Hi All! I'm a professional poultry nutritionist

[Debbie292d]

Hiya, and welcome to BYC!!

 

[Sammster]

Welcome!

 

[HensandChicksNutrition]

Hello and welcome to BYC! Glad you joined.

My fundamental issue with the current nutritional "requirements" for poultry is that most, if not all of it, is based on maximizing production from the bird at a minimal cost without ever taking into consideration the longevity of the bird. And why not? No commercial layer will ever see her first body of new plumage after her first adult molt because she will be killed as soon as she stops laying and starts molting.

I have had high production breeds and will never have them again. They have been genetically engineered to crank out so many eggs a year that it literally kills them. All to maximize profits. I am not interested in that for my flock. I want maximum, quality nutrition to provide maximum life span and quality of life for my flock... eggs be damned.

That's fair! A big part of that is the breed you choose to have (genetics companies who have those commercial breeds have bred them over the decades so they do lay with as few gaps in egg clutch as possible). From the nutrition side, I do my best to support any bird - My work cannot "force" more eggs, nor would I ever want that, but I can do my best to make sure those breeds have plenty of calcium, vitamin D, and essential amino acids to keep them as healthy as I possibly can.

That said, I'd be happy to help anyone who is having problems with their nutrition, regardless of breed! If you don't have proper nutrition from hatch, a chicken's health (especially immune system and GI tract ability to absorb all the good nutrition they're given) can be really hampered and cause minor or major issues later in life. Good longevity and health in my eyes also has nothing to do with number of eggs

I hope that helps explain my goals a little more and I'm not judged for my knowledge in commercial settings!

 

[U_Stormcrow]

Hello and welcome to BYC! Glad you joined.

My fundamental issue with the current nutritional "requirements" for poultry is that most, if not all of it, is based on maximizing production from the bird at a minimal cost without ever taking into consideration the longevity of the bird. And why not? No commercial layer will ever see her first body of new plumage after her first adult molt because she will be killed as soon as she stops laying and starts molting.

I have had high production breeds and will never have them again. They have been genetically engineered to crank out so many eggs a year that it literally kills them. All to maximize profits. I am not interested in that for my flock. I want maximum, quality nutrition to provide maximum life span and quality of life for my flock... eggs be damned.

As has been noted many times on the feed forums, plenty of home brew recipes don't even meet the nutritional minimums for low cost commercial feed production in the big things (crude protein, key aminos) - no reason to suspect they get the stuff they don't pretend to have considered correct, either.

But yes, we do have a lot of flocks, between out members, with many different goals and methods.

@HensandChicksNutrition you will see LOTS of back and forth on nutrition. Lots of respectful disagreement in the feed forum - not so much in goals, mostly in how to achieve them. (...and some just plain stupid, its the internet after all) But Dobie is one of the good ones. As are Perris and Saysfaa and many others. The cream rises to the top pretty quickly round here.

 

[Yorkshire Coop]

Welcome to BYC @HensandChicksNutrition

 

[Evadig]

Salve (Latin for hello)! The nutritional service you propose sounds very interesting - one of my roosters is hardly eating and could probably use some advice !

 

[TwoCrows]

Hello and welcome to BYC!

So glad you decided to join us. Whether our members agree or disagree, you will be giving us all an opportunity to learn and understand more about nutrition and how it affects our birds. I am all for any and all education on all matters that concern my flock.

Make yourself at home here!

 

[Sammster]

That's fair! A big part of that is the breed you choose to have (genetics companies who have those commercial breeds have bred them over the decades so they do lay with as few gaps in egg clutch as possible). From the nutrition side, I do my best to support any bird - My work cannot "force" more eggs, nor would I ever want that, but I can do my best to make sure those breeds have plenty of calcium, vitamin D, and essential amino acids to keep them as healthy as I possibly can.

That said, I'd be happy to help anyone who is having problems with their nutrition, regardless of breed! If you don't have proper nutrition from hatch, a chicken's health (especially immune system and GI tract ability to absorb all the good nutrition they're given) can be really hampered and cause minor or major issues later in life. Good longevity and health in my eyes also has nothing to do with number of eggs

I hope that helps explain my goals a little more and I'm not judged for my knowledge in commercial settings!

I have RIRs and am experiencing reproductive issues within the flock. Amongst my 8 girls (4 of them are 2 1/2 years old, 4 of them are 1 1/2 years old), at least 2 of them are having issues. I suspect more, very honestly.

One hen (not sure which) regularly lays eggs with the pointed end having a darker, very fragile circle of pigment on the shell. I understand this to mean she has a shell-gland issue. So thin, that sometimes the shell weeps egg material - so I give those to the dogs.

Another hen (unsure which) sometimes lays soft-shelled eggs. When this happens, I give calcium citrate to the girls I suspect might be having the problem.

I have, in the past, found lash material under the roosting bar. I realize this is not a nutrition problem, but it's possible that it may have come from one of the girls mentioned above.

I feed Kalmbach pellets (typically non-gmo, but I accidentally bought regular, last time). I have oyster shell, oyster flakes and crushed eggshell on the side - but they rarely take any!

Several are currently finishing up with heavy molts, but I am getting one or 2 eggs a day, often including the eggs with the thin, pigmented end.

Editing to add: They are restricted to their run, for the most part. (Thanks for that prod, @RoyalChick )

 

[N F C]

Thanks for joining us!

 

[RoyalChick]

Welcome to BYC! Very good to have you on board.
Be prepared to get pulled in to lots of debates with more strongly held opinions than verifiable facts!
It is a topic everyone cares about a lot.

@U_Stormcrow fields most of the 'is this OK as a feed' questions (thank you Storm for the calm fact based way in which you educate us all).

Some of us really appreciate source references so we can access the scientific studies that support one point of view or another. Unfortunately, when you dig in to most of those studies the goals are of course defined by the commercial industry. Whatever results in maximum body weight at 6 weeks/slaughter (a common end point in studies) is hardly going to help my much adored pet hen happy and healthy into old age!
Of course it is only really the industry that has the money to fund research, so the rest of us end up relying on what is commonly believed.

One thing I have appreciated is @Perris digging into the history of chicken feed practices. It seems we can learn a lot from the 'pre-industrial' (or at least early industrial) period.

Finally, as well as breed, and maybe even more important than breed, is keeping condition. Some backyard chickens are confined in such a way that they can only eat what their keeper provides. Others free range all day in species rich environments and can probably find all the nutrition they need without our help. Many (including mine) live somewhere between those extremes.

Anyway, we look forward to you participating in these many discussions!