Infection or virus?

[StellaP]

Yes, her book says 15mg/ml for amoxicillin trihydrate but Poultrydvm says 55-200mg/ml for amoxicillin trihydrate

 

[Eggcessive]

Most amoxicillin is trihydrate. Dosage for chickens is usually around 57 mg per pound of weight twice a day. For a 5 pound bird that is about 250 mg. Some drug books say to give 125-250 mg twice a day, so there is some leeway to dosage.

 

[StellaP]

Thank you, so they weigh 1kg (2.2pounds), it's 250mg/5ml so if I give 2mls twice a day they will be getting 200mg a day.
That's over 10 times her dose.
How can she (and her book, which is American btw) be so far out?

 

[coach723]

I agree with @Eggcessive, that is the dose I use most often, the 57 mg/lb of body weight. I sometimes give a larger dose the first dose, to get the levels up quicker, depending on what's going on. I've found it to be very well tolerated, even at higher doses, I've never had an issue.

 

[StellaP]

Thank you, and that's for amoxicillin trihydrate?
I'm cross that my very very sick hens have had ridiculously low doses for two days, and worried now that the bacteria will have started to develop a resistance.

 

[coach723]

Honestly, the more you look, the more variable of dosing that you find. I also don't like to go against vets advice, but I've gotten low dosing advice before. I got an enrofloxacin dosing once that was WAY too low, from a non-avian vet. All vets are licensed to treat all species, but if they haven't gotten specialized training in avian species, and/or have no experience, they often do not consider the rate of metabolization in birds. For many medications, the dosing per lb or kg in birds is much higher than in others species as they metabolize it much faster. I would switch to the higher dose, if that is what you want to do, and see how it goes.

 

[Eggcessive]

As I said most amoxicillins are amoxicillin trihydrate, it is just the complete name. We get a lot of posts here where vets have ordered smaller dosages. Chickens seem to require larger dosages pound for pound. As I recall my vet usually prescribed 50 mg twice a day for my 5 pound dog. That is the correct dose for dogs. Many vets will agree to see chickens, but they don’t always look up dosages for chickens or birds in something like Plumbs Vet Handbook. That is how this site got fairly popular since vets don’t always see chickens or know a lot about them.

 

[StellaP]

Thank you, yes I'm going to give the sickest of the three the higher dose (200mg per day) and the other two 100mg per day.
The irony is she is an avian specialist in an exotic vet practice.

I agree most vets don't get it, I was lucky in the UK to have a brilliant avian vet, but here in Portugal there doesn't seem to be the same skillset.
But, if I can get the drugs from the vets I can sort the rest, with a little help from the amazing people here.

 

[StellaP]

Ok, so I haven't updated she has also given me eye drops (Chloramphenicol) to use in the nebuliser (10 drops in 6ml of saline for 15 mins).
I'm assuming this doesn't affect the dosing of the amoxicillin?

 

[coach723]

Did she give you cautions about handling the chloramphenicol? I found this:

"Precautions​

Keep this and all drugs out of reach of children.

PRECAUTION FOR HUMANS: Chloramphenicol can cause permanent damage to the bone marrow in about 1 in 10,000 people. For these people, even skin contact can cause permanent damage. Because this aplastic anemia is not reversible, chloramphenicol should only be used when other suitable antibiotics are not available and with extreme caution. Gloves and masks should be worn when handling this drug. This drug should be used in a well ventilated location. If your pet vomits or has an accident indoors, you should wear gloves while cleaning up the accident. Children and pregnant women should not come in contact with this drug.

Chloramphenicol is metabolized in the liver. It should be used with care in patients with liver or kidney disease. Dose adjustment or monitoring of antibiotic blood level may be necessary.

Chloramphenicol should be avoided or used with caution in very young or premature animals. Kittens in particular may have difficulty metabolizing this drug.

Chloramphenicol may be used in older animals with normal kidney and liver function.

Chloramphenicol crosses the placenta and is present in milk. There are reports of both bone marrow suppression and birth defects. It is not recommended for use during pregnancy or in mothers that are nursing.

It is illegal to use chloramphenicol in animals that may enter the food chain."

Full page here: https://www.wedgewood.com/medications/chloramphenicol/#Precautions

I found some articles that say there is "some evidence" that using it as the same time as amoxicillin could possibly reduce the blood serum levels of the amoxicillin, but also found some that say there is no direct clinical evidence of that. And some articles do say that they are prescribed together sometimes. So, clear as mud on that.

Personally, with the cautions it comes with just for handling, I would prefer to use something else. Just me, I'm allergic to the planet, so am pretty cautious. If these are birds that you are considering eating the eggs of, or maybe the meat, I would definitely have a conversation about that with the vet before using that medication.
Many who deal with respiratory issues use Oxine in vaporizers or nebulizers for chickens, that is available here without a prescription, don't know if you can get that there.