How effective are livestock guardians? Desperate for your answers

[FrenchToast]

Wow a 16 yr old !!! If you don't mind me asking can you find out what she feed him please?

I would do anything to prolong my GP's life !!! I heard that 10yrs old is old for them !!

 

[Baymule]

I have read with intrest about the alpha roll some of you mentioned. While i don't bark at my GP, I point my index finger at her and scold. You would think I just lambasted her with a 2x4. I guess I asserted my "alpha" role quite well. I have to be careful not to scold but a few words or I damage her feelings for days.

I use the same authority with my horses, mule and jack. I am the "lead mare" to them and a bossy 1200 pound horse trying to get the closest to the feed bucket can get dangerous. I have been caught between some of their squabbles and dodging flying hooves is not fun. I square my shoulders, stand straight and adopt my predator stance, looking them in the eye. If they misbehave, I use a mare's dicipline on her foal. A mare will drive her foal away from the herd where it is vunerable to predators. That foal wants nothing more than to get back to the herd. When the mare thinks her misbehaving brat has learned his lesson, she lets him come back. I have run myself breathless chasing away a horse from the herd at feeding time. Funny, the others get it that I'm not mad at them, settle down and eat. The diciplined horse will finally stand subdued licking it's toungue and making chewing motions. Then I slump my shoulders, turn sideways and "invite" the offender back in to the safety of the herd.

Whether dogs or horses, chickens, pigs or unicorns, learn the language of the animal you are tending to.

 

[watchdogps]

Quote:
Remuda1, you are aware that your dogs are crosses, right? Those are not pure pyrs.

 

[babyrnlc]

My German Shepherd mix is wonderful. She Used to be able to be left out in the yard with the chickens and there was never any issues (well, they would still food from her mouth lol). However, when we got some chicks she seems too interested in them. I have kept them apart (she goes up when they free range) though I did have her out with them today on a leash and she did great. One little chick walked up to her and pecked her on the nose, poor Annie (we think it is a roo.)

My neighbor said she saw 3 opossums trying to get in our yard and Annie about tore them up and they ran off.

We have not had a predator attack since we lost some chicks when we first started ( and we think that was a hawk or my black lab, that is NOT safe with them).

I feel safer with her out there.

 

[watchdogps]

Quote:
Umm..yeah, probably. Sure YOU got what you wanted, but did this "breeder" do this cross with a purpose in mind or because he had these two dogs handy? Did they make sure ALL the puppies in the litter got good homes? Did the parents have health checks and did they research the family health of the dogs? I'm gonna guess no.
Did they breeder let you know that if you ever needed to get rid of Badger that he was welcome to come home?

My insistence on only paying for dogs from breeders who do the above is NOT from breed snobbery, but from a lifetime of dealing with the victims of such "breeders". The dogs who come to me in rescue, because they were sold to unsuitable homes, who have health and behavior problems because someone just wanted to make a few bucks off a litter. The owners who arent giving their dogs up, but they are heartbroken and their wallets lighter because they have dumped thousands of dollars into the dogs they got for a hundred bucks and now it has costly medical issues or is dead. The owners whose dogs werent socialized well or had a defective temperament and they had to euthanize the dog after two years of attempting behavior modification.

If a breeder is not breeding to produce the best in health temperament and a dog who is true to their purpose, they have no business making puppies. If a breeder is not willing to take responsibility for every puppy they ever make, for the life of the puppy, they have no business breeding.

Anyone putting money in the pockets of lesser breeders is encouraging that breeder to keep making puppies that may well wind up in shelters.

Yes, there are high priced bad breeders. Just like there are knock-off Louis Vuitton bags. If you want the real goods, do some research in how to tell the difference.

Another analogy - if you were buying a tractor or a tool, would you want the higher priced, better made, Made in the USA one, or the cheaper japanese model?

 

[watchdogps]

Quote:
The pups were xrayed? Before 4 mos?

