International Black Copper Marans Thread - Breeding to the SOP

[KF0002]

X - rated. Her head is in his butt

Haha!
Yeah I think she was trying to hide.

 

[shepherd6567]

sorry to say this .but this cockerel is going to cause you so much trouble down the line .it is better not to use him .
he does carry few major fault ,hard to correct latter .
1) white earlobe
2) extra melanin ( too much black on him) his beak /ears tuft /dark shank / marble colored eyes . all this fault are not good on the cockerel .the hen is different story .
3) he has not enough color on his saddle / lancet and the shoulders .plus his copper is darker ( Mahogany type) because of the extra melanin he is carrying

if he had just one major fault than will be alright to work with ,but not will all those3 together .most of his progeny will be a cull . sorry to say that .

we ll try to find you some fertile eggs from people on this thread .or a cockerel.

he is a good type and has a good comb ,but those thing we can get them from the hen too ,because they are not sex linked .

chooks man

Ok guys before he goes in the roaster I have more pics of my young cockerel. I checked his birthday again and he his 4 months and a week old. Still lots of feathers/colors coming in. I really like his body type. I have better pics of his shanks also.

 

[KF0002]

Ok guys before he goes in the roaster I have more pics of my young cockerel. I checked his birthday again and he his 4 months and a week old. Still lots of feathers/colors coming in. I really like his body type. I have better pics of his shanks also.

His color is coming in more, and his type and tail angle is great. But those red-white earlobes will return to haunt you I would wager. If you are okay with that and feel you want to work with him, hatch some chicks and grow them out. As soon as you hatch a cockerel with red ear lobes, cull the red-white ear lobe rooster and breed the red ear lobed cockerel to red earlobed hens. The genes for red-white earlobes will still be there, I imagine so the chance of them cropping back up is still possible, like vulture hocks or comb side sprigs, or other faults that can resurface from hidden genes. Hard culling for this in the future would be required the same way I am dealing with vulture hocks and parasitic white in my LA line of BCM. @Chooks man will have better input, but that would be my novice genetic answer. He definitely has more expertise on this than I do.

 

[shepherd6567]

His color is coming in more, and his type and tail angle is great. But those red-white earlobes will return to haunt you I would wager. If you are okay with that and feel you want to work with him, hatch some chicks and grow them out. As soon as you hatch a cockerel with red ear lobes, cull the red-white ear lobe rooster and breed the red ear lobed cockerel to red earlobed hens. The genes for red-white earlobes will still be there, I imagine so the chance of them cropping back up is still possible, like vulture hocks or comb side sprigs, or other faults that can resurface from hidden genes. Hard culling for this in the future would be required the same way I am dealing with vulture hocks and parasitic white in my LA line of BCM. @Chooks man will have better input, but that would be my novice genetic answer. He definitely has more expertise on this than I do.

Thanks @kfelton0002 for the input. To be fair, the last pics I posted were in the coop on a dark day, so he appeared much darker than he truly is. He is getting a nicer copper color coming in tho. His shanks are much lighter than the first pics also. One nice thing is his eye color seems to be getting much better too.

I’m back to my original question about his white lobes. According to chooksman there is not much known about those genetics tho. Think I will save him from the pot for a couple more months now.

 

[Red Banks]

I can't wait to see Kfelton0002 chicks. I was out walking this evening and I looked at Antonio. He looks so good to me, I ran and got my camera.

The first pic he is in the middle, a young cockerel.

 

[shepherd6567]

That’s boy is a beautiful!

 

[Red Banks]

That’s boy is a beautiful!

Thank you..... I like everything about Antonio except his tail and his comb/wattle. He has so many good things going on. Even though he has a long tail carried way too high most of the time, he has sufficient mass and a long back. I just hope I can correct this in his offspring down the road.

From the SOP

THE SHAPE OF THE TAIL
A good Marans (cocks and hens) should always have a short tail, tilted 45° to a horizontal, but still acceptable to a 60° maximum. It is the 45° slope, which is called for in the Standard. Beyond 60°, the tail appears much too vertical, and the back is very
often too short, and the bird then lacks the minimum mass necessary for a good Marans.
To describe good tails in the Marans it is advisable to join together two essential characteristics, which are:
- Main tail feathers tighter and shorter than average.
- Sickles shorter than average.


Ear-lobes: average size, red and long
The presence of off-white earlobes is a defect, a sign of genetic impurity. This may result by improper selection, or atavistic expression of the recessive factors for “white earlobes”.

It is advisable to note here that the colour of the earlobes, red as well as white, should be evaluated only when the subjects reach adulthood.

The genetic factors responsible for the white or red colour of the earlobes are due to a whole complex of associated genes, which are to date unidentified.

Marans with white earlobes, or more simply off-white, are of course not accepted as Standard. They should have only red earlobes without defect. It should be noted that that red ear lobes resulted from the contributions of the Asian breeds which were imported at the end of the 19th century, whereas the majority of breeds with white earlobes are descended essentially from the very old European and Mediterranean breeds.

You may feel the same about your cockerel down the road.

 

[shepherd6567]

No such thing as a perfect bird. He has so many good qualities tho.

As for mine, he’s growing on me. He’s got a great temperament and personality. I’ll see what he looks like before I decide to breed him and work on his defects.

 

[KF0002]

I can't wait to see Kfelton0002 chicks. I was out walking this evening and I looked at Antonio. He looks so good to me, I ran and got my camera.

The first pic he is in the middle, a young cockerel.View attachment 1172310 View attachment 1172317 View attachment 1172334

Antonio is a very lovely boy. Can't wait to see his babies! I envy your sunshine. It has been in the 30's here today and rainy.
Supposed to be in the 20's tonight with possible snow flurries!

Today is day 9 so I figured I would take a shot at candling the eggs. There were 14 that I could see a distinct air cell and shadowing underneath the air cell, indicating the eggs have begun to develop. The rest I left in the incubator just in case but I feel pretty confident that they haven't started developing. So 14 out of 24 look good as of right now. Let's hope they keep growing and hatch!

I will also comment on the condition of the aircells of the eggs that are developing. While there are several eggs that have abnormal shaped aircells, which is very common with shipped eggs, the aircells are in the best condition I have ever seen in shipped eggs I have incubated. No free floating aircells whatsoever. Your packing job was superb.

 

[Red Banks]

Antonio is a very lovely boy. Can't wait to see his babies! I envy your sunshine. It has been in the 30's here today and rainy.
Supposed to be in the 20's tonight with possible snow flurries!

Today is day 9 so I figured I would take a shot at candling the eggs. There were 14 that I could see a distinct air cell and shadowing underneath the air cell, indicating the eggs have begun to develop. The rest I left in the incubator just in case but I feel pretty confident that they haven't started developing. So 14 out of 24 look good as of right now. Let's hope they keep growing and hatch!

I will also comment on the condition of the aircells of the eggs that are developing. While there are several eggs that have abnormal shaped aircells, which is very common with shipped eggs, the aircells are in the best condition I have ever seen in shipped eggs I have incubated. No free floating aircells whatsoever. Your packing job was superb.

Got my fingers crossed for the 14. I am so glad my egg packing was a success. I have never shipped eggs and I was pretty nervous about the whole thing, I wanted them to get there in good shape. It is going to be cold tomorrow.... in the 60s but then in a couple of days right back up to the mid 70's.

I am going to go and buy the packing materials I used.... just in case I can't find them down the road.

My incubator will get here on TUE and I have eggs waiting!