Quote:
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We are thinking about you and your family here as well.....
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We are thinking about you and your family here as well.....
Major Mortality rate what could be wrong with my flock? HELP PLEASE
- Thread starter bossynbella
- Start date
Praying for you and your family during this difficult time.
Prayers for all the trials you are facing.
As a couple of folks have already suggested, I wonder about some sort of toxin they are getting into. I think if the word poison was used in speaking with the vet, she likely thought deliberate poison. I am thinking something not deliberate: weed or insect killer on thnigs they eat, contaminated water--not their supplied water source, but maybe some water that is in some don't of cart basin or puddles or ponds? Also, how do you store your feed, and is there any chance that that is the problem? Damp or wet feed can mold, and the mold can be extremely toxic. Putting new bags of feed into a container or feed dish that has the mold can spread it to the new feed.
Specifically ask the state vet to do a necropsy. With this many birds lost to no obvious cause, they need to find out what is going on before it expands beyond your borders. If they want you tp pay for the cost, express the concern that you have what appears to be an epidemic, not an isolated case. Hopefully that will get sufficient attention to get you some help. Each time you speak with them, make sure to ask when you can expect to hear results. Also, ask for suggestions in caring for and any preventative treatment for the remaining birds.
I agree with the suggestion to separate the birds who show any symtoms of illness from those who appear to be healthy.
In response to a few earlier posts suggesting West Nile as a possibility, it is one of the few diseases that chikens are immune to. That said, there are a number of mosquito-borne illness that chickens are NOT immune to, but chances are pretty good that these would be affecting other bird owners as well.
As a couple of folks have already suggested, I wonder about some sort of toxin they are getting into. I think if the word poison was used in speaking with the vet, she likely thought deliberate poison. I am thinking something not deliberate: weed or insect killer on thnigs they eat, contaminated water--not their supplied water source, but maybe some water that is in some don't of cart basin or puddles or ponds? Also, how do you store your feed, and is there any chance that that is the problem? Damp or wet feed can mold, and the mold can be extremely toxic. Putting new bags of feed into a container or feed dish that has the mold can spread it to the new feed.
Specifically ask the state vet to do a necropsy. With this many birds lost to no obvious cause, they need to find out what is going on before it expands beyond your borders. If they want you tp pay for the cost, express the concern that you have what appears to be an epidemic, not an isolated case. Hopefully that will get sufficient attention to get you some help. Each time you speak with them, make sure to ask when you can expect to hear results. Also, ask for suggestions in caring for and any preventative treatment for the remaining birds.
I agree with the suggestion to separate the birds who show any symtoms of illness from those who appear to be healthy.
In response to a few earlier posts suggesting West Nile as a possibility, it is one of the few diseases that chikens are immune to. That said, there are a number of mosquito-borne illness that chickens are NOT immune to, but chances are pretty good that these would be affecting other bird owners as well.
Wow, I just read through the 16 pages of this thread.
While I would love to offer advise, it is best to hold on baited breath to see what the necropsies show. What a very difficult time for you and the family (especially your sister).
Do your best to take one day at a time. Try to enjoy the small stuff; phone conversations with you're sister, the silly antics of the birds, etc. This is the time that is precious as it is unclear how long any will be around. Smile, laugh, and breathe...
Best,
sdf
While I would love to offer advise, it is best to hold on baited breath to see what the necropsies show. What a very difficult time for you and the family (especially your sister).
Do your best to take one day at a time. Try to enjoy the small stuff; phone conversations with you're sister, the silly antics of the birds, etc. This is the time that is precious as it is unclear how long any will be around. Smile, laugh, and breathe...
Best,
sdf
- Thread starter
- #155
Well the vet called me last night after 7pm I missed the call,( I had forgotten to turn the ringer on my cell back up after I got off work) but she left a message saying that they had done the tests on the urine samples (I'm guessing from the q tip we stuck up there butts) and it had tested negative for END, AI and something larengytus. They will be testing the blood samples for those same three things but wont have the results for a week. IF it isn't one of those three things they apparently don't care. Only consirned about the exotice diseases and what the one vet thought it might be. I guess we will see about antibiotics. Any clue what would be the best choice? My friend has said if she can get it for less then $30 she will pay for it. Also considering deworming them and maybe some kind of dip too? What would be the best choice first?
It could be poison, I am not saying it couldn't I just don't think that is likely because of the fact that the guineas are drinking the same water (even from the creak behind the house ) as the ducks and chickens. In fact the chickens are rarely over there. Some that have died had never left our yard. I have had chickens for 5 years and never lost them to anything but hawks so I don't think it could be in the ground.
