I think it's happening again! ( possible cocci )

[Haunted55]

The shavings are aspen, and large size. I haven't seem any of them trying to eat it or pick at it, so hopefully that isn't the cause.

That thread on Dumor was incredibly informative, thanks for posting that! I think I might try switching brands and see if there's any improvement.

My little pullet is still standing around lethargic and pouffed. Everyone else in the brooder seems fine, and still no signs of bloody poop, so I guess that's a plus.

I don't mean to be a wise guy, lol, but if your chicks were eating those shavings....you'd know! Those are some very large pieces!

Sometimes with cocci, when they first start having an imbalance in their system, they're aren't many symptoms. You noticing the puffing and her acting lethargic is a good thing and hopefully all you'll see.

Something I forgot to add, there may be times you do see a little blood in a chicken's poop. As long as there aren't any other symptoms, no matter how subtle, it can be called normal. They shed the linings of their ceacum and sometimes there can be some spotting. Again, normal without other symptoms. I totally freaked out the first time I saw it myself, lol. A lot of good people here on BYC got me straightened out and better educated. Now I only freak a little bit and just run through my mental checklist.

 

[JesBarthel]

With my first batch of chicks, I noticed blood in the poop, but thought it was the shed intestinal lining. The chicks were fluffed up, too, but being the novice I was, I thought they were just tired since chicks seem to suffer from extreme bouts of narcolepsy, lol. They weren't on any sort of preventative, and by the time I realized what was actually going on, and got the corid, they were too ill That's why I had an instant freakout with this new chick. She's still not showing any improvement, but she's hanging in there for whatever reason. I'll just have to keep my fingers crossed

 

[Haunted55]

If you go back to posting #6, Michael Apple explains about the Sulmet and the Di-Methox. If your chick doesn't respond to the Corid and then the medicated feed, you might want to think about getting some of the Di-Methox [sulfadimethoxine]. You would want to give it a few days to a week after finishing the Corid dosing and give them some vitamins and probiotics to build them up a bit first. Then try treatment with this. This will usually take care of any lingering nasties. Please keep the thread updated as you go along, it's good when there can be an ending to a thread. Good luck and best wishes for success!

 

[Egg Yolk]

I have had my chicks on Cedar shavings for a long time and they have NEVER had a problem with them and rarely I see them eat pieces. When they eat them though they never have a problem so I dont see problems with cedar.
As for your little chick make sure she isnt over medicated with anything. And if you want her to eat some nutrient rich foods you should try using wet cat food because they love it and its pretty healthy for them. I give that to my chicks when/ if they become ill. Good luck!

 

[Michael Apple]

I have had my chicks on Cedar shavings for a long time and they have NEVER had a problem with them and rarely I see them eat pieces. When they eat them though they never have a problem so I dont see problems with cedar.
As for your little chick make sure she isnt over medicated with anything. And if you want her to eat some nutrient rich foods you should try using wet cat food because they love it and its pretty healthy for them. I give that to my chicks when/ if they become ill. Good luck!

The chick won't be over medicated if the proper directions are followed. Cat food is an old recommendation for adult birds in molt. Way too much sodium and calcium for chicks.

 

[Haunted55]

I have had my chicks on Cedar shavings for a long time and they have NEVER had a problem with them and rarely I see them eat pieces. When they eat them though they never have a problem so I dont see problems with cedar.
As for your little chick make sure she isnt over medicated with anything. And if you want her to eat some nutrient rich foods you should try using wet cat food because they love it and its pretty healthy for them. I give that to my chicks when/ if they become ill. Good luck!

Your birds are your responsibility, no one elses. You have the right to take care of them anyway you see fit, be it right or wrong. It's your thing. The rest of us will take care of our birds as we see fit as well. I have read post on BYC where people have lost some or all of their chicks because they used cedar shavings. I have done the research myself and would never consider using them for babies, ever. I am glad you have never had a problem and hope you continue to have the luck you have had up to now.

I don't quite get the 'over medicated' statement you've made in your posting. Are you referring to the Amprolium? Have you ever bothered to look into what the medications are for and how they work inside the body? Really, I don't understand. would you explain what you mean?

The feed normally given to chicks has the proper amount of protien in it already and to say that cat food or anything else should be given is false. The only time I have ever used cat food, canned, was when I had a picking problem with chicks and it was in desperation. I used 2 small cans of a fish based cat food between 35 chicks over 2 days. The picking stopped and never resumed. I would never think to offer my birds canned or dry cat food as a supplement. As has been pointed out by Michael Apple, it isn't good for them. Not just the salt and calcium, but the protien as well. It's way too high for their needs. Medicinal, as I used it? Yes, I would do it again if everything else failed to work and only for the problem of picking.

Sometimes we take chances with our own charges, birds, whether out of desperation or ignorance. Sometimes we get lucky and sometimes not so much. We all have opinions on what we think is right, but there are tried and true methods that have shown themselves to be the 'right' way of handling certain situations. I urge everyone to do the research on all of the possibilities and the tried and true as well and make their own decisions.

 

[JesBarthel]

So, the chick is doing worse this morning. She is now completely paralyzed, and won't open her eyes. She has very tiny breaths. She must still have some strength, because when I separate her, she'll peep really loud, without lifting her head. I know there's no saving her now She won't drink from a syringe either.

 

[JesBarthel]

Quick question: Following the symptoms chart that was posting earlier, I noticed paralysis and lameness are listed as separate symptoms. What's the difference between these two?

 

[Haunted55]

Lameness is limping, stumbling, that sort of thing. Paralysis is inability to use a limb, wing, neck, whatever, because it's 'frozen' and no longer gets the messages to move. If you look it up you'll get the better and more concise definition but this is basically it.

Is it possible for you to get a necropsy done on this one? I agree that there isn't much hope, but a necropsy would tell you what is going on and help you make decisions about the rest of the birds. Do you have a Vet in your area? I am going to give you a link so that you can find your state's Vet and you could contact them on Monday and they can help you arrange for a necropsy quickly and faily cheaply.

http://agr.wa.gov/FoodAnimal/AnimalHealth/statevets.aspx

If you do decide to go this route and the poor little one does pass over the weekend, there are somethings you will need to do right after her passing. Place her in doubled plastic bags and store her in a fridge, not a freezer. You will need to find something to ship her in and make a couple of ice packs with ziplock bags. I bought one of the freezer food bags at WalMart and used that to ship mine to the State Labs here in Maine. If you are close or have a Vet, just keeping her cold will be all you need to worry about.

Awful things to have to think about but in the end it will give you closure and help you understand just what went wrong. You need to know if all of this was just coccidiosis by itself or if the cocci is a secondary illness to something else. this can happen more often than not. I am so sorry it seems to be turning out this way. It's an awful thing no matter what the cause may be.

 

[JesBarthel]

From what I can tell, her symptoms seems to fit with the Avian Encephalitis. I emailed the breeder I got her from to see if she has a current outbreak or has any experience with the disease.

Unfortunately, I don't think I can get a necropsy done, unless I could do one myself in which case I probably wouldn't know what I was looking for/at anyways, lol, unless it was something really obvious.

Thank you so much for all of your help with this! I hate really hate feeling like such a noob, but I know we all have to learn somehow.