Making gentlemen our if my roos

[aart]

I have noticed it seems worst first thing in the morning. I will try separating the submissive one and see if his brother tries harder to dance.

I am reluctant to get rid of them because I got them for their survival instincts. I had coons and wanted back up for my increased security. Well I was kept away from home one night. Found 1 dead dry chicken, a duck pond with bloody water, 2 damp roos, and bloody coon tracks. They earned their keep.

I do believe that they can be better behaved with the ladies and that will make for a happier flock.

They are confined from about 2 hours before dusk until about 1 hour after dawn. There are multiple things to run behind and around. No pinch points. I'm still trying to convince my new ladies to sleep in the coop so we have multiple sleeping boxes right now.

So at what age are they considered "mature roosters"?

Yep, I've seen all males going for 'morning love'.
Separating just the one is not going to make them mature faster.
Age is your biggest problem right now, it's gonna take time.

Coons getting into the coop or birds were left outside overnight?
Males can help defend, but usually just speed bumps.

What does this mean?
"multiple sleeping boxes"

If coop is crowded, it will only make things worse all around.

 

[AllynTal]

Cockerels with testosterone poisoning can be a handful. If you can separate out the boys from the girls for a while, that will relieve some of the girl's stress and calm the boys down a bit if they don't have pullets to compete for. I had three roosters at one point. They established a 'rooster pecking order' that they all adhered to. The alpha and the second (the two in my avatar) worked together in cooperative, coordinated behavior to protect the flock, so yes, I understand what you're saying about them earning their keep.

I didn't separate mine out and they worked it out themselves. Yeah, some pullets protested and fussed, but it calmed down. None of my boys did the wing dance for hens or if they did, it was half-hearted. The wing-dance isn't necessarily a mating courtship as much as it is a display of dominance. My alpha rooster would wing-dance the rooster in the second slot and that second rooster would accept himself being dominated. He wouldn't squat like a hen does when she accepts being dominated, but his behavior was submission to the alpha rooster.

The morning, when they're let out of the coop, is the worst time for that mating raucus. The boys run around almost frantically looking to re-establish their dominance and reaffirm their position in the pecking order.

If you don't project human morals and social values onto the chickens and let them be chickens, it's possible for them to work it out.

 

[kesrchicky16]

It's worse in the mornings and late afternoons because that's when testosterone is highest. The stuff that's making them pains in the rear.

They are free in the afternoon. I don't cuss them too much in the evenings they focus on eating. They are sure to let me know when there are strange animals about. Our resident feral Tom cat was around the last two evenings. Roo-dolph (dominant) was pacing.

 

[JedJackson]

I have noticed it seems worst first thing in the morning. I will try separating the submissive one and see if his brother tries harder to dance.

I am reluctant to get rid of them because I got them for their survival instincts. I had coons and wanted back up for my increased security. Well I was kept away from home one night. Found 1 dead dry chicken, a duck pond with bloody water, 2 damp roos, and bloody coon tracks. They earned their keep.

I do believe that they can be better behaved with the ladies and that will make for a happier flock.

They are confined from about 2 hours before dusk until about 1 hour after dawn. There are multiple things to run behind and around. No pinch points. I'm still trying to convince my new ladies to sleep in the coop so we have multiple sleeping boxes right now.

So at what age are they considered "mature roosters"?

It varies with the breed but generally anything over a year old. And they do generally mellow out as far as mating behavior goes as they get older and the hens become used to them. I think it's worth the hassle to have roosters in a flock even if you don't intend to breed. They're beautiful, they usually protect the ladies and it's just fun to watch them and see them interact.

 

[apryl29]

we have multiple sleeping boxes right now.

if you don't have them, consider putting in some roosts. All 12 of my girls and my leghorn sleep on the roosts and my bantam cockerel sleeps on top of the food bin (not optimal, but I think he likes being by the door). I took a couple small trees we'd knocked down (1-2" diameter) and cut them to fit across the coop. Since I put them in they all sleep there.

 

[kesrchicky16]

Coons getting into the coop or birds were left outside overnight?
Males can help defend, but usually just speed bumps..

I was tardy getting home. The coop wasn't closed at dusk. I accept full responsibility for the loss that night. The death was in the run without the roof. I credit the roos with putting up enough fuss to give the coon second thoughts.

What does this mean?
"multiple sleeping boxes"

If coop is crowded, it will only make things worse all around.

When I get new birds I playpen them. They sleep in the dog crate I ship them in until they free range with the old flock. I got hens from 2 different locations when added the last time. We only integrated last week. Everyone is playing nice (For establishing pecking order) but the new birds aren't pushing the sleeping arangments. So there are dog crates in the run. Makes for more hiding behind spots.

My coop has roosts and when I disrupt sleeping the roosts are less then 1/2 full of chickens. Like 1 side is chickens and 1 side is bare. Flock is just having growing pains. I had some non preditor losses after I got the roos so I just doubled my flock. I didn't expect simple buddy buddy ness with this addition.