My sister is hoping to come back home for a week as soon as she is able and I hope to spend as much of that week with her as possible.
Thank you all again
Off to bed. I worked till 11 tonight and work again at 10:30 tomorrow morning
Oh well I need the money
Melissa
It could be poison, I am not saying it couldn't I just don't think that is likely because of the fact that the guineas are drinking the same water (even from the creak behind the house ) as the ducks and chickens. In fact the chickens are rarely over there. Some that have died had never left our yard. I have had chickens for 5 years and never lost them to anything but hawks so I don't think it could be in the ground.
My sister is hoping to come back home for a week as soon as she is able and I hope to spend as much of that week with her as possible.
Thank you all again
Off to bed. I worked till 11 tonight and work again at 10:30 tomorrow morning
Melissa
Quote:
Stupid vets! Ask them to do a necropsy! That will give you better information on WHY they have dies/are dying.
Baytril is the best antibiotic. Ask them to prescribe it. You will not be able to eat the eggs for awhile, but it will hopefully save them (assuming that the pathogen is bacterial.
FOOD can be the cause of toxins, not just water. Guineas tend to eat more bugs and less feed, which could be why they are unaffected. Also, they are a different species and have different sensitivities (and lack thereof).
Stupid vets! Ask them to do a necropsy! That will give you better information on WHY they have dies/are dying.
Baytril is the best antibiotic. Ask them to prescribe it. You will not be able to eat the eggs for awhile, but it will hopefully save them (assuming that the pathogen is bacterial.
FOOD can be the cause of toxins, not just water. Guineas tend to eat more bugs and less feed, which could be why they are unaffected. Also, they are a different species and have different sensitivities (and lack thereof).
I just had a thought Melissa...
Do you have any large commercial poultry producers near you...or even in your state?
Chances are they will know a whole lot about any disease that could wipe out an entire flock.
It is my assumption that they keep all their birds caged...and 'inside' if you will...for many reasons having to do with the profitability of chicken farming.
They have many reasons for growing birds this way but one reason may be that if they don't let them 'outside' then there are many diseases that they won't get.
Your problem may be one of them.
For instance...if one has a small toy dog that never goes outside, and potties on a pad in the house...then that dog will never get rabies...not unless some other animal brings in to them.
Profitability is a strong motivator for commercial chicken producers and they may be a lot more interested in what your birds may have then any public employee who will get a paycheck whether your birds die or not. If one can go by the Purdue Chicken advertising...those commercial farmers do a whole lot of research on chickens and will be more concerned with anything that could potentially wipe out thousands if not hundreds of thousands of birds. Your birds may have 'something' against which they protect their huge flocks...they may know what they have, or the cause because it is something they protect theirs from.
I have had amazing results over the years with emails sent to folks that held high positions in the private industry sector...It does not hurt to ask is my working theory.
I suspect that Frank Purdue (yes, I know he has passed on) would be very interested in the issue...he would be very interested in something that could possibly be an airborne pathogen that could conceivably wipe out millions of his chickens. He would care if 'the word' got out that there is some chicken illness that it is possible may be passed on to the consumer who eats the eggs or the meat. He may care from the direction of his company's profitability, but who cares?
HIV/Aids started out as a few cases here and there that the medical field had no clue what was this new (at the time) fatal disease was. Maybe huge chicken producers may be similarly interested. They will be very concerned that whatever it is does not pass to humans through the meat or eggs or that could cause a massive kill of their chickens. It may be worth a shot to contact them...
Do you have any large commercial poultry producers near you...or even in your state?
Chances are they will know a whole lot about any disease that could wipe out an entire flock.
It is my assumption that they keep all their birds caged...and 'inside' if you will...for many reasons having to do with the profitability of chicken farming.
They have many reasons for growing birds this way but one reason may be that if they don't let them 'outside' then there are many diseases that they won't get.
Your problem may be one of them.
For instance...if one has a small toy dog that never goes outside, and potties on a pad in the house...then that dog will never get rabies...not unless some other animal brings in to them.
Profitability is a strong motivator for commercial chicken producers and they may be a lot more interested in what your birds may have then any public employee who will get a paycheck whether your birds die or not. If one can go by the Purdue Chicken advertising...those commercial farmers do a whole lot of research on chickens and will be more concerned with anything that could potentially wipe out thousands if not hundreds of thousands of birds. Your birds may have 'something' against which they protect their huge flocks...they may know what they have, or the cause because it is something they protect theirs from.
