Free rein feeding method

[Ital]

Great point! But I have learned to expect mixed opinion over a lot of things in nutrition. To start at the beginning, the particular variety of something can change the values manifold (hundreds of times better in one variety than another, in extreme cases), then there's the growing conditions, the collection and storage of the sample, the lab processes used etc.

And then of course it's not just presence but in what quantity, and how it reacts with what else you or your chickens may be eating with it, including the trillions of microbes in your gut.

And then there's the politics driven by omnivore/vegan campaigns.

Anyway, here's an alternative for quinoa stressing some of this
https://www.frontiersin.org/articles/10.3389/fnut.2020.00126/full

I’m emailing my grain supplier to ask if they can provide the actual levels. If they don’t know my quail might.

 

[Ital]

Update day 8..

Counting quail before they’ve hatched.

3 of 12 appear not to have progressed in any way and 3 have definite signs of development, not sure about the rest as the shells are quite difficult to see through so I’ll check again in a couple of days.

There seems to be a general consensus that quail are not the brightest buttons when newly hatched so I’ve decided to make it as easy as possible for them by staggering the introduction of the various foods.

I’m excited to see them making some progress and will be initially offering the following for them to choose between..

Cannabis seeds 32% protein
Crickets 58% protein
Kelp 16% protein
Amaranth 14% protein
Black soldier fly larvae 41% protein
Millet 11% protein
Nettle 31% protein
Mealworms 53% protein
Chia seeds 19% protein
Buckwheat 9.6% protein
Two water sources, one plain and one mixed with raw honey and apple cider vinegar.

If they select randomly/in equal parts from these while they’re learning then the total protein should be somewhere around 28.4%

 

[Ponyiqandhens2]

Personally, i have 40 birds, most are nearly adults,adults, yet i feed less than 100lbs of feed every 50 days. My guys free range in South Louisiana so, we have bugs year round, mosquitos, house flies, worms year round.

The only time they hit the feeders if we have heavy rain for days on end..flip side is they eat almost zero right after as extra tasty treats appear.

They also do a faor job with rodent control..

Now if i have bitties with a hen they will usually stop at chick crumbles when she brings them home at night.. and they top of with crumble.. my original flock wasnt raised thos way, but the groups since were , they grow bigger ,feather faster, heavier, more mature appearing,etc..

If you have enough area in a temperate area its possible to sustain..i throw food scraps once a week..i through 3-4 cups of scratch for a head count once a day..no onegets much.. just a treat for responding correctly

 

[Ital]

Interesting discussion, but poor experimental design. It's not really an experiment without separate treatments and controls. It is more like a demonstration.

Feed stuffs are feed stuffs. An "apparatus" is equipment;. It could be equipment to dspense feed stuffs. How food will be dispenses has not really been described and is critical. For one thing, the apparatus will have to prevent feed waste or there will at least need to be a way to measure feed waste. Otherwise, there is no data.

When the feed stuff is ground to get a small enough particles for quail to eat, there will also be fines that increase feed waste. When dried BSF larvae are ground they turn into dust. It would be best to grind the feed stuff and then sieve to a uniform particle size before weighing.and distributing to the birds.

Putting eggs in the incubator can hardly be considered the start of a feeding demonstration. Also, it might be easier to discern differences in feed stuff preference if you start with more than five or ten chicks.

It was mentioned that the demonstration would be carried for six years, but quail will be dying of old age by two years. Really, the best information will come in the first six weeks when the quail are growing to their full adult size. Monitoring growth rates is about the only basis for comparison you will have.

Best of luck with your project.

Thanks, I might need a bit of luck.

 

[Ital]

Personally, i have 40 birds, most are nearly adults,adults, yet i feed less than 100lbs of feed every 50 days. My guys free range in South Louisiana so, we have bugs year round, mosquitos, house flies, worms year round.

The only time they hit the feeders if we have heavy rain for days on end..flip side is they eat almost zero right after as extra tasty treats appear.

They also do a faor job with rodent control..

Now if i have bitties with a hen they will usually stop at chick crumbles when she brings them home at night.. and they top of with crumble.. my original flock wasnt raised thos way, but the groups since were , they grow bigger ,feather faster, heavier, more mature appearing,etc..

If you have enough area in a temperate area its possible to sustain..i throw food scraps once a week..i through 3-4 cups of scratch for a head count once a day..no onegets much.. just a treat for responding correctly

I wish I had the space to do what your doing, sounds like a good life for them.

As you’ve found with your birds and has been previously investigated and published, chickens are perfectly capable of balancing their nutritional requirement given enough variety to choose between, it’d be interesting to know the minimum diversity of ingredients needed for them to achieve this where suitable pasture isn’t available.

