*****Help!! **** 4-H project, but we don't know what breed we have?

Discussion in 'What Breed Or Gender is This?' started by leighgrider, Jun 24, 2010.

  1. leighgrider

    leighgrider New Egg

    Jun 24, 2010
    :)Good Evening,
    My name is Leigh Ann, my daughter is showing poultry this year in 4H. This is her first year. We have arrived at some confustion of the breed of her 2 roosters and 1 hen. Can some help us?

    We were told that we had Malasian serama's 1 rooster and 1 hen. The rooster has a black mottled breast, white and dark green tail feathers. The hen is brown and cream.

    The other rooster was Belgian Barbu D-anvers - he has a rose comb and white breast. I will try to figure out how to upload pictures.


    This is our hen? ?serama



    Rooster? Serama black mottled breast white/green feathers


    front of rooster white breast/rose comb Is this a Barbu D'anvers?


    This is our rooster rose comb and white belly - other picture shows the breast
    Last edited: Jun 24, 2010
  2. Kovalciks Chickens

    Kovalciks Chickens Chillin' With My Peeps

    Aug 25, 2009
    Richmond, Michigan
    3rd pic down looks like a Dutch roo but I have never seen one with that much white, it may be crossed with a Dutch. On the other hand he also looks like a Speckled Sussex
    The 1st pic looks to be a hen and she looks to be a Ameraucana....maybe. How old are they?
    I have never seen serema chickens but i googled them and they come in all colors so it may. But the Sememas are about the size of a pop can. I think yours are a little bigger.
    i do believe that the other roo is a Belgian Barbu D-anvers.

    Hope this helps
  3. Ondra's Seramas

    Ondra's Seramas Drowning in Seramas

    Feb 19, 2009
    North Central WA
    I don't know what they are, but I do know that those do not look like Seramas. If they are, they are mixed breed Seramas. [​IMG] Hope you can get it figured out!
  4. speakup4kids

    speakup4kids Chillin' With My Peeps

    Apr 3, 2010
    Yuba City , CA
    I don't know what that hen is... maybe a better picture would help. It looks kind of odd in the one posted. The rooster that is supposed to be a serama has some of the features and stance of a serama. Maybe if you posted the age and could possibly weigh it that would help???
  5. Ondra's Seramas

    Ondra's Seramas Drowning in Seramas

    Feb 19, 2009
    North Central WA
    Quote:Hmm. It looks like a Japanese to me. The tail and wings aren't vertical, but almost, like a Japenese. Also, the no chest and long back are more characteristics of Japanese. Also, Japanese are much more common.

    What do you think?
  6. High Roost Ranch

    High Roost Ranch The Chicken Whisperer

    Hi Leigh Ann, welcome to the BYC.

    OK, first let me get you through your entry form.

    The seramas you would enter as AOV on the color because they are both of a non-recognized color variety.

    Your other boy is supposed to be a "Belgian Bearded d'Anver" and I say supposed to be because he isn't bearded & muffed as he should be. He's also on the Quail color gene but it's very washed out, impure looking. So you would enter him as that breed, with the color variety being Quail.

    Now, someone said your seramas weren't good quality. For your first time, they'll get you the show and handling experience you need, and while I can't see much of your hen, the cock could be better quality. Most 4-H shows base their judging per ABA (American Bantam Association) or APA (American Poultry Association) rules and standards. That being said, not all 4-H shows operate this way. Ask your poultry committee which rules they follow.

    If your show does follow ABA or APA rules, be prepared for the following to happen if you have a very stringent by the book judge.
    1) your seramas, even if not of good quality, are technically safe because there is no ABA acceptance of this breed. So they cannot be technically DQ'd per ABA standards. If you enter them as AOV color, they cannot be DQ'd because of incorrect color. And they are AOV in color. The cock for example may look mottled to you but it's a phenotype (what you see) not a genotype (what he truly is genetically) and most judges will get you on that one if they know anything about seramas at all. They can be color bred, but in very few cases should one enter a serama at this point in their development under a known color variety. It's safest to use AOV with Seramas.
    2) Sadly, your d'Anver has a good possibility of being DQ'd because first, he lacks the breed's beard & muffs, and secondly because his color isn't correct. You could opt to enter him as AOV (which means any other variety NOT recognized by ABA/APA) and that may save him from a color DQ but not a breed characteristic DQ because of the lacking of beard & muffs. The ABA Standard of Perfection declares a lack of beard & muffs as a DQ/disqualification.

    So, enter your birds as I suggested above, take this as a learning experience (which is what it really should be after all), don't be too disappointed if any are DQ'd (part of the hard knocks of learning correct poultry breed standards) and if you want any help in the future picking a [correct to a breed standard] bird for your daughter, I'd be more than happy to help you. If someone at the show has either an ABA or APA Standard of Perfection book, ask them if you can look at the Bearded Belgian d'Anver, specifically the breed itself and then the quail color, and you will see how the standard reads and how it compares to your boy. I believe your d'Anver is a crossbred to be honest with you.

    Good luck, if you need any help with your entry form, PM me and I'll be glad to walk you through it.
    Last edited: Jun 24, 2010
  7. Qi Chicken

    Qi Chicken Chillin' With My Peeps

    Jul 3, 2009
    I just wanted to say nice job High Roost Ranch. That was extremely helpful, both to the OP and all the lurkers! One question, what does AOV stand for exactly?
  8. Ondra's Seramas

    Ondra's Seramas Drowning in Seramas

    Feb 19, 2009
    North Central WA
    Quote:All Other Varieties, I think.
  9. High Roost Ranch

    High Roost Ranch The Chicken Whisperer

    Quote:Thank you.

    Simply put, each recognized breed has their approved or accepted color varieties for either the ABA or APA. AOV is any color that is NOT one of those recognized ABA or APA color varieties. AOV covers any and all non recognized colors and stands for Any Other Variety.

    I'm always glad to help where I can. We were all beginners at one time or another, and seeing kids interested in poultry is the future of our hobby! [​IMG]
  10. LizzyJo

    LizzyJo Chillin' With My Peeps

    Jan 27, 2009
    Aptos CA
    Pretty chickens, but I don't know a thing about them. I do have some concerns, though.

    Is there wire behind that lattice panel?

    Do those guys have someplace that doesn't have rocks under their feet? They need dirt to take dust baths and scratch around in.

    Why two roosters and one hen?

    Just something to think about.

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