HELP! Second hen to get bloating/green feces, emaciated breast

[bucky52]

I lost all three of my red star sex link hens to internal egg laying.they were 3 years old.the first one I lost I noticed she had clear fluid coming from her mouth.I just thought she had over drank with water.it had been so hot.And than a few days later she filled with so much fluid.She look like a basket ball..I asked for help here on BYC.I was told that the fluid coming from her mouth came from all her internal organs shutting down.and there was no cure. I lost her in 2013 than a month later i lost my second hen .I was on watch and new I was going to lose MY third hen..I did this last July.Her poo looked like egg yolk.slimy yellow and green.she would take a few steps and would sat down and rest.her breathing shook her whole body.she no longer was interested in food.and stayed away from the rest of her coop mates.I made the decision to have her put down.when I picked her up she was skin and bones.kissed her good bye with tears running down my face.my hens are my pets.Good luck.You have come to the right place.BYC has helped me so many times on caring for my girls.

 

[seminolewind]

Bucky, from what I've read , super egg layers are prone to EYP because their cloaca (?) loses it's muscle tone and that allows e. coli to waltz in, and infect the ovary and cause the EYP. Poor hens they work so hard!

 

[aldarita]

I have had different hens with egg peritonitis, they have been seen by an avian vet (lucky to have one nearby). The vet told me that when the eggs fall into the abdomen (rather than the oviduct) they get an infection and there is fluid that builds up and makes the abdomen to distend, when this happens it makes them hard to breath because of the pressure the fluid is causing in their lungs. Sometimes the poop is watery like egg white. I have had them euthanized before the situation got any worse because once they have this problem, there is nothing you can do about it. Usually production hens have this problem towards the end of their egg laying period.

 

[NorthGAChick]

Thanks seminolewind, you say, hopefully not - is it not usually curable? How does one reach speckledhen to get instructions or do you have a link?

 

[seminolewind]

Here's her most recent bout

https://www.backyardchickens.com/t/...-cc-of-nasty-yellow-fluid-photo-rip-hope/0_50

Kathy's really good with meds-maybe a bit obsessive

E. coli is one of the most common killers of chickens. I made myself open my dear hen Henrietta a month or so ago. She was filled with dry egg yolk, like 2 cups worth. No smell or anything. But her ovary was really big, so I imagine that was where the infection got in. I have pictures if you want to see. They are in my profile albums.

Emaciated breast and green feces usually means there at the end of starvation. So I don't know what to say. There is really nothing you can do aside from drain her belly and make her comfortable.

 

[NorthGAChick]

Not the egg peritonitis with mine, in my opinion and the vet... My last hen that had this, I did an x-ray and sonogram and it was not an egg, according to a non-chicken vet. She said some kindof cancer because of the fluid she tested and took some off to relieve her, I treated with antibiotics and she got better for a while. Everything works for a little while and then it comes back which says to me the dosage is wrong? I guess she could be wrong, but my hen lived six more months, so she was probably right because like you all are saying with the egg peritonitis it's a pretty quick death. This is more of some kind of gut/intestinal issue, probably because the Corid would not get rid of the cocci completely and they had a long battle with it and it did damage which my understanding is another thing entirely? This is day three of the baytril and flagyl and if she doesn't look any better by tomorrow, I'm not going to wonder if this is the right direction. From my searching it looks more like the "ovarian cancer" green poo in this link on Chicken Chick. It just seems awfully weird that one would get it and six months later would get it again and then two months later another one would get it????? Scroll down to the green (without blood) two photos that she says "ovarian cancer" and they culled the hen right away which is what my vet wanted to do and I took the hen (a previous one) home, gave them all baths and found a hole in my hen, cleaned it and treated it everyday and she was fine for six months and then started swelling again, culled her in June and now this one (her sister-by closeness-they came together) has it now? Just doesn't seem like ovarian cancer to me either???? I'm still thinking something in the gut is majorly infected???
http://www.the-chicken-chick.com/2012/02/whats-scoop-on-chicken-poop-digestive.html

 

[seminolewind]

EYP can take a long time. Mine took probably months, and 6 months ago it seemed to resolve for a bit and was noticeable again a month before she died.

Green poo may be any illness that causes wasting . If the cocci did damage, that could mean that e. coli moved in,

I recently had one die of enteritis and cocci, the cause of the enteritis was hair worms and the cocci moved in . I had one with enteritis that was loaded with e. coli. I wish I could say it was treatable at this point, but I can't.

The gut can be affected (the peritonitis ?) but the cause is usually somewhere else and leaks into that area.

The only best answers you will get is sending the hen for a necropsy when she dies or she is euthanized. I have a link below all about sending a hen and where to send it to.

