Heritage Large Fowl - Phase II

[BGMatt]

BGMatt-- You clearly had experience to guide you and only langhans would do to go along with old english games and leghorns. I detect a trend here. lol

Well yes, experience. But that's what I was saying. I see a lot of people just want to help a "Heritage" breed and aren't as picky about (the obviously superior LOL) breeds, should be able to find local stock of high quality to work with.

The comment about trend went way over my head, you'll have to explain that one to me. (If I wasn't so stubborn I would have just gone with a more common variety of Leghorns though.)

 

[Arielle]

Quote: In my ignorance of all the breeds of chickens, I see the langhan, leghorn and OE as similar in the spectrum of chickens.

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I am reminded of my uncle that raised racing pigeons-- an excellent breeder according to his dtr. He started at 16 and continued for the rest of his life. I'm sure his daughter helped in the later years but he sure had a reason to get up in the morning, to exercise and feed his birds. He won a lot of races, knew how to train them and how to breed them. No sick birds in his flock-- they didn't stay long. He would sit on his bench every afternoon while they flew and exercised .

I think Bob was right-- when starting out, go for the easier birds like a solid ie white, and the hurdles are lower and easier and then raising good birds are more pleasurable. I have 2 that are difficult colors and it can be very frustrating bc/ too much to learn right off the bat. Start simple, avoid complex colors.I learned my lesson the hard way.

 

[gjensen]

Most breeders of exhibition poultry do not hang out on the web, so unless you know how to find them you won't find them and they could be very close to you. Finding good breeders doesn't seem to happen via the web unless you find someone who is online and happens to have a phone number of a breeder. Best way is to go to shows .....second best way is to join the APA and get a yearbook that will list almost all the serious poultry breeders. Probably the worst way to find a good breeder is online. There are too many fakes to weed through and some are really good "internet breeders", so they can charm the dollars right out of your pocket real fast..

Management and environment are the key factors when birds are moved a few thousand miles. As a rule if you are getting birds from a knowledgeable breeder you should not have any problems with birds getting used to a new place. I have sent Oriental breeds to MN and they have done well .......even though they prefer a warmer climate. IMO it is how strong the birds are rather than where they are.

Walt

I used the web to get a list of judges phone numbers and called them one by one. Many had never seen what I was looking for, and others had not seen any in a long time. I even asked you. Everyone was helpful and shared what they knew.

Eventually I went back to where I should have started, but did not because of a rumor. Since then I used the web to locate three other people working with them. Two seriously. As far as I know that is it.

If I had just went to shows, I would not have gotten anywhere in my case.

Information is easy to access now. All you need is the name of a breeder. If it could be had, it can be found. If you keep asking and keep looking names come up. I ran down quite a few people that used to have them.

I agree that the web is not necessarily a good way when you have to sort through so much crap. I am bringing up an exception in the case of some very rare breeds. It is possible to take a little more.

 

[BGMatt]

In my ignorance of all the breeds of chickens, I see the langhan, leghorn and OE as similar in the spectrum of chickens.

---------

I am reminded of my uncle that raised racing pigeons-- an excellent breeder according to his dtr. He started at 16 and continued for the rest of his life. I'm sure his daughter helped in the later years but he sure had a reason to get up in the morning, to exercise and feed his birds. He won a lot of races, knew how to train them and how to breed them. No sick birds in his flock-- they didn't stay long. He would sit on his bench every afternoon while they flew and exercised .

I think Bob was right-- when starting out, go for the easier birds like a solid ie white, and the hurdles are lower and easier and then raising good birds are more pleasurable. I have 2 that are difficult colors and it can be very frustrating bc/ too much to learn right off the bat. Start simple, avoid complex colors.I learned my lesson the hard way.

Oh, ok. No worries, just confused. Actually all three fill different niches (although all are expected to produce, and all are expected to hold their own in show room). The Langshans are a dual purpose bird, that when bred properly should be able to hold their own meat and egg wise with some of the more common breeds, also a brown egg layer for folks that care about brown vs white. The Leghorns are my egg laying specialists so when folks are looking for just eggs from their birds, thats what I can offer them. The Old English Game are bantams, and are purely ornamental, always the biggest class in the show room and most competitive, also great for kids in 4-H and such. Seemed like good ways to fill the three most common needs of poultry since I had room for 2 large fowl breeds and 1 bantam breed, although I suppose in retrospect only the egg laying spot was not pre-determined since natural bias meant Langshans, and the fact that one of my best friends is a top OEGB breeder meant the Dual Purpose and Show slots were going to be filled. LOL

Bob was right on that. The more complex the breed the harder it is to breed. Things newcomers might want to avoid, feathered legs, extreme tails, challenging personalities (i.e. large game fowl), crested fowl. Then when it comes to varieties, Black and White are good. Patterns can be very challenging, "solid" colors like Blue and Buff can be very challenging as well.

