Heritage Large Fowl - Phase II

[3riverschick]

Does anyone speak German on this list? I have a quote from a german poultry book
and this word " Weißsprenkelung " has cropped up. Google Translate cannot translate it.
"Alfred Mehner - 1983 - Snippet view - More editions
To spotting in the true sense but it is not here. This secondary Weißsprenkelung is genetically recessive (Punnett and Pease 1927), intermediate staining of speckled Erminette chickens is inherited ..."
Thanks for any help you can give.
Best,
Karen

 

[Fred's Hens]

Does anyone speak German on this list? I have a quote from a german poultry book
and this word " Weißsprenkelung " has cropped up. Google Translate cannot translate it.
"Alfred Mehner - 1983 - Snippet view - More editions
To spotting in the true sense but it is not here. This secondary Weißsprenkelung is genetically recessive (Punnett and Pease 1927), intermediate staining of speckled Erminette chickens is inherited ..."
Thanks for any help you can give.
Best,
Karen

Weiss is my mother's maiden name. It is White in English. The term means white mottling.

 

[Arielle]

Quote: Karen, sorry you lost the best of the two-- glad you have a chance to find a replacement.

I think this all speaks to the differences between breedsd and that there should be differences. Each area had different rearing practices is nmy bet and the bird was developed ti fit the bill.
thanks. it was Thing2 I lost... I had such high hopes for him. LOL an then he had to go save his girls from the coons. lost several of my roos that month, for the same reasons. only lost 1 pullet and 1 hen, both were taken off the broodie's nest in the horse trailer (coop).

Thing2... not the best pics of him, but my 2 favorite pics. 8)



Handsome !! Looks just like my 2 yr old BC marans rooster.

 

[KPenley]

Weiss is my mother's maiden name. It is White in English. The term means white mottling.

x2 Literally "white speckles"

 

[3riverschick]

x2 Literally "white speckles"

Thank you both! I never learned the language even tho my maiden name was Zwissler,
my mother's Yontz and her mother's Freidiger (sp?). Only one lone Robertson in my
great grandparents. All the rest are German.
Best,
Karen

 

[ki4got]

I can and will only speak to our birds. We're pushing them and selecting for earlier maturity. Waiting a year for the adults to gain their size and waiting 9-10 weeks for feathering of chicks and waiting 38 weeks for the pullets to begin to lay……. all this, (and this is just my take), is far too long. I don't expect these heirloom Reds and Rocks to compete with the modern, fast, fast, fast hatchery stock, don't need or want them to, but really, my concern is that breeds face possible extinction with rates this slow. Other than fanciers, who can tolerate such slow growth? I believe these venerable American breeds and can do better, if we focus on selecting for faster development. If we could see a 10-15% improvement, it would stimulate much more interest in them.

Matt, I like your 90% at 6 month target. That has meaning to me.

well, the 'dottes are aggravating to me, but the dorkings feather rapidly and my hens are usually laying by 5 months or so, but they build frame first, then slowly build on that... IMO that is why the dorking meat is superior to other breeds. I processed an 18 month old roo who was tenderer and better flavored than any grocery store 12 week old mutant. just my opinion of course.

then again, free ranging these slow growing dorkings is costing me practically NOTHING in feed, because they ARE slow growing, they also have a slow metabolism and are able to forage for enough stuff during the day.

 

[Wisher1000]

then again, free ranging these slow growing dorkings is costing me practically NOTHING in feed, because they ARE slow growing, they also have a slow metabolism and are able to forage for enough stuff during the day.

I understand that having sufficient meat on the carcass at a young age prevents you from having to feed them longer to get them to eating size, but I see a considerable value in a bird that can feed itself and not require expensive commercial feed to reach it's processing weight. If you are figuring cost per pound of meat in the freezer, the slow growing, self sufficient fowl would be vastly more valuable. This goes against all that I have read from some well respected sources, but in the context of improving the qualities of a heritage breed, which is more important?

 

[BGMatt]

I can and will only speak to our birds. We're pushing them and selecting for earlier maturity. Waiting a year for the adults to gain their size and waiting 9-10 weeks for feathering of chicks and waiting 38 weeks for the pullets to begin to lay……. all this, (and this is just my take), is far too long. I don't expect these heirloom Reds and Rocks to compete with the modern, fast, fast, fast hatchery stock, don't need or want them to, but really, my concern is that breeds face possible extinction with rates this slow. Other than fanciers, who can tolerate such slow growth? I believe these venerable American breeds and can do better, if we focus on selecting for faster development. If we could see a 10-15% improvement, it would stimulate much more interest in them.

Matt, I like your 90% at 6 month target. That has meaning to me.

Awesome. I'm always beating the drum for standard bred poultry, and it takes wind out of the sails when you have to acknowledge their are breeders out there that don't push or care about productivity. Especially for dual purpose fowl like Rocks, Reds, Dorkings, etc. you can't wait til they're a year old to reach weight, that's going to make them tough and inedible. Yes, given enough time some birds might catch up to and maybe rarely surpass size of the faster maturing birds, BUT if you breed from those birds your line is going to get slower and slower maturing. The cost though is huge...I haven't had your line of Barred Rocks, but I did have a great line of White Rocks at one point, and the Asiatics, and Orpingtons, and Dorkings, and they all eat a ton. , waiting for 8+ months to get eggs? 10+ months for meat? Doesn't make sense. I'll wait 10-11 months for tail feathering (showing Langshan cockerels is an exercise of frustration and patience), but for meat and eggs? No way.

Good for you! There was a time when these breeds did well in the showroom & were productive. With proper selection of breeders there's no reason they can't fit both needs again. A standard bred RI Red will probably never lat 325 eggs a year but there's no reason they shouldn't be able to lay 250-275. The American breeds were all intended to be dual purpose, not ornamental. I'm not sure just when or why show breeders decided productivity didn't matter but they did.
Some other breeds are even worse. I have OEGB breeder friends who have show winning females that lay 10 or less eggs a year. In my opinion a fundimental responsibility of a chicken is to lay eggs & if they don't do that they're not very good chickens. Hard to reproduce chickens if they won't lay eggs.

Definitely agree here. And for those of us that like to show, and promote standard bred birds, we really need to wake up and make sure the birds are productive if we want the fancy, and the shows to stick around. You're not going to recruit a lot of new show folks if they have to keep a show flock AND a flock for eggs and meat, just not gonna happen. Even the OEGB.

 

[Fred's Hens]

This is a good conversation. Each of us has our own goals for our specific breed(s). I'm not on any soapbox. I am merely expressing my own goals and desires. After 50+ years of keeping birds, I don't do this for anyone's else expectations, but for my own.

Our line of Barred Rocks is now my own. It is built on a foundation of two other lines, but from now on, it's no one else's but my own, good, bad or indifferent. Reading the poultry journals from the early 1900's one can see birds that rival the best Rocks of today, laying 260-280 eggs, maturing in a reasonable time and snatched right from the farm pen and taken to fairs and shows of the era. Stunning good birds. The glory days of the true dual purpose fowl.

Again, each breeder has to have their own vision and goals. So be it. Here? I'll be pushing to cut laying starts from 38 weeks down to 30 weeks. That's the goal. I want SOP weights in 8 months, not 10. These are my own goals. This makes me happy and that's all that really matters. I've really no one else to please or impress. Those of you a bit older may understand.

 

[Wisher1000]

Being in my second half of a century, I fully understand not being concerned with pleasing anyone else but myself (and family,) I'm right there with you, Fred! I am only wondering aloud. I know that I would rather have a bird ready at that point, but also one who doesn't stand at the trough for the whole 8 months to get there.