Lavender patterned Isabel duckwing barred - lavender brown cuckoo barred - project and genetic dis

[The Moonshiner]

Moonshiner -- thanks for clarifying -   Sometimes I have to refresh my brain -- to keep just barring straight -- and when you are working on the gold/silver variations it adds a layer of complexity in geometric proportions.  

Ha.
Im working on several projects and some have pretty much the same looking F1s so I have to hit refresh all the time.

Today is my hatch day for Easter Hatch-a-long.  I see 4 or 5 that hatched overnight -- but this new incubator doesn't have the 100% clear visibility of the Brinsea so I just don't know.  I'm saying 'hands off' until at least tomorrow morning -- telling myself that if I open it now I will kill all the ones that haven't hatched yet.   Making me nutz.  Better really get myself busy away from the incubator and pretend it is a hen....and just not distub 'her'. 

Shine a good LED flashlight in the window and youll be able to see everything fairly decent.
Im hands off myself but I do have a little helper that likes to pop it open whenever he gets a chance or hears any peeping so I now have to move everything somewhere out of reach.

 

[campingshaws]

One week pics. I didn't get all of them, but picked four. How early can you detect barring?

Most saturated:

Least saturated (most diluted?)

Barred? It's the most speckled of any.

Not barred? Least speckled. The other 3 are in between these two. Also the only one with a sharp, well-defined V.

 

[ChicKat]

Good luck staying busy!

Ha.
Im working on several projects and some have pretty much the same looking F1s so I have to hit refresh all the time.
Shine a good LED flashlight in the window and youll be able to see everything fairly decent.
Im hands off myself but I do have a little helper that likes to pop it open whenever he gets a chance or hears any peeping so I now have to move everything somewhere out of reach.

So cute -- a little helper. You are starting them young!

One week pics. I didn't get all of them, but picked four. How early can you detect barring?

Most saturated:


Least saturated (most diluted?)


Barred? It's the most speckled of any.


Not barred? Least speckled. The other 3 are in between these two. Also the only one with a sharp, well-defined V.

What perfect pictures!!

Here is all I can guestimate:

• top chick - has extra markings that make me think it isn't 100% e+ - However, I have one just like that -- identical in the brooder right now -- and it is barred and turning out to be very saturated. Cannot tell if it is the reflection of the light or if there is the faintest light 'hairs' in that chick's down in the V
• second chick - clear stripe at the outter tip of the wings -- maybe a break in the dorsal stripe right at the top of the neck/back of the head, dorsal stripe a little bit diffused - maybe male, maybe barred is my guess. If that chick has what seems like a tiny light rim in the skin right around the eye -- I'd guess male -- but the jury is out on barring. dunno.
• third one - that chick should be barred (with baby wing-feathers like that -- it should grow up to be barred IMO)! Do you know the parentage by chance? If it is from your CL x Isabel definitely barred. Maybe a male?
• Last chick -- looks so much like a CL female -- I would guess barred - and maybe take a chance that I'm mistaken - dunno.

Tells for barring from what we have gathered thus far are 1. the head splotch - that the chicks that Moonshiner listed show two examples of -- IN CL the big splotch is male and the small trace - frost is female. The barring gene will diffuse the chipmunk stripes -- so super sharp stripe definition -- probably female - along with that continuous head V -and I think that he little frost that is contained inside the V is a sign of barring however, CL females can be barred and lack that feature.

I was looking at the tails for barring -- and maybe a better tell is when the top of the head feathers grow in for females and look peppered. ?? Still only have 1 real example and two that are sort of like that -- but one is crested and her crest doesn't show barring - and it is harder to tell barring in the lavender-dilutes than the ones that don't have two lav. genes.

For the male -- it looks like the tell is the tail -- a bit and then the neck hackles once they begin to grow in -- say for sure barred. (same with the female neck hackles)---

Were at a real early stage to tell -- few individuals that we have at all and few documented... so this exact type of question and these great pictures are the way to 'get there from here'.

Really nice looking chicks too.

