Medicated biddie feed vs not

[Tc1456]

I wanna hear everyone’s thoughts on Medicated feed vs not. Personally I give it atleast the first 3 weeks and switch over to not medicated. My store sells 18% medicated and 24% not medicated. I really like both but I think that little protein edge the 24% gives helps them grow better. Thanks
Happy hatching!

 

[chickenlittle21]

I don't use medicated food because if the chicks already got vaccinated the medicated food will make them sick

 

[EggSighted4Life]

I wanna hear everyone’s thoughts on Medicated feed vs not.

Hi there, welcome to BYC!

If you are in the US... medicated feed has LOW dose amprolium in it... a coccidiostat... Adding your general location to your profile will help folks make their most relevant suggestions possible without having to ask. I do like a little mystery and guessing according to clues in the post..good spelling and grammar.. thinking female (not relevant),"biddy's".. thinking older, not teen... and maybe in the south or north east... maybe UK... how's that for stereo typing?! Sorry, I was just having fun here. I'm truly clueless.

I used medicated feed when I was told if I didn't my chicks would die... total hogwash!

Feeding medicated feed will NOT make your chicks sick if they were vaccinated... EVEN against coccidiosis... what it does is render the coccidiosis vaccine ineffective... big difference than causing sickness.

What I learned is that medicated feed can be useful in very crowded conditions or where the water may get soiled with droppings. It happened to me once when I had several brooders and a heat lamp went out with no access to replacement (everything was closed) until after I had to be gone the whole next day and they were way overcrowded. Being gone, I was unable to change water when it got a poo inside.

Medicated feed is almost completely irrelevant if you're brooder is spacious enough for the number of chicks it holds and kept DRY. It can even be a false sense of security... as it a LOW (preventative) dose... some chicks may STILL need to be treated for coccidiosis with a treatment or drench dose if conditions call for such.

Amprolium by the way... isn't an antibiotic and nor does it actively kill coccidia. It works by MIMICKING thiamine... (that coccidia feed on) there by essentially starving them out and slowing their growth (reproduction) while the bird continues to build its' own resistance. Coccidia are in ever single chicken poo.. and only become a problem when too may sporulated oocysts (microscopic eggs exposed to air) are ingested (eaten or drank). For this reason... vitamin supplements should NOT be given during treatment with Corid if needed as they negate each other.

My store sells 18% medicated and 24% not medicated. I really like both but I think that little protein edge the 24% gives helps them grow better.

I would (personally) choose the 24 over 18% for starter.. noting that not all protein is created equal... ie soy verse fish, plant verses animal protein... and ultimately the what's truly key is also the amino acid content... I have used up to 30% protein turkey starter for chicks... there is a limited point of return to how much protein they can actually uptake and the rest gets excreted as extra smelly waste.

I used to be a heavy protein pusher before realizing that excess protein can cause kidney issues just as bad as excess calcium in non laying birds... Come to think of it.. now, I might mix the 18 & 24% feeds to arrive at 21%...

I currently start, raise, breed, and hatch... all my (chicken) breeds using 20% protein (Purina) Flock Raiser... going on several years now quite successfully with oyster shell on the side for active layers. I never switch and since making the change... NO, I don't see feathers grow in faster on chicks and nor did they reach a larger mature size... even when feeding the 30% protein... BUT they do however enter molt less harsh and return quicker seemingly because they have more reserve on board to start out with. Studies show highest hatch rates at 22% protein. Higher than that actually reduces male fertility and hatch rate... hatching chicks NEED the carbs also... apparently.

For me, I try not to over crowd my brooders and AVOID using medicated feed... so that the medication WILL work IF and when I NEED it to. In SOME locations coccidia have built resistance to amprolium and may need to be treated with a sulfa antibiotic. Resistance alone is good enough reason for me to avidly recommend not using it unless you have true cause for concern like knowing your stock load is a bit too heavy for your space or cleaning practices.. or your pasture condition are ripe. We all face different challenges!

Interesting that you mention giving it the first 3 weeks.. I was thinking also giving the higher protein maybe the first 3 weeks... as researching and studying never end, here.. I recently saw that the first 3 weeks of growth were key to reaching FULL genetic potential.. So in theory doing your very best during that time will give the best long term result. The more I research... the more I learn and all though at first protein gung ho... now I'm realizing that we WAY over rate it according to our thought processes... as much as I don't like their low suggestions, I DO consider Merck to be one of the most accurate resources...
https://www.merckvetmanual.com/poul...t-poultry/nutritional-requirements-of-poultry


https://www.merckvetmanual.com/poul...t-poultry/nutritional-requirements-of-poultry

Note the third link here at the bottom states the importance of amino acids... which ARE synthetically added to our formulated feed rations...
https://www.merckvetmanual.com/poul...t-poultry/nutritional-requirements-of-poultry

OKAY... that looks like the same exact line all 3 times! Please note they are the tables... wonder if they linked this time?? Will edit if not, Sorry!

