Is it ok to feed laying hens layer feed

[Pharsewear]

So what I was told yesterday was that if I have a rooster, I don't have to give my girls layer feed. I just had one of my girls pass away in her nesting box, so sad. We dont know why, maybe her egg was too big? I have no clue, but we were all so devastated. We have 12 chickens, and I believe 6 are laying because there are 6 eggs in the boxes, unless they lay more than one, I have no clue. Any help would be appreciated.

 

[DobieLover]

So what I was told yesterday was that if I have a rooster, I don't have to give my girls layer feed. I just had one of my girls pass away in her nesting box, so sad. We dont know why, maybe her egg was too big? I have no clue, but we were all so devastated. We have 12 chickens, and I believe 6 are laying because there are 6 eggs in the boxes, unless they lay more than one, I have no clue. Any help would be appreciated.

You don't want to feed layer feed to your rooster. Flock Raiser, All Flock or a starter feed with oyster shell on the side are great alternatives to layer feed for mixed flocks.

 

[Pharsewear]

Thank you so much!

 

[sdm111]

I've been feeding layer to roosters for years with no I'll effects. I have pics all over this website of mine if anyone doubts

 

[U_Stormcrow]

Layer feed is bad for young birds, associated with kidney damage during their adolescence due to an excess of calcium. Its effects on largely developed roosters is les well documented. That said, there are never any guarantees - as with anything else in life, you rolls your dice, and you takes your chances.

My query whenever the subject comes up now is this:

What benefit do you gain with layer feed? In a commercial, substantially all hen environment, pumping out eggs - layer feed makes sense. Its an all in one designed to meet the needs of the flock, and its cheep (cheap sorry - couldn't help myself).

For most of us doing backyard flocks of whatever size, often of mixed ages, and frequently with mixed genders - or even different poultry besides, such as me and my ducks - the layer feed doesn't fit that bill. and as most of us with layers free choice oyster shell anyways, as a bit of cheap extra insurance against weak eggs, one of the two benefits of layer feed is functionally negated as well.

So it really comes down to whether the cost of layer feed relative to the cost of an All Flock/Flock Raiser/Grower Starter is worth the effort of maintaining fresh supplies of two feeds and separating the flocks for feeding.

Maybe it is for you and your situation. Likely its not.

 

[DobieLover]

I've been feeding layer to roosters for years with no I'll effects. I have pics all over this website of mine if anyone doubts

How old are the roosters? The ill effects are cumulative and are due to the kidneys having to process the excess calcium in the feed.

 

[Pharsewear]

Thank you for the info... my Rooster is about 6 months old and my youngest of all the girls are 6 months also. So I think it will be safe to just keep them on starter feed or the all flock... my girls eggs are awesome, nice and perfect shell. I guess I'll just finish up what little i have of the layer feed and just give it to them maybe every other day until i run out... thank you all for your help!

 

[EggSighted4Life]

So what I was told yesterday was that if I have a rooster, I don't have to give my girls layer feed. I just had one of my girls pass away in her nesting box, so sad. We dont know why, maybe her egg was too big? I have no clue, but we were all so devastated. We have 12 chickens, and I believe 6 are laying because there are 6 eggs in the boxes, unless they lay more than one, I have no clue. Any help would be appreciated.

Hi there, hope you are enjoying BYC!

Very sorry for your loss!

Some pullets have multi yolker eggs that are indeed way to large to pass and unfortunately egg binding is often deadly fast. Plus there are many reproductive disorder that can happen.

It's possible you have only 6 layers.. but entirely possible you have many more than that and they don't lay EVERY day.. Some first time layers will as well as many sex links. Many brown layers will slow to 3 or 4 eggs per week once mature.. and influenced heavily by number of daylight hours.

I used to use layer feed because I was told my birds would die if I didn't!

Since learning the difference and switching to flock raiser with oyster shell free choice on the side.. my older birds enter molt less harshly and return to molt sooner.. The difference in personality during this time since making the switch was also tremendous.. the flock raiser is higher in amino acids, the birds are stronger, my family gets more nutrients in the eggs we consume.. 16% protein in most "layer" feed is considered close to the minimum to keep a light bodied layer like Leghorn in good condition. Most larger bodied birds and even the Leghorns will benefit from a little more than the minimum.. which also goes a long way towards supporting overall immunity.. to ward of parasites etc.

One final note.. the excess calcium (>3%) should not be fed LONG term to birds NOT in lay.. will have the MOST impact on those genetically predisposed somehow to the liver/kidney issues.. Most folks will NEVER know why their older rooster dies, nor will they pay to find out why in most cases. They'll presume heart attack.

For folks keeping $3 chickens.. no big deal, maybe..

For me, I'm heavily invested.. not just monetarily but also time, energy, generations.. worth of hard work and gathering my stock from across the country.. Losing an actual rooster by inappropriate feeding according to the LAW (even).. just isn't worth the saving of a few lousy dollars, period.

I see the difference and I attest to it.. I got no company affiliations or even preference.. Nutrients matter, if you care! Each person has their own goals, challenges, and resources. Make the best choice for you and YOUR flock with the knowledge and resources you have now. Switch it up if you learn something new, change your mind, etc. Chicken (poultry/animal) keeping has been an amazing and ever changing learning process for me that is ongoing even after 10+ years. I guess that's why I still enjoy it, chicken math is REAL and fascinating!