I have had amazing results over the years with emails sent to folks that held high positions in the private industry sector...It does not hurt to ask is my working theory.
I suspect that Frank Purdue (yes, I know he has passed on) would be very interested in the issue...he would be very interested in something that could possibly be an airborne pathogen that could conceivably wipe out millions of his chickens. He would care if 'the word' got out that there is some chicken illness that it is possible may be passed on to the consumer who eats the eggs or the meat. He may care from the direction of his company's profitability, but who cares?
HIV/Aids started out as a few cases here and there that the medical field had no clue what was this new (at the time) fatal disease was. Maybe huge chicken producers may be similarly interested. They will be very concerned that whatever it is does not pass to humans through the meat or eggs or that could cause a massive kill of their chickens. It may be worth a shot to contact them...
Wow. Good luck solving this one! My guess would be a toxin in water or feed.
If the official vet will only check for the specific diseases that the commercial producers would be concerned with (END, etc.) it may be due to budget constraints. But at this point, maybe you could contact a private vet and find out how much it would cost to actually have a necropsy performed, so you can get to the bottom of this once and for all. At this point, with the number of birds you've lost, and the number you still have that you want to protect, it might be a better investment than the shotgun approach of trying antibiotics, dips and worming.
It's tragic that you're having to deal with all of this when you're really more focused on your sister. My heart goes out to you, and I hope you get some answers soon, and most of all best wishes to you and your sister.
It's tragic that you're having to deal with all of this when you're really more focused on your sister. My heart goes out to you, and I hope you get some answers soon, and most of all best wishes to you and your sister.
A whole long time ago my Father's Uncle was the biggest hog farmer in MO, and way up there among those in the country. I remember visiting the place as a kid...a pre-schooler; I'm now 65 so it was really a long time ago. I remember going into his barns where the sows gave birth and nursed their babies...it smelled like a hayloft. Clean, airy, and no flies. He was ahead of his time so to speak but he had a staff vet even back then. He was on the vanguard of what he called Scientific Pig Farming.
He can't have been the only one, and I'm sure that large poultry producers also have staff vets. All it takes is someone with authority to tell his or her staff to "find out what is killing those chickens"...and it will be done. Industry is driven by profit...someone has to be concerned about some unknown reason your birds are dying, and theirs could too.
My only guess is it is probably not genetic since it is crossing species types. I don't remember the beginning of the thread and am unfamiliar with ducks and other fowl other than chickens...but do they all eat the same food? If they are fed different feed, then it is probably not the feed. If it were the feed then chances are more than just the bags of feed you bought were contaminated, and there would be others affected. An email to whoever produced the feed just asking about recalls may spur some action. Feed companies have R & D staff.
Some sort of toxin in the water could be suspect but it seems to me it would have killed more of them, and all at the same time. Water is 'fluid'...no pun intended...so some toxin in a pond or stream would not TEND to keep killing them off...ponds are diluted by rain, stream water leaves and goes somewhere else. I think the county ag folks will test your well water for free.
If it were some toxin in the ground water that has become contaminated by farm run-off, or some contaminated industrial site, or some environmental thing like acid rain...then the EPA might be interested. An email to them also could not hurt.
If it were me...I'd not try to solve it on my own...I'd put my efforts into finding someone with clout or power or authority who cares.
He can't have been the only one, and I'm sure that large poultry producers also have staff vets. All it takes is someone with authority to tell his or her staff to "find out what is killing those chickens"...and it will be done. Industry is driven by profit...someone has to be concerned about some unknown reason your birds are dying, and theirs could too.
My only guess is it is probably not genetic since it is crossing species types. I don't remember the beginning of the thread and am unfamiliar with ducks and other fowl other than chickens...but do they all eat the same food? If they are fed different feed, then it is probably not the feed. If it were the feed then chances are more than just the bags of feed you bought were contaminated, and there would be others affected. An email to whoever produced the feed just asking about recalls may spur some action. Feed companies have R & D staff.
Some sort of toxin in the water could be suspect but it seems to me it would have killed more of them, and all at the same time. Water is 'fluid'...no pun intended...so some toxin in a pond or stream would not TEND to keep killing them off...ponds are diluted by rain, stream water leaves and goes somewhere else. I think the county ag folks will test your well water for free.
If it were some toxin in the ground water that has become contaminated by farm run-off, or some contaminated industrial site, or some environmental thing like acid rain...then the EPA might be interested. An email to them also could not hurt.
If it were me...I'd not try to solve it on my own...I'd put my efforts into finding someone with clout or power or authority who cares.
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