Nutrient Requirements of Growing Pullets a

Nutrient Requirements of Laying Hens at Different Feed Intakes a

Nutrient Requirements of Broilers a

Medicated or not... seems to be a personal choice. Just remember not to let it be a false sense of security and always pay attention to symptoms IF they present. Only one or two of the 9-12 strains of coccidia that are currently known to effect chickens may present as blood in droppings.

What's really key is just that you ARE using a formulated ration and not diminishing it with excess low nutrient (scratch/corn) or high energy (meal worms/corn) treats. You're off to a great start and with BYC at your finger tips... the possibilities are endless... beware of chicken math!

Happy adventures!

 

[Ridgerunner]

@EggSighted4Life are you OK? That post was almost as long as one of mine.

@Tc1456 I'll copy something I wrote several years back.

First you need to know what the "medicated" is in the medicated feed. It should be on the label. Usually it is Amprolium, Amprol, some such product, but until you read the label, you really don't know. Every "medicated' feed I'm aware of from major brands for chicks that will be layers uses Amprolium, but people on this forum that I trust have posted hat some feeds for broilers have things other than Amprolium. I'll assume it is an Amprolium product, but if it is not, then realize everything I say about it may not apply. And it is possible that the "medicated" is Amprolium AND something else.

Amprol is not an antibiotic. It does not kill anything. It inhibits the protozoa that cause coccidiosis (often called Cocci on this forum) from multiplying in the chicken's system. It does not prevent the protozoa from multiplying; it just slows that multiplication down. There are several different strains of protozoa that can cause Cocci, some more severe than others. Chickens can develop immunity to a specific strain of the protozoa, but that does not give them immunity to all protozoa that cause Cocci. Little bitty tiny baby chicks can develop that immunity easier than older chickens.

It is not a big deal for the chicken’s intestines to contain some of the protozoa that cause Cocci. The problem comes in when the number of those protozoa gets huge. The protozoa can multiply in the chicken’s intestines but also in wet manure. Different protozoa strains have different strengths, but for almost all cases, if you keep the brooder dry, you will not have a problem.

To develop immunity to a specific strain, that protozoa needs to be in the chicks intestines for two or three weeks. The normal sequence is that a chick has the protozoa. It poops and some of the cysts that develop the protozoa come out in the poop. If the poop is slightly damp, those cysts develop and will then develop in the chick's intestines when the chicks eat that poop. This cycle needs go on for a few weeks so all chicks are exposed and they are exposed long enough to develop immunity. A couple of important points here. You do need to watch them to see if they are getting sick. And the key is to keep the brooder dry yet allow some of the poop to stay damp. Not soaking wet, just barely damp. Wet poop can lead to serious problems.

What sometimes happens is that people keep chicks in a brooder and feed them medicated feed while they are in the brooder. Those chicks are never exposed to the Cocci protozoa that lives in the dirt in their run, so they never develop the immunity to it. Then, they are switched to non-medicated feed and put on the ground where they are for the first time exposed to the protozoa. They do not have immunity, they do not have the protection of the medicated feed, so they get sick. Feeding medicated feed while in the brooder was a complete waste.

I do not feed medicated feed. I keep the brooder dry to not allow the protozoa to breed uncontrollably. The third day that they are in the brooder, I take a scoop of dirt from the run and feed it to them so I can introduce the protozoa and they can develop the immunity they need to the strain they need to develop an immunity to. To provide a place for that slightly damp poop, I keep a square of plywood in the dry brooder and let the poop build up on that. I don't lose chicks to Cocci when they hit the ground.

There is absolutely nothing wrong with feeding medicated feed to chicks, whether the protozoa are present or not. It will not hurt them. They can still develop the immunity they need. But unless the protozoa are present, it also does no good.

If you get your chicks vaccinated for Cocci, do not feed medicated feed. It can negate the vaccinations.

 

[Tc1456]

Thank you guys for your information! And I’m from Kentucky in USA and I’m 18 years old! I’ve had chickens ever since I can remmeber and I have grown around them and developed a strong love toward tending to them. I raise game breed of chickens (Hatchs,greys,etc) and currently working on getting some ducks and goats! I really like this page! I’m sorry if you couldn’t tell what I meant by biddie! It’s what I’ve always called baby chicks. And thanks again for your guys inputs on the feeding techniques and If you guys can add me on this page, feel free too. I’m not very knowledged with this website yet but I’ll get the hang of it! Happy hatching and god bless you all!