Gold Laced Orpington- For Learning and Sharing

Pics
So far as true blacks, I researched this a couple years ago when I had both blues and blacks and was trying to figure out what rooster to use. Boy did I make a mistake there. Just like others, took bad advice. But here's what I eventually found out after asking and asking and looking at the poultry genetics thingie and everything else:

Blue is a modifier. It inhibits black and turns it "blue." The best blues are those with a silver base to the black rather than gold. Then you go to the blue gene itself.

The gene that creates blue is either present, or it's not. If a bird is visually black, it has no "blue" gene in it. It didn't get that one. BUT, it's not considered a true black because of the assumption that it has silver under there rather than the gold, which "true" blacks have that helps produce a shimmering green sheen.

That being an assumption. A "true" black line has the gold under there rather than silver. If it has a fantastic green sheen when in good condition, it's probably as true a black as you could possibly have. Especially if you breed a few generations as has been suggested and get all blacks of good quality sheen.

Remember blue is a modifier. One copy = blue. Two copies = splash. No copies = black. That black one does not have a blue gene in it. Else it would be blue or splash.

This silver or gold thing is also why a bird of a "pure black" line is not considered desirable for breeding to blues. The assumption being it has gold under there rather than silver and won't make as good a blue. I keep saying "assumption" because unless you know all the bird's lineage, or have enough experience to see it (which I do not) then you don't really know for sure if that gold is there or not.

I guess really the best way to think of the silver/gold thing is like the gene for blue. If it has the gold enhancer, it has it, if not, it's got a silver base. Or to be more correct, if it has the gold inhibitor, then it's silver, and if it doesn't, it's gold. I think of it backwards.
 
Last edited:
Gale,
Thanks for this information..
I have an additional question for clarification.

Are you recommending according to your research to NOT breed a blue to a true black ?
 
So far as true blacks, I researched this a couple years ago when I had both blues and blacks and was trying to figure out what rooster to use. Boy did I make a mistake there. Just like others, took bad advice. But here's what I eventually found out after asking and asking and looking at the poultry genetics thingie and everything else:

Blue is a modifier. It inhibits black and turns it "blue." The best blues are those with a silver base to the black rather than gold. Then you go to the blue gene itself.

The gene that creates blue is either present, or it's not. If a bird is visually black, it has no "blue" gene in it. It didn't get that one. BUT, it's not considered a true black because of the assumption that it has silver under there rather than the gold, which "true" blacks have that helps produce a shimmering green sheen.

That being an assumption. A "true" black line has the gold under there rather than silver. If it has a fantastic green sheen when in good condition, it's probably as true a black as you could possibly have. Especially if you breed a few generations as has been suggested and get all blacks of good quality sheen.

Remember blue is a modifier. One copy = blue. Two copies = splash. No copies = black. That black one does not have a blue gene in it. Else it would be blue or splash.

This silver or gold thing is also why a bird of a "pure black" line is not considered desirable for breeding to blues. The assumption being it has gold under there rather than silver and won't make as good a blue. I keep saying "assumption" because unless you know all the bird's lineage, or have enough experience to see it (which I do not) then you don't really know for sure if that gold is there or not.

I guess really the best way to think of the silver/gold thing is like the gene for blue. If it has the gold enhancer, it has it, if not, it's got a silver base. Or to be more correct, if it has the gold inhibitor, then it's silver, and if it doesn't, it's gold. I think of it backwards.
Great explanation Sarah ! This is what I've been trying to get the Silkie people to understand.There has been so much interest in Silkies about BBS, that they have almost lost true blacks. We've got to keep some lines of pure blacks in Orps who carry red, and have the green sheen.The underfluff will tell you every time, especially in laced varieties like Dee's GLOs.
 
Gale,
Thanks for this information..
I have an additional question for clarification.

Are you recommending according to your research to NOT breed a blue to a true black ?

 


It has been recommended to me by people that know more than I do, not to. I did forget about the red part in there like Vickie brought up. But it doesn't apply to blue coloring as far as I know so I didn't mention it.

This is what made me start researching it to begin with. I was told not to use a "true black" with blues. I kept asking why and kept getting nonsense answers like "because a black from a blue line is better." Well why, then? No answers. Finally one or two popped up with the silver/gold and all that stuff. I THINK it was OSUMan that first clued me in about that, and Jeremy knew about it as well. I'm sure others do, they just didn't see the questions I guess.

I'm going to go back to the assumption thing again when it comes to gold inhibitor. Your blues could have been bred to a "true" black at some point in their line, thus it might or might not have that inhibitor.
 
Last edited:
I too am starting a true black line for my GL. How many generations of blk x blk (both visibly blk) would it take to consider them pure blks? Since I've not owned any blks, this is probably a stupid question to most, but will I be able to look at the underfluff and tell, or look for the green?
 
This is what DragonLady has taught me to look for. I will have to look for the connection of the dark fluff and the green sheen. Max has green sheen throughout. Look at the bold black in his fluff.



I will photograph two girls today or tomorrow, depending on weather- it might rain all day. One I believe came from a GL Blue x GL Blk cross. It will be easy to see the difference if you see them side to side.
 
Ok. then it sounds like there really isn't a True black.... either it is black/silver or it is black/gold.
Or put another way, it's either a black with a gold inhibitor id or one without id+. It gets a crap shoot of them from each parent and the inhibitor is dominant. It gets really muddy after that and I too depend on someone with real experience to tell me how to visually know. I simply do not. I know the book learnin' part but not the hands on part.

sorry, trying to type with a cockatiel running around on the keyboard is all but impossible. Hope that was a little clearer than mud! :lol:
 
Last edited:

New posts New threads Active threads

Back
Top Bottom