Mereks

[0wen]

UPDATE:
Okay so we got our narcropsy back and it turns out they don't have mereks! They actually have a parasite called heterakis, however I still have a problem. These chickens aren't vaccinated and the new chicks will be, since the new ones will be vaccinated will they be okay with the non vaccinated chickens or should I not pen them together? (Yes I know how to integrate chicks so that's not an issue) I have a friend with chickens, would I be better off giving him my current non vaccinated chickens and just starting over with a whole new flock like I was planning to originally? I have no clue what to do

Perfectly fine to mix vaccinated and non-vaccinated chickens. Some will tell you that the vaccinated chicks will infect the non-vaccinated ones but that isn't true. The only way that happens is if Marek's is present anyway where the vaccinated chicks will have some immunity and the un-vaccinated ones will likely fall. That's Marek's that was present anyway and has nothing to di with the vaccinated chicks. If you're current flock is healthy, adding vaccinated chicks shouldn't have any bearing on that.

 

[CuzChickens]

I do not vaccinate any of my 44 and everybody is very healthy. I use a LOT of herbs like fresh oregano to help prevent it. I also use garlic, ginger and apple cider vinegar in their water. I make a tea by crushing the garlic and ginger and boiling the water then letting it steep and straining out the solids, add the ACV and dilute with water. My chickens love it.

 

[jayce430]

I was told that my flock has mereks ( paralyzed legs, heavy breathing and green stool) has taken 2 hens and a rooster so far I have the ones that showed signs separated in a different pen. If it is mereks when will I know it has run it course. The others died all within 4 days of the symptoms starting. I want to get some new chicks and plan on having them vaccinated and away from the flock however complete quarantine is hard here it's windy I have 5 dogs who are around them also and am I supposed to sanitize the dogs before they come into the house where chicks will be ? Anyways just wondering when can I stop worrying (if it goes a a while without a death) thanks in advance

 

[0wen]

Giving a flock fresh herbs and healthy feed is great practice - in general, but 100% it does not prevent Marek's Disease. Like everyone who doesn't vaccinate - it's luck of the draw in that Marek's doesn't find its way into your flock or it does (or worst case scenario - "until it does"). Fresh and healthy feed certainly goes towards making healthy birds, but Marek's is a transmittable disease that is often found in the environment - carried by wild birds, blown in on the wind from a neighboring flock, or on your clothes from visiting the feed store or livestock swap... Adequate space and a lot of ventilation may help more than anything (outside of the obvious vaccination) once you've spent your luck of Marek's not making it into your flock in the first place.

Marek's will "run its course" once it has taken all of the birds that will succumb to it - that's often all of the birds in your flock; but on occasion, you'll get a survivor here and there. 'Running its course' in the environment is another thing - it can survive in the soil or in your coop for a very very long time. A lot of people use Oxine, or Virkon to disinfect after Marek's; I know several who have brought in tons of soil to bury the old plot and/or excavate the earth where their infected coop and run once sat.

In your circumstance, where you can't isolate completely, I would suggest that you simply do the best you can with what you have. I'd remove the bedding/litter in your coop as completely as you can and add new and if you don't have the previously listed disinfectants available - I'd still wipe down your coop, feeders, nesting boxes, etc with what you do have - even if it's a bleach concoction. It likely won't help - bleach doesn't 'kill' the virus but a general cleaning won't hurt. There are a couple of links with some reading in regards to Marek's in my signature if you're interested..

 

[Wyorp Rock]

I was told that my flock has mereks ( paralyzed legs, heavy breathing and green stool) has taken 2 hens and a rooster so far I have the ones that showed signs separated in a different pen. If it is mereks when will I know it has run it course. The others died all within 4 days of the symptoms starting. I want to get some new chicks and plan on having them vaccinated and away from the flock however complete quarantine is hard here it's windy I have 5 dogs who are around them also and am I supposed to sanitize the dogs before they come into the house where chicks will be ? Anyways just wondering when can I stop worrying (if it goes a a while without a death) thanks in advance

Hi @jayce430 Welcome To BYC.