HOWEVER. I'm a big believer that you have to absolutely love what you raise, and be super dedicated to them. Otherwise you won't last. Breeding and raising poultry properly is a lot of work, a lot of time, and a lot of money. If you absolutely must have Speckled Sussex? Yes the pattern is a pain in the rear, but do it. Black Wyandottes (or any other yellow legged Black bird)? Go for it, you'll be banging your head against the wall trying to get proper leg color on females but it's worth it. Red Shouldered Yokohama? Tough pattern, long tails that drag on the ground are big challenges, but you can do it.

 

[hellbender]

Haahaaaa--



Reminds me of a black anguscow that would kick me IN THE THIGH--perfect aim-- everytime. I hate black angus to this day!! ( My apologies to those that like the breed-- I"m happy to eat every one though!)

I run a few head of Angus but not enough to keep a bull. I prefer Angus because the public is on an 'Angus' run now and has been for a while. I have my cows AI'd and keep my semen straws in the neighbor's (dairy man) tank and he helps me by doing the procedure.

I wonder if they have come up with a way to 'collect' poultry cocks yet? That would be a major step forward and could be a major advancement in husbandry of poultry.

My best cows are bred to a bull out of Missouri.

 

[call ducks]

Quote: Err... Why yes and no... It's a bit more complicated than large livestock. You can AI hens just like anything else - however storage is the issue.

They can collect the gametes from chicks and store them for later use (implant into other bird)

 

[hellbender]

Err... Why yes and no... It's a bit more complicated than large livestock. You can AI hens just like anything else - however storage is the issue.

They can collect the gametes from chicks and store them for later use (implant into other bird)

Yes...that is somewhat more complicated than I want to deal with. Not interested in embryo transplants but was thinking of a more direct process of using frozen semen from a cock that might be anywhere in the world and be able to fertilize a hen directly with an AI procedure. I'm certain it can/has been done but it would have to be prohibitively expensive.

 

[thedragonlady]

I run a few head of Angus but not enough to keep a bull. I prefer Angus because the public is on an 'Angus' run now and has been for a while. I have my cows AI'd and keep my semen straws in the neighbor's (dairy man) tank and he helps me by doing the procedure.

I wonder if they have come up with a way to 'collect' poultry cocks yet? That would be a major step forward and could be a major advancement in husbandry of poultry.

My best cows are bred to a bull out of Missouri.

Having had a semen tank for years, for cattle and Nubians, I've already asked this question. Collecting is not the problem. Extending and freezing is.Can you imagine the size of a one dose straw ?Fewer chilly arm pits though !

 

[catdaddyfro]

Yes...that is somewhat more complicated than I want to deal with. Not interested in embryo transplants but was thinking of a more direct process of using frozen semen from a cock that might be anywhere in the world and be able to fertilize a hen directly with an AI procedure. I'm certain it can/has been done but it would have to be prohibitively expensive.

Never studied up on that (cold storing/freezing poultry semen) interesting. I know they AI turkeys and collect the semen to do it. It's simply because those commercial type 60+ lb males are to awkward to "do it" I know they directly take what is collected and it goes straight to the hen house for AI breeding. (there is a certain time allowance here but I think it is in hours)

Does anyone know if it is possible to freeze store poultry semen or is there a problem with that method. I have an idea but it sure sounds like and interesting study.

Jeff


Ok I typed my post out before I got the Vickie's response so go around what she already answered then LOL

 

[call ducks]

Quote: Yah - the really only good way to save poultry is to save there gametes (harvested at a young age).

Everything else is downpat now. I know they have been using (chickens or ducks forget what one) as a host for gametes of other endangered birds. Now the only issue with that is you have to cull two in order to get the gametes. Butt you could (if that desperate) use ones that would be culls.... But mind you breeding endangered animals is approached differently than poultry...