International Black Copper Marans Thread - Breeding to the SOP

[Chooks man]

I have got 8 maran's eggs today. it means all of my girls are laying (I have 8 pullets).

well happy for you my dear friend .
love your Avatar .you worked hard for it .you did believe in your chooks and they paid you well .

now that you have a good number of chooks ,you can start fixing the other traits .like type .body color .comb etc........

you are on the right truck .

chooks man

 

[Chooks man]

Ok, this is the quest, the goal, the legend!!! #8 or #9 color for the egg. If we incubate only #8 or#9 egg will we get that color in the offspring?? Can I hatch #4 and #5 eggs and get #8 and # 9 from the offspring. This is where the box of chocolate comes in. Chooks man do we increase the odds of dark eggs by hatching from dark eggs??

I remember @Chooks man said that both sire and dam must carry dark egg genes. incubating dark eggs only does not mean you will get dark eggs in the offspring unless their sire has dark egg gene.

Question remains exactly the same. If I hatch a male chic from this #8 or #9 eggs and cross back to the hen that layed this #8 or #9 egg will I have a line of birds that lay #8 and #9 eggs?? TOM

It is not that simple from what I have read. The inheritance of dark egg color genes and the recombination of the genes the pullets inherit is like pulling the lever on a slot machine. You will get pullets that lay dark but how dark is up to how many inherit just the right combination of genes from both the sire and the dam. No doubt you will produce birds that lay as dark as the dam, but some may lay lighter. You will have to grow them out and trap nest or single pen them to see who is laying what. I have read that the male carries 14 of the genes responsible for egg color while the female only carries 7. Not every bird will inherit the perfect recombination of genes to lay an 8 or 9. But your thinking is definitely on point by breeding a male hatched from an 8 or a 9 back to his dam that laid the 8/9 egg. Inbreeding is the key to get that recombination of genes.

Another approach, you can try breeding a male hatched from an #8 or 9 egg to his sisters that lay at least as dark as they Dam to recombine the genes differently. From this brother-sister mating (F1) you can then breed the best F2 male to his Grand Dam (F0) and the F2 pullets that lay as dark as their Dams to their Grand Sire (F0) to create two separate possible F3 dark egg lines.

In my experience, genetic inheritance is a funny thing - it is consistently inconsistent - whether we’re working with mammals or poultry. Just because we breed a male hatched from a #8 or 9 egg to a hen that lays a #8 or 9 egg does not mean that all pullets from this mating will lay #8 or 9 because of the variation in genetic inheritance by each individual. We will most likely get a few pullets that lay as dark as their Dams but my guess is that the majority will not because if it were that easy (and I wish it were) we all would have Marans that lay #9. How nice would it be to not worry about dark egg color so that we could focus on tails, combs, eyes and whatnot? I’ll be happy if I can keep my Marans at a consistent #6-7.

My understanding is that a consistent #8-9 layer is considered a poor layer because she only lays one maybe two eggs per week. I’ve heard Chooks Man say it many times, if we only breed for #9 layers our Marans Pens will be empty.

Marans breeders around the world have been chasing the dark egg genes for decades and to my knowledge the code has not been cracked so the grail is still out there for the taking. I’m just happy to be on this quest with you all!

very good topic and well complex too .
i agree with Kfelton0002 and Kcrandall ,the genes needed for dark eggs are not simple.

many study has shown that only 40% of the pullets hatched from dark eggs layer line will be able to lay dark eggs . a same thing if talk about the cockerels .only 40% wil carry the genes .
some others studies highlighted there is some of those genes are sex linked too .

to be safe we need to breed 2 lines .one s a cockerels line ,the other s a pullets line .other thing we need to do is to test mate the progeny between themselves ( sibling matting like Kcandall s suggested ).
matting the cockerel hatched from a dark egg to his Dam to reinforce the trait .
we do the same thing with a pullets .

all this practice will help up breed a dark egg layer strain for sure .

line breeding is the only way to breed the dark egg genes true .not outcrossing

chooks man
other th

 

[OneMountainAcres]