One thing that's especially opened my eyes since being on BYC is people's resources.. some other countries don't have available what the US does.. and formulated feed is often one of those conveniences. So I TRY to remember not to be judgmental even if I disagree with or don't fully understand someone's thoughts on a subject. I try and remember we are all doing our best and here to support each other.

Sounds like you've already received and taken the advice from this thread.. but keep up the good work, figuring out what works for you, why YOU feel how you do about certain things, and share your experiences to. Happy adventures!

Lovely eggs, Btw!

 

[Crazy Fun Chicken Lady]

Hi there, hope you are enjoying BYC!

Very sorry for your loss!

Some pullets have multi yolker eggs that are indeed way to large to pass and unfortunately egg binding is often deadly fast. Plus there are many reproductive disorder that can happen.

It's possible you have only 6 layers.. but entirely possible you have many more than that and they don't lay EVERY day.. Some first time layers will as well as many sex links. Many brown layers will slow to 3 or 4 eggs per week once mature.. and influenced heavily by number of daylight hours.

I used to use layer feed because I was told my birds would die if I didn't!

Since learning the difference and switching to flock raiser with oyster shell free choice on the side.. my older birds enter molt less harshly and return to molt sooner.. The difference in personality during this time since making the switch was also tremendous.. the flock raiser is higher in amino acids, the birds are stronger, my family gets more nutrients in the eggs we consume.. 16% protein in most "layer" feed is considered close to the minimum to keep a light bodied layer like Leghorn in good condition. Most larger bodied birds and even the Leghorns will benefit from a little more than the minimum.. which also goes a long way towards supporting overall immunity.. to ward of parasites etc.

One final note.. the excess calcium (>3%) should not be fed LONG term to birds NOT in lay.. will have the MOST impact on those genetically predisposed somehow to the liver/kidney issues.. Most folks will NEVER know why their older rooster dies, nor will they pay to find out why in most cases. They'll presume heart attack.

For folks keeping $3 chickens.. no big deal, maybe..

For me, I'm heavily invested.. not just monetarily but also time, energy, generations.. worth of hard work and gathering my stock from across the country.. Losing an actual rooster by inappropriate feeding according to the LAW (even).. just isn't worth the saving of a few lousy dollars, period.

I see the difference and I attest to it.. I got no company affiliations or even preference.. Nutrients matter, if you care! Each person has their own goals, challenges, and resources. Make the best choice for you and YOUR flock with the knowledge and resources you have now. Switch it up if you learn something new, change your mind, etc. Chicken (poultry/animal) keeping has been an amazing and ever changing learning process for me that is ongoing even after 10+ years. I guess that's why I still enjoy it, chicken math is REAL and fascinating!

One thing that's especially opened my eyes since being on BYC is people's resources.. some other countries don't have available what the US does.. and formulated feed is often one of those conveniences. So I TRY to remember not to be judgmental even if I disagree with or don't fully understand someone's thoughts on a subject. I try and remember we are all doing our best and here to support each other.

Sounds like you've already received and taken the advice from this thread.. but keep up the good work, figuring out what works for you, why YOU feel how you do about certain things, and share your experiences to. Happy adventures!

Lovely eggs, Btw!

Is flock raiser the same as starter/grower? I buy my feed at tractor supply and I only buy organic. It looks like I only have a choice of starter/grower and layer.

 

[U_Stormcrow]

Is flock raiser the same as starter/grower? I buy my feed at tractor supply and I only buy organic. It looks like I only have a choice of starter/grower and layer.

Unfortunately, TSC is not the best source if Organic matters to you. It caters to a differing crowd - and honestly, the major manufacturers seem to cater to Organics with eggs on their mind, not Organic Meat Birds. At a guess, their are many more ovo-lacto vegetarians than all organic carnivores AND, at least in somewhat urban areas (where TSCs tend to be), city regulations likely allow hens in small quantities, but no roosters at all - and meat birds tend to be males, for a host of reasons.

Before I found a local mill, I was using Nutrena NatureWise All Flock - its All Natural but NOT certified organic. The key numbers for me? 18% Protein, 1.5% Calcium +/-, 2.5% Fat, up to 6% fiber.

Your TSC probably carries Nature's Best Organic Starter/Grower. Its numbers?
18% Protein, 1.1% Calcium +/-, 2.75% fat, 5.5% fiber. Close enough.

The Purina Organic Starter/Grower might be available too, more expensive still. 18% Protein, 1.2% Calcium, 3% Fat, 5.5% Fiber. Again, we're in the right range.

Lots of people use (again, not organic) Purina Flock Raiser. 20% Protein, 1.0%+/- Calcium , 3.5% Fat, 5% Fiber Again, good range there.

For comparison, your typical layer will only be 16% or maybe 17% Protein - which is low for (all) chicks, means slow growth in meat birds, ducks, etc and probably slow molt on your layers, while its calcium is usually in the 3.5% to 4% range.

tl;dr - more Protein good (to a point - ducks w/ too much protein and not enough niacin can develop angel wing, but you aren't raising ducks, so...), more calcium than 1 to 1.5% bad.

Hope that helps!