Mutant Cocci? Woke to 5 dead chicks

[Eggcessive]

Many of us place a piece of sod into out brooders for chicks to peck at from the beginning. It gradually exposes them to coccidia in the soil when they have a little natural immunity, and they gradually build up tolerance. Chicks who are raised under a broody on the ground from day 2 or 3 seem to not get coccidiosis.

You said you have used both sulfa and Corid (amprollium) to treat. Sulfa is useful against a couple of the most serious strains of coccidia, while amprollium is useful against all. But it seems you are dealing with a strain that is especially lethal. You may be better off giving a preventative round of amprollium or sulfa next time before normal the age of symptoms, say at 2 weeks or even sooner. Medicated feed is suposed to help, but it still does not seem to always work.

It might cost some money, but if that is possible, you may want to send a couple of chicks in to your state vet or poultry lab to diagnose which lethal strain of coccidia that is killing chicks. I am really sorry that you have lost so many, but this sounds like an unusual case. I would follow advice to disinfect equipment and brooders.

 

[crystalchik]

Since you're feeding them medicated feed, I wouldve used sulmet or sulfadimethoxine right from the beginning.
If they were being fed non medicated feed, perhaps the corid mightve been effective, but I doubt it. Why? Because there are only one or two types of cocci out of the 9 types of cocci that causes chickens to excrete blood. I forgot which type(s.) Those one or two types are "bacterial acting" type cocci, but are actually still protozoa. Therefore a sulfa drug wouldve been effective. Anytime you see a tiny trace of blood in baby chick feces, use a sulfa drug immediately. You will have to give it orally to each chick to ensure they are properly dosed.
As mentioned previously by another poster, when you see blood in feces at the amount you saw, it's too late. With your experience, I know you keep feeders/waterers/litter clean at all times. However it would be best to disinfect everything with a water/ammonia mixture to kill cocci.
Sorry for your losses.
ETA: It is Eimeria Tenella that causes the cecal bloody type coccidiosis and Eimeria Necatrix that causes bloody intestinal coccidiosis.

I had no idea there were so many different types. I have always treated successfully with Sulmet through the years. I actually did treat the first group of chicks that I almost lost with Sulmet. They were on it for about 4 days and continued to get much worse. There was no response. It was when I used the corid that they finally came around after several days. But even on the corid it took them more than 5 days for the stool to completely clear up. I ended up leaving them on it for almost a week, even though the recommended treatment time is 4 days. They were still defecating pure blood at 4 days. What dosage do you give them directly of the sulfa drug?

 

[crystalchik]

Many of us place a piece of sod into out brooders for chicks to peck at from the beginning. It gradually exposes them to coccidia in the soil when they have a little natural immunity, and they gradually build up tolerance. Chicks who are raised under a broody on the ground from day 2 or 3 seem to not get coccidiosis.

You said you have used both sulfa and Corid (amprollium) to treat. Sulfa is useful against a couple of the most serious strains of coccidia, while amprollium is useful against all. But it seems you are dealing with a strain that is especially lethal. You may be better off giving a preventative round of amprollium or sulfa next time before normal the age of symptoms, say at 2 weeks or even sooner. Medicated feed is suposed to help, but it still does not seem to always work.

It might cost some money, but if that is possible, you may want to send a couple of chicks in to your state vet or poultry lab to diagnose which lethal strain of coccidia that is killing chicks. I am really sorry that you have lost so many, but this sounds like an unusual case. I would follow advice to disinfect equipment and brooders.

That is a great idea using a piece of sod. I will definitely give that a try. My question is though, since they have had no exposure to any other chicken or seemingly any source of coccidia, where are they getting it from?

Yes I used Sulmet on the first group of chicks 4 at least four days and they were unresponsive, and the symptoms continue to get much worse. At which point I switch them to the cord. They continued with the pureblood for about four days, at 5 days and on it started to clear up. This group of chicks I skipped using Sulmet and went straight to the corid. They've been on it for 2 days now and I haven't lost any more, but they are not improving. One is near death. Would you recommend corid or Sulmet as a preventative? And what dosage?
I regret not sending in one of the chicks that I found yesterday morning. If any of these die now, I'm concerned thst since they have been treated for so many days it may not give an accurate diagnosis?
Thank you, I'm glad to hear that you think it's an unusual case. I've been getting extremely discouraged. I've never dealt with anything like this before. Ive always treated with Sulmet and it clears it up within 24 hours.

 

[Eggcessive]

Sulmet and other sulfa drugs such sulfadimethoxine (Albon,) Bacrim, and TMP-SMZ can be hard on the liver. We can no longer buy Sulmet or other drugs OTC without a vet prescription. Most start with Corid a farm-store drug for cattle, that mimics thiamine in coccidia, and is very safe. Out of the 9-12 strains of coccidia that affect chickens, only 2 or 3 are severe. Most people say to start with Corid, then if no response or deaths occur, switch to sulfa drugs.

Coccidia has been know to be spread by darkling beetles, which are found in most bedding around chicken coops.

 

[dawg53]

For liquid sulmet; dosage is 1 tablespoon per half gallon water for two days, make it fresh both days. Then half dosage (liquid sulmet) to half gallon water for 4 days. Make it fresh each day.

Sulmet soluable powder dosage; add 2 tablespoons to each gallon of water, medicate for 2 days, then reduce drug concentration to one half (1 tablespoon per gallon of water) for 4 additional days.

There is a 10 day slaughter withdrawal period. Excessive dosage may cause toxic reactions.
Dont try hatching eggs during medication and short periods thereafter. Sulmet also treats coryza, acute fowl cholera, salmonella pullorum.

Sulmet treats the 2 types of cocci that causes chicks to excrete blood.

Another thing to consider is their feed. Was there mold in the feed or on the inside of the bag? Have you seen small clumps of feed? If so, that means the feed was wet at one time, then it dried.

SMZ/TMP can be purchased online to treat cocci w/o script.

 

[Eggcessive]

I did quite a bit of reading today to find out if chicks have coccidia in their guts naturally. The articles said that they can get it from several ways by contamination from contaminated shoes, bedding, equipment used for other chickens in the past, and from wild birds flying overhead if outside.

They also spoke of bad outbreaks being related to enteritis which can happen to chicks with coccidia. That may be treated with certain antibiotics that the bacteria is sensitive to. The vet could do a gram stain for the bacteria responsible, which many times is clostridium perfringens.

 

[dawg53]

I did quite a bit of reading today to find out if chicks have coccidia in their guts naturally. The articles said that they can get it from several ways by contamination from contaminated shoes, bedding, equipment used for other chickens in the past, and from wild birds flying overhead if outside.

They also spoke of bad outbreaks being related to enteritis which can happen to chicks with coccidia. That may be treated with certain antibiotics that the bacteria is sensitive to. The vet could do a gram stain for the bacteria responsible, which many times is clostridium perfringens.

x2. Cocci can actually be blown around by the wind.
They can be seen on a microscopic slide in a fecal sample. The slide should show some cocci which would be normal, but if the slide is loaded with cocci, there's a big problem.
However when it comes to just one worm oocyst, time to treat for worms.

I believe one of my BR's had necrotic enteritis two years ago and I threw everything at the bird including the kitchen sink to no avail, had to cull her.