My first marans babies hatched today! Out of 5 eggs set, one didn't develope, the other 4 all hatched. They are strong, healthy, and active little ones! I'll have to get a picture of them tomorrow

 

[Chooks man]

I just got my wing bands and pliers. If I have as much trouble wing banding the chicks as I did getting the band's back in the box. I am in trouble!

how are you going with the wing band ?

chooks man

 

[Chooks man]

My first marans babies hatched today! Out of 5 eggs set, one didn't develope, the other 4 all hatched. They are strong, healthy, and active little ones! I'll have to get a picture of them tomorrow

great news .

chooks man

 

[Chooks man]

Ok, this is the quest, the goal, the legend!!! #8 or #9 color for the egg. If we incubate only #8 or#9 egg will we get that color in the offspring?? Can I hatch #4 and #5 eggs and get #8 and # 9 from the offspring. This is where the box of chocolate comes in. Chooks man do we increase the odds of dark eggs by hatching from dark eggs??

first we can not breed #9 offspring from a #4 layer stock .we need to be very very lucky .
what we can do is to breed #4 layer step by step to get the egg color to darken in each generation . that will take years of work . I know some breeder doing just that . now they are having a good result #7.

it is easier to breed a dark egg layer from a hens not from the rooster .
here why.
if we have a hen who lays dark egg . first we need to breed her to a good rooster if we can ( from dark egg strain -not egg-)than we get a cockerel from this matting .
second we mate the F1 cockerel to his Dam and hatch a cockerels/pullets . we can start 2 parallel line from there .

Kfelton0002 is doing a same work with her BCM hen Greatha .
I m doing a same thing with my dark egg layer hens .

for me if I get a 20% of my pullets lay dark eggs I ll be happy . This year I had more than 20% laid dark eggs . first step is done .Now step 2 .
long way to go

chooks man

 

[marchick]

how are you going with the wing band ?

chooks man

They just came in the mail today. I am ready whenever she ships my chicks. I just bought a used sportsman cabinet incubator. It took me hours to clean. It smelled so bad. I scrubbed it all down and then used Brinsea incubation disinfectant on it. I hope that will kill anything that might harm the eggs. I might spray it down again with the disinfectant to be safe.

 

[KF0002]

sorry to hear that .
you are not a lone .I had a same problem .come back today to the farm ( I was away ) and found the incubator was off .all the eggs where off .some where 4 days before hatching . they where the last one to hatch . c est la vie with a chooks .

HAPPY NEW YEAR TO YOU ALL . A LOT HAPPINESS AND A LOT OF HEALTHY CHICKS

chooks man

I hate when that happens. Ive had similar situations before and have lost entire clutches of eggs if power is lost close to hatch time. Sometimes a few embryos will survive a power outage as long as they didnt stay cool for too long.. I have had some eggs survive an outage that lasted several hours.

I'm hoping for better luck with the new year. I hate having setbacks.

 

[KF0002]

My first marans babies hatched today! Out of 5 eggs set, one didn't develope, the other 4 all hatched. They are strong, healthy, and active little ones! I'll have to get a picture of them tomorrow

I had 4 total hatch out of 15 hatch for the New Years hatchalong. Neither of the two eggs I set from Gideon x Gretchen were fertile but I didnt figure they would be. He is a fairly young cockerel and still isnt crowing yet. They take forever to mature.

I had 3 Olive Eggers and 1 legbar pullet hatch. I have too many females in with the Legbar cock bird so I need to thin a few out to increase fertility.

Congrats on your babies!

 

[OneMountainAcres]

I had 4 total hatch out of 15 hatch for the New Years hatchalong. Neither of the two eggs I set from Gideon x Gretchen were fertile but I didnt figure they would be. He is a fairly young cockerel and still isnt crowing yet. They take forever to mature.

I had 3 Olive Eggers and 1 legbar pullet hatch. I have too many females in with the Legbar cock bird so I need to thin a few out to increase fertility.

Congrats on your babies!

Thank you! And congrats on your new babies too Sometimes, it's so hard to wait for them to be ready.