I'm sorry to hear about your losses.
Have you had any testing performed to confirm Marek's? If you haven't then I recommend that you send a bird for necropsy - this is the only way to know for sure what you are dealing with. Since you are in OBX , Raleigh would be your closest lab to contact.

Marek's does not "run a course". Birds are carriers of the virus all their lives. Once you have Marek's on your property, it can last for years in the environment. Some birds can recover, but they are still carriers. The vaccine helps prevent tumor formation, but does not prevent infection from the virus.

I encourage you to do some research/reading on what Marek's is, how it works and how it's transmitted. There are a lot of threads here on BYC and the web with useful information. Some people do manage flocks with Marek's, but they keep the flocks "closed" and cull those that show signs of illness.

Here's some reading to get you started:
https://www.backyardchickens.com/a/the-great-big-giant-mareks-disease-faq
http://edis.ifas.ufl.edu/ps044


Rollins Animal Disease Laboratory1031 Mail Service Center
Raleigh, NC 27699-1031Phone: (919) 733-3986
Fax: (919) 733-0454
Or
N.C. Dept. Of AG
http://www.ncagr.gov/vet/

 

[jayce430]

Thank you very much. I guess what I meant by run it course it I have some birds I got from hatchery and some I purchased and some I hatched and I know they are not vaccinated but I believe some I purchased and hatchery babies were however so what I was asking is I guess it is I go 10 days or more without any birds with symptoms can I be confident to believe that the worse is over. I planned on getting some new babies soon and they will come vaccinate and be quarantined inside the house but is it going to be ok for them

 

[Wyorp Rock]

Thank you very much. I guess what I meant by run it course it I have some birds I got from hatchery and some I purchased and some I hatched and I know they are not vaccinated but I believe some I purchased and hatchery babies were however so what I was asking is I guess it is I go 10 days or more without any birds with symptoms can I be confident to believe that the worse is over. I planned on getting some new babies soon and they will come vaccinate and be quarantined inside the house but is it going to be ok for them

Did you have testing to confirm what you are dealing with is Marek's?

Marek's can develop at any age. Usually you will see symptoms develop around 12-25weeks, but there is no guarantee this will always be true. From what I understand the virus is constantly "mutating". Vaccination, I would think will give the chicks some level of protection, but it is not a perfect system. Like I mentioned in the previous post, the vaccine does not prevent infection from the virus, it only prevents the formation of tumors. So, they could still develop symptoms like paralysis, going off feed, breathing/respiratory difficulties, etc.

I'm not trying to scare you and I understand your concerns. But there just is no way to know if they will be totally fine.

 

[0wen]

Thank you very much. I guess what I meant by run it course it I have some birds I got from hatchery and some I purchased and some I hatched and I know they are not vaccinated but I believe some I purchased and hatchery babies were however so what I was asking is I guess it is I go 10 days or more without any birds with symptoms can I be confident to believe that the worse is over. I planned on getting some new babies soon and they will come vaccinate and be quarantined inside the house but is it going to be ok for them

If they are vaccinated and you plan on brooding them in the house for a while, then most likely they'll be fine. The vaccination isn't a 100% success story (although for me it has been) in that there have been instances of vaccinated birds still succumbing to the disease. That is the exception rather than the rule however. There's no guarantee that your birds will be fine if they make a 10 (or whatever) day threshold unfortunately. I knew someone who lost an entire flock to Marek's that was drawn out over a few weeks or better - that being said, if you have birds alive in 10 days, and they're showing no signs of symptoms - I would be cautiously optimistic in your shoes. It's a terrible disease and one with rare events of good news at the end. I would suggest vaccinating going forward. Vaccinating at home, if you decide to hatch is easy enough. Obviously, I wouldn't sell or give away birds from your flock as that's simply sending a death warrant out to the new owner's other birds.

I vaccinate everything even though I've never had an instance of Marek's on my current property. I lost several birds (70% or so of one of my early flocks) to Marek's once and have vaccinated ever since. I actually moved because of Marek's and restarted - although the previously infected location now has a resident that keeps chickens (5 years later) with no mishaps (vaccinated origin flock, no-vaccinated offspring)..

 

[jayce430]

Yeah I guess they all will have to be vaccinated from here on out because my customers want thier fresh eggs and my girls could barley keep up prior to loosing a few