Just want to nip the impolite cockerels behavior in the butt if possible. I will give them some timeouts and watch Roo-dolph when he's out alone and see if he is more polite. I am mostly worried about the girls never submitting if they are so rude now. Also if they learn rude of ok they will never be polite. I don't want my girls to get hurt from rough mating because of something I could have helped eliminate.

 

[Chickassan]

Your roosters will be what they will be your intervention or lack of will have little to no impact on their personality. As for your hens never submitting if they are treated roughly to begin with, they will. Your girls are having to smooth things out with their own natural behavior just like your boys are. Just keep an eye on them, any trouble that escalates past the point of teenage angst get rid of that rooster. In my experience if you've got a rotten one it will be beyond easy to discover.

 

[EggSighted4Life]

Every single time? Do you're girls ever say NO? Often?
Are you sure they're boys?

I believe a rooster has two instincts. Survival and mating. I believe everything they do revolves around one of those two things.
Imo a rooster may take no for an answer and they may really work hard for a yes but at some point or another they will breed a hen that doesn't say yes because it is engrained into them that that's what they're meant to do in their mind.
Some people like to humanize their pets. Just like putting the label "rape" on that situation. On the same coin you wouldn't want to think of YOUR pet being a "rapist" and of course you would also prefer him to be a gentleman. But what's going on is not rape in their minds just ours because their mind doesn't work that way.

Of course not every single time...

They act different to the hens that don't give it up for too long. They will start to peck her down, don't let her pass on roost, don't let her get the treat they called the ladies to. So they expect some residual, but don't act like sex starved teen age inmates on parole. Also, given enough hens (and I mean a lot) I don't think they care about mating some. So I think if they have a good size harem they may not go out of their way to find that one or two un-mating hens. (But what do I know? I see thing all the time that I wouldn't EXPECT.)

But boys KNOW how to work for it... a little serenade, wing shuffle, calling to the treats... and not TOO many pecks after he gets off! No bloody combs (after initial learning curve).

I didn't personally call it rape and nor do I equate it with that. Though it took some explaining for my teenage daughter. To me it would be more on par with assault. But even then... I get that it's mating.

And yes, pullets who have never been mounted before WILL often react with screaming and running, making it SEEM very dramatic. Once they realize this is what's expected of them then they are more apt to comply. I've seen hens squat while the boy is still 2 feet away and maybe not even looking her direction.

Birds are creatures of habit. I would flip my lid first time something ever jumped on my back to.

It's true nature is brutal! I mean rat moms eat their kids... who can blame them, right?! Kidding. Definitely not in line with what some consider moral...

Anyways, for me separation until they are a little older seems to help with the boys becoming gentlemen. They practice their dominant behaviors on the other boys. As well as having older hens than cockerels. Juveniles of the same age are more likely to have aggressive mating because the older hens can keep the boys in check a bit easier. But of course all thing ARE relative and EVERY situation is different.

And yes, the wing shuffle is also about dominance and not just mating. I see my hens do it to others at certain times. Most recently one of higher up hens did it to one in the broody breaker.

 

[HenOnAJuneBug]

Any advise on how to get them to dance more frequently then they attack?

Have you tried playing Michael Jackson music for them while they sleep?

 

[The Moonshiner]

Of course not every single time...

They act different to the hens that don't give it up for too long. They will start to peck her down, don't let her pass on roost, don't let her get the treat they called the ladies to. So they expect some residual, but don't act like sex starved teen age inmates on parole. Also, given enough hens (and I mean a lot) I don't think they care about mating some. So I think if they have a good size harem they may not go out of their way to find that one or two un-mating hens. (But what do I know? I see thing all the time that I wouldn't EXPECT.)

But boys KNOW how to work for it... a little serenade, wing shuffle, calling to the treats... and not TOO many pecks after he gets off! No bloody combs (after initial learning curve).

I didn't personally call it rape and nor do I equate it with that. Though it took some explaining for my teenage daughter. To me it would be more on par with assault. But even then... I get that it's mating.

And yes, pullets who have never been mounted before WILL often react with screaming and running, making it SEEM very dramatic. Once they realize this is what's expected of them then they are more apt to comply. I've seen hens squat while the boy is still 2 feet away and maybe not even looking her direction.

Birds are creatures of habit. I would flip my lid first time something ever jumped on my back to.

It's true nature is brutal! I mean rat moms eat their kids... who can blame them, right?! Kidding. Definitely not in line with what some consider moral...

Anyways, for me separation until they are a little older seems to help with the boys becoming gentlemen. They practice their dominant behaviors on the other boys. As well as having older hens than cockerels. Juveniles of the same age are more likely to have aggressive mating because the older hens can keep the boys in check a bit easier. But of course all thing ARE relative and EVERY situation is different.

And yes, the wing shuffle is also about dominance and not just mating. I see my hens do it to others at certain times. Most recently one of higher up hens did it to one in the broody breaker.