quite a few containers going so that I could always have some that's at the right stage to use, which would be a pain. And multiple containers for different types of feed - game bird feed for my game birds, game bird starter for my juvenile game birds, chick starter/grower for all my chickens, flock raiser for the waterfowl, etc.

So my process would have to be to dish out the feed, trekking to all the coops and runs while hauling multiple dishes full of wet feed, and only as much as they could eat quickly because I wouldn't want it to sit out and start to mold, which is very possible with any wet feed, fermented or not.

Then, I'd have to refill the buckets I emptied to start a new batch in rotation. I'd also have to stir the other batches I had going.

And then repeat for an evening feeding.

Or, I could just top off their feeders full of dry feed every other day and let them have at it. Since my birds do well without FF, I just don't see the need to ferment. I did try FF once, and I found that it was too much work for too little reward, at least for me. Others may definitely feel differently, and that's okay. We're all just sharing our opinions here.

 

[lazy gardener]

Agreed FF is not for everybody. But, it is not a time consuming process FOR THE AVERAGE FLOCK KEEPER. What I find truly amusing is that so many folks are always jumping in to say that it's dangerous, that it doesn't work, that it's not beneficial, that it takes too much time. Often the nay sayers are the very people who have not used FF. I can agree that feeding dry is an acceptable way to go. I have seen a few threads by folks who have issues with moldy feed when feeding dry. BUT, I'm not going to get wound up about it and tell everyone that you should not feed dry feed b/c it might get moldy. My FF sits out in the feeder from the time I feed in the morning until it's consumed later in the day. I have a cockerel in a pen by himself. Sometimes I mis judge how much he will eat, and he still has FF left the next morning. It does not get moldy, specifically b/c it is fermented. The existing microbes in the FF have populated it, so it won't mold. Sure... if it sat in a hot sun, baking all day, it might get nasty, but that has not been my experience in over 4 years of fermenting.

 

[blackdog043]

I do mine the same way. If for some reason they don't finish the days ration, It's a head start for them when they wake up before I get out there. I've not had any mold grow on mine. My feed and water is inside the coop.

 

[shadowfox]

I do mine the same way. If for some reason they don't finish the days ration, It's a head start for them when they wake up before I get out there. I've not had any mold grow on mine. My feed and water is inside the coop.

This makes me not feel too bad for leaving excess food in the coop last night! They just moved out there Tuesday and I haven't quite got their feeding schedule fixed.

 

[Molpet]

I have found my layers do better on grower than layer feed. I get better hatch rates and seems like more eggs. I alway seem to have chicks running around. I go through 150lbs a week of dry feed that I ferment. I have currently five 5 gallon buckets fermenting in my basement. currently 6 turkeys and 59 chickens of various ages and 12 eggs under a broody

 

[scalci]

IMO, there is a huge very distinct line between fermented and moldy. I know the difference between good yogurt and moldy yogurt.

Yes, I understand that, I'm not an idiot. That is why I am posting this to begin with. I KNOW what mold is, so I am trying to figure out how the hell people manage this method without mold.

 

[scalci]

I agree with these guys... Put your birds on a pellet and don't mess around with this stuff. It isn't worth the extra time in my opinion. It's a lot easier to just dump a bag of feed into a feeder and walk away... I don't use FF and my birds look just as good as everyone else's. It's too risky IMHO. A batch gone wrong could easily kill a bird or birds.

I know I will probably catch hell for some of this...

I need to feed some type of wet food, that's why I wanted to do fermenting. I adopted some hens who had their beaks snipped and I recently almost lost one because she was all skin and bones because she wasn't able to pick up pellets or crumbles. I thought she was constantly eating the pellets when in reality she was pecking away constantly and barely getting any in her beak.

I'll probably just stick to making the wet mash as much as possible, i just thought it would be quicker and healthier if I did the FF but it's not looking good.

 

[scalci]

Could you post a picture of your fermented feed? Especially the part that you're concerned looks like mold?

Sorry. I threw it out. It was black with white fuzzy stuff (like a damn catapillar.... YUCK!)

 

[Pyxis]

Sorry. I threw it out. It was black with white fuzzy stuff (like a damn catapillar.... YUCK!)

Yeah, sounds like it was definitely mold. Scoby is not black nor is it fuzzy. Fermenting something doesn't keep it from molding. Fermented vegetables will mold just like non fermented ones will once they're out of the water they were fermented in. Yogurt will mold when left out. Mold spores can already be in something without visible mold growth. In a mammal, if something with mold spores was eaten it would pass right to the stomach and the acids would kill it, no problem. In a bird, it sits in the crop first where the mold can do harm. And spoilage can certainly have started before there's any visible sign of it. And since you already had mold growing in your fermenting container, well, that just wouldn't have been safe to feed. You did the right thing throwing it out.

That's why I was posting to caution you about it. I was never trying to debate with those who use FF.

 

[lazy gardener]

Yes, I understand that, I'm not an idiot. That is why I am posting this to begin with. I KNOW what mold is, so I am trying to figure out how the hell people manage this method without mold.

No one is calling you an idiot. It sounds like you did have mold from your description: black, hairy. The very point I made is that the casual observer knows mold when he sees it. You rightly questioned what you were seeing. The SCOBY of FF is not black, and it is not hairy! If your ferment is covered with water, the SCOBY will float on top, and may look like a film of wet whitish flakes that will break apart when you disturb them. There will likely be some bubbles. So, perhaps you might want to start your ferment covered with water if that is more to your liking. As you get comfortable with it, you can make it dryer when you see how it looks/smells. As I said, I've never had issue with mold. I run my FF on the dry side. Almost always feed it out at 24 - 48 hours. Rarely do I keep it to 72 hours. My preference to feed it at 24 - 48.

I do not usually put any whole grains in my FF. On the rare occasions when I have, I've found that the ferment was more active. If just fermenting processed feed, and if you keep it on the dry side, you will most likely find that there is a thick film of tan to gray material laying on top of the more coarse grain particles. This IMO is not SCOBY b/c it separates out almost immediately as the feed soaks up the water.