Why would you want a dog who is unhandleable? That's something that is quite undesirable, even with the serious workign dogs. It used to be more "the norm" but we are seeing that that makes things far more stressful on the dogs and that dogs who are comfortable with people are much easier to deal with and not any less of a working dog.

 

[watchdogps]

Quote:
Do you have any actual experience with any of the LGD breed dogs, and could you please post some pictures?

It shouldnt even be done with young pups. This kind of "correction" is seen as an attack by the pup. LGDs are DEFENSIVE dogs. They are NOT WIRED to back down. Not to a coyote, not to you. Use your brain, not your brawn to teach them correct behavior. I have had up to seven adult Anatolians all living together, as well as a litter of puppies. I have never ever done a takedown on any of them. Never needed to, they have all been raised to trust me and as such, what I say goes.

It truly breaks my heart when people call LGD breeds "dominant" "stubborn" etc. and say they have to be handled "with a firm hand" and such drivel. These dogs are such wonderful, intuitive beings that if they just trust you, they will give you their soul. I will tell you that EVERY SINGLE rescue dog we got in or got called on that had an aggression problem had been raised "with a firm hand" and it backfired. In most cases, simply being nice to the dog until he realized we would not attack him solved the issue.

An alpha roll, takedown etc should be seen as a last resort, something you do if the dog is threatening a life or at least very serious bodily harm, and it is not a training tool, but emergency management.

 

[Jamie_Dog_Trainer]

Quote:
Yep and when I have used a physical correction such as this I prefer to sweep the dogs legs out from under them suddenly. It works well and keeps me out of trying to pin down an adult dog. It is ONLY used as a last resort. I work with some very aggressive dogs. But this kind of thing has NO place in "training".

 

[remuda1]

Quote:
Remuda1, you are aware that your dogs are crosses, right? Those are not pure pyrs.

Thank you for your concern

. I didn't purchase purebred GPs. I purchased LGDs from a working farm and whose parents I was able to watch working on numerous occasions. I am more than satisfied with the job they are doing. I didnt purchase with the intention of showing or breeding

. They are happy, healthy, and so are thier charges.

To return to the question of the original poster...... In MY experience, my LGDs are super effective at predator control. The nice thing (for me) is that they do deter preds by announcing thier presence. They do this by marking thier territory and also by some barking. Our neighbors behind us have 3-4 dogs that usually run in a pack. I have seen them run down rabbits and tear them apart. Prior to getting my LGDs, they would come onto our property. I have a couple of rescue cats that have the run of the place and two yorkies that are behind a 3.5 foot picket fence when they're outside) so this was a real concern. Even more so once I got my sheep and chickens.... Although there was never a physical altercation between my dogs and theirs, I have not even SEEN thier dogs in several months. It's a big relief for me. I do still hear thier dogs barking occasionally, I never see them. Rather than just taking care of predators when they show up on our property, they keep them from even wanting to come near. I LOVE that since I dont really want to see any animal injured or killed if it doesnt have to be that way. So for me, they have been very effective. I hope all of these responses have helped to answer your question and I wish you good luck in finding the type of predator control that works best for you

.

 

[Beekissed]

you are aware that your dogs are crosses, right? Those are not pure pyrs.

These are my crosses, my irresponsibly bred accidents and, I suppose, unwanted and undesired mutts. The gal on the left is GP/lab mix and the one on the right is Lab/BC mix....both were unwanted by their irresponsible owners and I benefitted from that. Is it right to breed animals without a permanent home for them? Probably....many on BYC do it every day and take great umbrage when this is pointed out.

Having said that, my life would have been very much less enriched without the presence of these two irresponsible, not purebred, hard-working, courageous, loving and downright wonderful dogs. They have protected my flocks and my family for the past 7 years without ever falling down on the job or making me regret giving them homes. Faithful service, loving personalities and mutt's healthy vigor are all desirable traits in my eyes, so who says that purebred dogs have the best traits for LGDs?