I love seeing the pictures of y'all chicks -- and the comments and questions -- then my rusty wheels start grinding in the old brain-cogs and I go look at the brooder or the pens and cogitate on it awhile -- and sometimes come up with something. (and other times not).

 

[campingshaws]

Can't remember the exact eggs they came from because I lumped all the splits together as they hatched. I know the sharp V was first to hatch, and it was under the basket. But having been exposed to two different roos it's hard to know who Amethyst was fertile by? I'll try to sort "your" splits from "my" splits by looking at the pics from hatch and matching them to the brooder. If I can figure out how then I'll mark them as individuals. If not all, then some. The weather is too pretty to be inside.

 

[ChicKat]

Can't remember the exact eggs they came from because I lumped all the splits together as they hatched.

I know the sharp V was first to hatch, and it was under the basket. But having been exposed to two different roos it's hard to know who Amethyst was fertile by? I'll try to sort "your" splits from "my" splits by looking at the pics from hatch and matching them to the brooder. If I can figure out how then I'll mark them as individuals. If not all, then some. The weather is too pretty to be inside.

No kidding -- we must have the same weather it is gorgeous. a friend that I've known forever is going to stop by for the "annual visit
' - it is a fabulous day for it.

- One thing about our lavender/Isabels and all lavenders, - at the 35,000-foot level, if we plan to introduce a 'color-refresher' mating from time-to-time -- then we won't ever have to really worry about too much 'inbreeding'. That being said -- theoretically I'd like the color refresher to be -- maybe just one gene away from the desired outcome -- so my ideal color-refresher bird doesn't quite exist in the world as of yet.

There's always something.

 

[The Moonshiner]

So cute -- a little helper.  You are starting them young!  

The littlest one from day one. How many of us can say weve had chickens every day of our lives? And he does try to help with it all.
Probably the biggest reason I just have fun with it.
Those little ones are such sponges. They learn and remember so much better then us. If he stays interested I cant imagine how much he will know before even becoming a teen.

 

[ChicKat]

The littlest one from day one. How many of us can say weve had chickens every day of our lives? And he does try to help with it all.
Probably the biggest reason I just have fun with it.
Those little ones are such sponges. They learn and remember so much better then us. If he stays interested I cant imagine how much he will know before even becoming a teen.

That same thought occurred to me -- what a great opportunity to grow up with the knowledge and be able to take it forward from there.

 

[campingshaws]

Can't remember the exact eggs they came from because I lumped all the splits together as they hatched. I know the sharp V was first to hatch, and it was under the basket. But having been exposed to two different roos it's hard to know who Amethyst was fertile by? I'll try to sort "your" splits from "my" splits by looking at the pics from hatch and matching them to the brooder. If I can figure out how then I'll mark them as individuals. If not all, then some. The weather is too pretty to be inside.

No kidding -- we must have the same weather it is gorgeous.  a friend that I've known forever is going to stop by for the "annual visit
' - it is a fabulous day for it.

 -   One thing about our lavender/Isabels and all lavenders,  - at the 35,000-foot level,  if we plan to introduce a 'color-refresher' mating from time-to-time -- then we won't ever have to really worry about too much 'inbreeding'.  That being said -- theoretically I'd like the color refresher to be -- maybe just one gene away from the desired outcome -- so my ideal color-refresher bird doesn't quite exist in the world as of yet.

There's always something.   

As soon as I finished reading your post it immediately poured down rain.

 

[ChicKat]

As soon as I finished reading your post it immediately poured down rain.

That's funny! -- You are just like here, the old saying "IF you don't like the weather, stick around 20-minutes and it will change".

 

[ChicKat]

Was going to photoshop and put a little cartoon speech balloon by his beak and say "I'm for sure a boy" -- (in the background you can see the one with really definite barring)

This is the one that has the added markings on the down by the face -- you cannot quite see her face there -- but you can sort of make it out if you struggle.

Here she is a little eariler in the month -- It is even more like Māori tattooing than like Betty Boop curles...and she has very STRONG barring.