I can’t find any info re. quail so we’ll see how it goes.
Apparently they’re not often invited to Mensa.

 

[Ital]

10 of the 12 hatched and all seem to be in good health.

Added a few items to their menu and I’m glad I did as they seem to like them, except the garlic which causes them recoil and clean their beaks.

Today they chose between

Meal worms - very popular.
Black soldier fly larvae - moderate amount.
Crickets - moderate amount.
Chlorella - popular so thinking of getting a tank to grow some.
Garlic - small amount.
Millet - very popular.
Amaranth - popular.
Cannabis seeds - very popular.
Salt - tried it and left it.
Egg shell/oyster shell 50:50 - very little but they were eating their shells in the incubator so probably already had enough.
Dried nettles - popular.
Buckwheat - popular.
Chia seeds - popular.
Kelp - moderate amount.
Oregano - popular.
ACV and raw honey water In moderate amounts but less than the plain.

Seems to be a general preference for high protein items with some exceptions.

Quantities to be added up at the end of the week so I can recreate a sample to send off and see how they’re getting on.

Was planning on using popcorn as a b vit vehicle with some meridian yeast extract but some comments about it earlier in the thread made me worry about it, does the magnesium cause loose stools? It’s pretty much a blank canvas otherwise so can’t see why else it’d be a problem to include? Anyone had an issue with it?

 

[Kiki]

View attachment 3536641
10 of the 12 hatched and all seem to be in good health.

Added a few items to their menu and I’m glad I did as they seem to like them, except the garlic which causes them recoil and clean their beaks.

Today they chose between

Meal worms - very popular.
Black soldier fly larvae - moderate amount.
Crickets - moderate amount.
Chlorella - popular so thinking of getting a tank to grow some.
Garlic - small amount.
Millet - very popular.
Amaranth - popular.
Cannabis seeds - very popular.
Salt - tried it and left it.
Egg shell/oyster shell 50:50 - very little but they were eating their shells in the incubator so probably already had enough.
Dried nettles - popular.
Buckwheat - popular.
Chia seeds - popular.
Kelp - moderate amount.
Oregano - popular.
ACV and raw honey water In moderate amounts but less than the plain.

Seems to be a general preference for high protein items with some exceptions.

Quantities to be added up at the end of the week so I can recreate a sample to send off and see how they’re getting on.

Was planning on using popcorn as a b vit vehicle with some meridian yeast extract but some comments about it earlier in the thread made me worry about it, does the magnesium cause loose stools? It’s pretty much a blank canvas otherwise so can’t see why else it’d be a problem to include? Anyone had an issue with it?

I have never once had a quail chick ever eat an egg shell in the incubator.


Are you popping the popcorn first?

 

[Ital]

I have never once had a quail chick ever eat an egg shell in the incubator.

Are you popping the popcorn first?

Yeah I was worried because I’ve read you have to give them water before food and they were all doing it while I waited for the last two to dry but they were also drinking the condensation from the sides so maybe that helped.

Pop it, grind it up and mix it with meridian yeast extract was the plan. The extract is really sticky stuff so it’s that or mix with water but it’d be easier to send samples off if it’s part of a solid.

 

[Kiki]

I have never once had a quail chick ever eat an egg shell in the incubator.

Yeah I was worried because I’ve read you have to give them water before food and they were all doing it while I waited for the last two to dry but they were also drinking the condensation from the sides so maybe that helped.

Pop it, grind it up and mix it with meridian yeast extract was the plan. The extract is really sticky stuff so it’s that or mix with water.

I am glad to hear you won't be feeding the kernels whole.

Will you please do me a huge favor and take a picture of this mixture of stuff you are offering...all mixed up...in the quail cage?

Your list of things doesn't make sense to me, not that it matters to you, but I'd really just like to see if.

Quail can only eat so much food stuffs per day and I am wondering what a 1/4 cup worth of your mixture looks like

I'd stop the garlic today.
You might find this interesting.
https://zupreem.com/avian/toxic-foo...ople expect that onions,birds, cats, and dogs.

​

 

[U_Stormcrow]

Pork fat is a top ten most nutritious food?
Really?
I'm willing to explore how they determined that but... really!?


No. The data set isn't in S1 other than the two examples.

Their sets look for densities of fat, protein, carb, etc together with strong links to certain trace minerals and vitamins - that's why "meat-like" veggies generally did so poorly. Its more an efficiency thing than a balance thing - the balaance comes from combining efficiencies across differing groups.

Even so, when you download the sample (partial) data set, some of the stuff makes little sense - ground versions of a whole product generally fared MUCH worse than the whole product. Also, their price data is simply crazy. Though it might fairly reflect pricing in their area, I suppose.