Marans - SOP discussion thread

[Rocky Rhodes]

Have you taken a look at the conformation drawings? First and foremost, type is the #1 concern when we talk about meeting the SOP for Marans. The type is the same for all LF Marans - that has to be set before color is taken into consideration. Sidebar: at a recent show, a wheaten pullet was named BB out of probably 17 birds shown. That Wheaten had much too much black on her; however, her type was fantastic! That's why she was placed the highest of them all.

I have looked at the conformation drawings. I think I have a good understanding of a good silhouette. I am really just wanting to see a good cuckoo pattern. I have seen a lot of so called cuckoo marans, but I don't think I have seen a true cuckoo maran. I think this wheaten is a good type. Tell me what you think. I hate to be such an amateur.

 

[Wynette]

I have looked at the conformation drawings. I think I have a good understanding of a good silhouette. I am really just wanting to see a good cuckoo pattern. I have seen a lot of so called cuckoo marans, but I don't think I have seen a true cuckoo maran. I think this wheaten is a good type. Tell me what you think. I hate to be such an amateur.

I'm not a Cuckoo breeder, so I hesitate to say, but I would think, just as with the barring in a barred rock, there's a good deal of leeway, so long as there is nothing such as a different color (other than black/white) or a solid patch without pattern to it. Whoever breeds & is familiar with Cuckoo, please share your thoughts here.

On the male above - it's a bit hard to tell from the pictures, I'd prefer a closer-up picutre where he is posed/standing naturally, from the side, as well as from the top looking straight down, from the front, and from the rear. He appears to have a short back, which is not preferred. Also, his back is flat rather than slightly downhill (from base of neck to base of tail) as it should be - at least from the pics. The halo effect he shows in his hackles is discouraged in a Black Copper, but I'm unsure whether it's acceptable in a Wheaten. It appears that he has decent enough shank feathering, I can't see his eye well enough to know if the color is correct. The one thing I personally do not care for in this male is the white in his tail. While it's not a DQ, most of us are breeding away from that.

Last but not least - please don't say things like, "I hate to be such an amateur." Goodness, NO ONE knows it all! We're all here to help each other.

 

[NYREDS]

I have looked at the conformation drawings. I think I have a good understanding of a good silhouette. I am really just wanting to see a good cuckoo pattern. I have seen a lot of so called cuckoo marans, but I don't think I have seen a true cuckoo maran. I think this wheaten is a good type. Tell me what you think. I hate to be such an amateur.

Check the Dominique Thread. There are pleanty of pictures of Cuckoo birds there.

 

[3riverschick]

Cuckoo and barring are two different things. See Barred Plymouth Rocks for clear crisp barring. Cuckoo has more
"faded" barring to the edges of the bars. NYREDs, correct me if I am wrong but isn't true barring made with 2 copies
of the barring gene ( hence the crisp clean bars) and cuckoo made with 1 copy of the barring gene ( creating bars
with faded edges)?
Thanks,
Karen

 

[DMRippy]

Since I told you what the COLOR was supposed to look like I will show you my roo. He is not perfect.... he has white in his tail feathers but he as so much else going for him. So far his offspring don't have the white tail feathers and I hope to grow out a replacement roo soon. He is MASSIVE big and so are the chicks when they hatch he has great feathered legs which is really lacking in Cuckoo Marans. MOST have clean legs. His hackles are a little too light he may have a little birchen going on there but paired with the right hens the chicks don't seem to be birchen. He gets to stay till further notice.







Wynette from what I read on the Cuckoo thread when Walt and other were talking about the white tail feathers.... they would not be a DQ in Cuckoo. I have read the SOP for other cuckoos and I don't see that mentioned for others like Dominiquers. Same with Barred Rocks..... Solid BLACK feathers are allowed but are limited in number.... over that number and it is a DQ.

My roo is paird with my original blue cuckoo hens and they are some big girls too. I really LOVE the size on these cuckoos. Now if they would just lay more than 1-2 eggs a week I could get going for next spring. They lay JUMBO egg too.... color needs work but it is getting better in the new pullets. I few years and it will up to par.

 

[DMRippy]

Cuckoo and barring are two different things. See Barred Plymouth Rocks for clear crisp barring. Cuckoo has more
"faded" barring to the edges of the bars. NYREDs, correct me if I am wrong but isn't true barring made with 2 copies
of the barring gene ( hence the crisp clean bars) and cuckoo made with 1 copy of the barring gene ( creating bars
with faded edges)?
Thanks,
Karen

Not NYREDS but

No.... to breed true the cuckoos have to have 2 copies in the roo and one in the hens. Cuckoo is a different pattern than barring. Barring is an on off gene so that is why the black and white. Cuckoo fades in color with a grayer look between the colors.

As with barred rocks a roo with only one copy with throw solid chicks..... it can be useful but not if you don't want solid birds LOL.

Side Note: I have not STUDIED the difference between the two and what genetically makes them different. I did have to study hard to figure out how barring/cuckoo work in every combo the hard way.

Here is a thread that wynette posted in some time back
https://www.backyardchickens.com/t/580705/whats-the-difference-between-cuckoo-and-barred

 

[snowbird]

Since I told you what the COLOR was supposed to look like I will show you my roo. He is not perfect.... he has white in his tail feathers but he as so much else going for him. So far his offspring don't have the white tail feathers and I hope to grow out a replacement roo soon. He is MASSIVE big and so are the chicks when they hatch he has great feathered legs which is really lacking in Cuckoo Marans. MOST have clean legs. His hackles are a little too light he may have a little birchen going on there but paired with the right hens the chicks don't seem to be birchen. He gets to stay till further notice.







Wynette from what I read on the Cuckoo thread when Walt and other were talking about the white tail feathers.... they would not be a DQ in Cuckoo. I have read the SOP for other cuckoos and I don't see that mentioned for others like Dominiquers. Same with Barred Rocks..... Solid BLACK feathers are allowed but are limited in number.... over that number and it is a DQ.

My roo is paird with my original blue cuckoo hens and they are some big girls too. I really LOVE the size on these cuckoos. Now if they would just lay more than 1-2 eggs a week I could get going for next spring. They lay JUMBO egg too.... color needs work but it is getting better in the new pullets. I few years and it will up to par.

Donna, Walt came on the Cuckoo thread and stated that the white in wing and tail feathers would be a DQ.

 

[Wynette]

Excellent example of perfect wing carriage here, DMR! folks, note how this male's wing is carried perfectly horizontal - this is exactly what we want for Marans in wing carriage:

 

[NYREDS]

Cuckoo and barring are two different things. See Barred Plymouth Rocks for clear crisp barring. Cuckoo has more
"faded" barring to the edges of the bars. NYREDs, correct me if I am wrong but isn't true barring made with 2 copies
of the barring gene ( hence the crisp clean bars) and cuckoo made with 1 copy of the barring gene ( creating bars
with faded edges)?
Thanks,
Karen

Karen, I defer to your expertise when it comes to genetics. I know little about naming them, I just know how they work.

 

[3riverschick]

Karen, I defer to your expertise when it comes to genetics. I know little about naming them, I just know how they work.

Well then my words should be doubled checked with a reference if anyone wants to take them seriously.
Best,
Karen