 

[seminolewind]

Thanks seminolewind, you say, hopefully not - is it not usually curable? How does one reach speckledhen to get instructions or do you have a link?

Hi. you can pm speckledhen. I'm sure she would be very helpful, as will Casportpony, or Nambroth. Those are the first two names that come to mind.

 

[casportpony]

Give the Baytril and metronidazole a chance to work. What doses are you giving?

-Kathy

 

[NorthGAChick]

I'm doing the baytril and the flagyl and it's day 4 and she's not any better, I don't think, but no worse either except I am not seeing any feces in the bed in the morning. It's like she is completely stopped up now. She is still very swollen but it doesn't seem as watery/soft? Either way it doesn't look good?

Vet was off Monday and never called me back today - all I asked for was dosage - they are not interested in treating chickens, especially when he hasn't diagnosed it - well, I paid for 3 fecal matter tests and he gave me nothing as far as her condition and I had that feces separate. Poor chickens, vet medicine has abandoned the animal who feeds the world the most - as two protein sources. Kind of unfair. Downright ungrateful, in fact!

I think we're on track though because of all the treatments trying to get rid of the cocci - it probably depleted the good bacteria. I offered her some yogurt this morning and she ate that like she was starving - she hasn't even been interested in meal worms! I found clostridium problems in humans (you know they can die from it too?) is the flagyl/metho stuff you recommended!? Your vet seems right on...here's the excerpt on the human issue.. from this link...
http://www.gastro.org/patient-cente...ridium-difficile-infection-and-its-treatments
Antibiotics. Stopping the antibiotics that allow C. difficile to grow and receiving fluids resolves the infection in about 20 percent of people who are infected with the bacteria. However, if that is not successful, your doctor may prescribe a different type of antibiotic to specifically treat the C. difficile infection. For a mild or moderate infection, the first choice is usually metronidazole for 10 to 14 days. For a severe infection, the first choice is usually vancomycin for 10 to 14 days. If those don’t work, your doctor may try fidaxomicin or rifaximin.

Here's a video of her just now... tell me what you think???
http://youtu.be/2N3BM_pRl3I

She's moving around fine, but she beds down earlier and that's how I caught that something was wrong. I really think we are on track with the clostridium type of problem, but not the egg because the other one who had it - I did x-rays and sonogram and it was not an egg and it went on and off for almost a year.

Do you think I should separate her because if she got it from the other one, surely the others can get it from her, right? That human article said it's highly contagious.

And since the others aren't showing signs, should I just do things to boost their immune system and what is the best thing to boost the immune system of a chicken after antibiotics?

I just did some more research while the video was uploading and this sounds exactly like it. It does seem that adding probiotics is good. I use the horse one in the blue and white tube, do you think that is okay? Or, just do yogurt? Do you think I we are still using the correct treatment? Here's the link for the same issue in chickens...

http://www.thepoultrysite.com/artic...ted-bacterial-enteritides-in-broiler-chickens
Well known as the cause of necrotic enteritis, C. perfringens (CP) is now recognized as causing a spectrum of effects including subclinical infection, mild disease with focal intestinal necrosis, diarrhoeal illness and liver disease, as well as the classic form of acute fulminant necrotizing enteritis...
When this process results in mild disease, characterized, for example, by the production of gas and fluid within the intestinal lumen (Pattison, 2002), it is referred to as dysbacteriosis - a phenomenon that is well recognized in humans and other animal species. Studies of the intestinal microflora in both normal and clinically affected broilers suggest that CP may be one of a variety of organisms that, when they proliferate within the intestinal lumen, can impact on performance...
The prudent use of feed additives with demonstrated efficacy against CP is also recommended and, in some cases, essential for the prevention of NE or treatment of outbreaks when they occur. A variety of authors have described the susceptibility of CP to various antimicrobial agents in vitro including bacitracin, penicillin, virginiamycin, lincomycin, lasalocid, tylosin, avilamycin and narasin (Bernier, 1974x; Dutta and Devriese, 1980; Kondo, 1988; Benno et al., 1988; Watkins et al., 1997).
the above says "in vitro" and not grown and the only one I recognize above is penicillin and I do have the capsules that I could switch to???

Mainly I wanted to know if you still think we are on the right track....because I think this is 100% what she is suffering from... THANK YOU!!!

Oh, and like Seminolewind says - would it be good to drain her belly some to help her be able to eat? And if so, how do you drain the fluid? Or is there a diuretic I can give her that will help? I may still be able to find watermelon as a natural diuretic?

THANK YOU - WE'RE GOING TO BEAT THIS AND SHE'S GOING TO BE ALL RIGHT. It was that long term cocci problem that Corid didn't get rid of. She did get thicker poo again whilst on the sulfa for the cocci.