Icelandic Chickens

[Happy Chooks]

Ravie...........welcome!

From your pics I would say:

Pullet
Cockerel
Pullet
Pullet
Can't see body in picture but likely a cockerel.
2 pullets in front, cockerel in back.

 

[Happy Chooks]

Jake..........hope you find someone to take them for you. Are you having to rehome the goats too?

 

[RedIII]

Deb, that's exciting!

Jake, I wish I were closer to you. I would happily take your flock for you, but I'm clear over in Utah

I'm hoping that you find someone who can care for them well, and sooner rather than later.

Okay, so allow me a nerdy moment here. I was holding my two Icee babies yesterday, and I think I see a little tuft of fuzz on the male's head that's longer than the rest of the fuzz. I'm gonna be so excited if he has a topknot!

 

[kathyinmo]

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[Icelander]

I was just catching up on +30 pages of posts and just wanted to chime in on the "frey" or "fray" (I can never remember) issue, because I think this may be discouraging to a lot of new owners and breeders of the Icelandic Settlement Chicken that are getting introduced to the breed through this thread. I am, myself, a newcomer and this was certainly an issue for me and was part of the reason I decided to get hatching eggs directly from Iceland to establish my homestead flock.

As I have perhaps mentioned before (sorry if I repeat myself), I've looked through a fair amount of pictures from owners and breeders of flocks in Iceland and not seen anything like the pictures posted here of "frey" birds. I have also searched through message boards and comments (in Icelandic, I am a native speaker) looking for feathering issues and not seen any mention of it, and I have also asked the largest breeder (in Iceland) about it and he said most feather issues he has seen have had external causes (pecking, temperature, health, nutrition etc.) and was not familiar with any genetic "frey" feather issue such as described here. Surely, if anyone would be aware of this issue in Iceland, it would be him as he is the president of the Icelandic Owners and Breeders Association and the largest Icie breeder in Iceland with over 200 birds. Also, Iceland is full of small, closely related flocks that have been inbred for very long periods of time, but still seem to be free of this problem, so I am hesitant to agree to just blame excessive inbreeding. It would seem, at first glance, that the "frey" issue is not a part of the Icelandic gene pool or that it is at least, for some unknown reason, unique to the U.S. I have only hatched a small number of birds, but they all came directly from Iceland and none have had feather issues, but my current sample size (9 birds total) is so minuscule as to be irrelevant.

I'm not looking to be controversial, maybe I feel stronger about this because I'm Icelandic myself and these are "our birds", but I just don't think it is fair for some folks to blame this "frey" problem (or allow it to be blamed) on "the Icelandic landrace", as if the breed itself is somehow inherently defective, when this problem does not even seem to exist in Iceland, at least as far as I have been able to discover. Isn't it possible that the "frey" birds are not 100% Icelandic (and, therefore, not "Icelandic" at all, since an Icelandic landrace bird must be 100% pure to be called "Icelandic")? I am very sorry if this is bursting someone's bubble, and I'm sure this won't make me popular, but I just feel like it needs to be said.

TL;DR - The "frey" issue does not seem to exist in Iceland. Maybe those birds are not pure?

 

[kathyinmo]

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[RingedTeal]

We need pictures of these two Kathy.

 

[Icelander]

The Fray (fr) gene is "autosomal recessive" (meaning both parents must carry the gene). This gene is a "mutation," and can happen in ANY breed at ANY time. Mutations happen, simple as that. Once you have a mutation like this, one would be wise to cull the birds and not add the gene any further to the gene pool, if possible.

A gene mutation is a permanent change in the DNA sequence that makes up a gene. Mutations range in size from a single DNA building block (DNA base) to a large segment of a chromosome.

Gene mutations occur in two ways: they can be inherited from a parent or acquired during the lifetime. Mutations that are passed from parent to offspring are called hereditary mutations or germline mutations (because they are present in the egg and sperm cells, which are also called germ cells). This type of mutation is present throughout the life in virtually every cell in the body.

Mutations that occur only in an egg or sperm cell, or those that occur just after fertilization, are called new (de novo) mutations. De novo mutations may explain genetic disorders in which an affected offspring has a mutation in every cell, but has no family history of the disorder.

Acquired (or somatic) mutations occur in the DNA of individual cells at some time during one's life. These changes can be caused by environmental factors such as ultraviolet radiation from the sun, or can occur if a mistake is made as DNA copies itself during cell division. Acquired mutations in somatic cells (cells other than sperm and egg cells) cannot be passed on to the next generation.

Mutations may also occur in a single cell within an early embryo. As all the cells divide during growth and development, the individual will have some cells with the mutation and some cells without the genetic change. This situation is called mosaicism.

Thank you for this thorough and informative explanation.

I understand that gene mutations happen, but I also understand that circumstances such as this (a new mutation happens right after the breed is introduced to a new area and spreads quickly although there is no history of it in the foundation flock) are fairly uncommon, especially in light of the fact that a more common source of change in genetic material in chickens is cross-breeding, making cross-breeding the most apparent, likely cause. Given the short time frame, and that the gene must be carried by both parents, it seems that it would take a considerable amount of carelessness and misfortune for the mutation to have so quickly established itself entirely within the Icelandic breed itself--to the point where a cross-breeding mishap is a more plausible explanation. Or is this a misunderstanding? Of course, I'd like to believe that all the Icelandics in the U.S. are 100% pure, but I don't want to base it on wishful thinking.

 

[kathyinmo]

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[Icelander]

Pure or not - mutations happen! It has nothing at all to do with new areas, cross-breeding, or anything else! It happens! In autosomal recessive type mutations - the "carriers," can not be identified by simply looking at them. They "carry," the gene. Example: they have 2 genes for each trait - one "normal," and one "mutation." It may even take a few generations before it is even evident. The "muatated gene," has to be passed on - from BOTH parents, in "autosomal recessive," before the mutated trait is visable in the offspring. Think how many times they pass on only the "normal," gene - right? ONLY when the mutated gene is passed on, will the mutated trait be visable. If one parent passes on a normal gene, and one parent passes on a mutated gene - the offspring will be a carrier and it will then carry one normal and one mutated gene.

"it seems that it would take a considerable amount of carelessness and misfortune for the mutation to have so quickly established itself entirely within the Icelandic breed itself..."

I totally disagree with your statement (in red).

Thanks Kathy. I didn't disagree with you that mutations happen, absolutely they do. I am just pointing out that there seem to be a fair amount of "carriers" of the fray gene in the U.S., and none in Iceland (or so few that it has escaped expression or detection by the top breeder and president of ERL and has never been mentioned on a searchable message board).

Does this disparity in the number of "carriers" between U.S. and Iceland not suggest that the Icelandic fray issue is a mutation that has either:

a) happened only in the U.S., or
b) been introduced to Icelandics in the U.S. via cross-breeding?