Need Good Ol' Chicken Dog

[Mutt Farm]

You're wrong. And I am cerainly not ignorant, would never dump or be cruel to a dog, I rescue dumped dogs and keep them all their lives. Dogs know and understand a whole lot more than you think. And scientists have finally proven what every five year old child can tell you: Dogs have emotions like we do, in fact they are more deeply feeling and sensitive than most people.

I was not calling you personally ignorant by any means. I apologize if you thought I was. My reference to "ignorant" is defined as "lacking knowledge, information, or awareness about something in particular. The field of applied animal behavior was virtually non existent 30 years ago. I was ignorant of it as well back then. Most earlier training methods were based upon punishment and aversives. As an educator, I'm compelled to dispel myths when an opportunity presents itself. In your scenario, leaving the dead chicken tied around the dog's neck has nothing to do with the behavioral change. The dog sensing a human's anger by body language, scolding, tone of voice and being exiled (we call that a time out now) and associating those negatives with the sight and smell of the presented carcass elicited the change in behavior if there was one. Training a dog basic obedience and "leave it", correcting even the slightest interest in the chickens from the beginning, rewarding the dog for ignoring a scampering chicken is best practice. Some owners find the use of a remote trainer effective. If punishment is necessary, skip the tying the chicken step. Show the dog the chicken, harshly scold with the meanest posture and growly voice you can muster. Kennel or ignore the dog. Do that a few times then dispose of the chicken. Here is a link to a great fun book. "Don't Shoot the Dog https://www.dogwise.com/ItemDetails.cfm?ID=DTB116

 

[baah]

Respectfully disagree with post that says "it's not the breed, it's the training". I believe it IS the breed AND it IS the training. I hav a BC & even being at the top of the canine intelligence pyramid she will NEVER b an LGD. Her biology is 2 herd. I also hav a chihuahua mix & a dachshund + a boxer/bulldog mix & none of them could ever b trained to guard lifestock & respond in the intelligent way a true LGD does. Get a GOOD BREED of pup 2 start: one that has been used as a LG in its breed's evolution (snaps to all our wise shepherd ancestors!) Then consistently put in the time to capitalize on its natural instincts for about 18 mos, having patience with its immature mistakes, & ur reward will b a faithful & very valuable member of ur farmstead for the next decade. Start ur NEXT LGD when the 1st one is about 3-4 yrs old & the Sr may actually help u train the Jr!

 

[brekke69]

No dog or human will save a chicken from a hawk or other air predator. We have had 2 attacks on our chickens with dogs and humans in the yard at that time.

In one attack our 116 pound German Shepard and two 17 pound Pomeranian were running up and down the fence line barking loudly playing with the neighbor dogs, two 10-12 pound French Bull Dogs, and 4 of us humans were out in the yard in various places. I was standing 2 feet from Kitiara (my RIR hen) when a Coopers Hawk swooped down and attempted to take her away. Luckily she was too heavy. He did pluck out a strip of feathers. She was OK, no bleeding or torn skin.




Just saying - don't feel too comfortable.

And, how I get my dogs to ignore the chickens as toys? My entire household is a collage of animals - unwanted, neglected, sick, injured or homeless (fur, feathers and scales). They come to me, I take care of them and they take care of me; providing endless love and eggs (hehehe). Sometimes the first 24 hours in my home gives a critter sensory overload. Once they calm down, look around and see everyone eating together, sleeping together and watching TV together, all is right. I have never had a discipline problem. The house rule is YOU DON'T EAT YOUR ROOMMATES. No one does. I have never had to train, it just happens. I am lucky I guess.

 

[centrarchid]

No dog or human will save a chicken from a hawk or other air predator. We have had 2 attacks on our chickens with dogs and humans in the yard at that time. In one attack our 116 pound German Shepard and two 17 pound Pomeranian were running up and down the fence line barking loudly playing with the neighbor dogs, two 10-12 pound French Bull Dogs, and 4 of us humans were out in the yard in various places. I was standing 2 feet from Kitiara (my RIR hen) when a Coopers Hawk swooped down and attempted to take her away. Luckily she was too heavy. He did pluck out a strip of feathers. She was OK, no bleeding or torn skin. Just saying - don't feel too comfortable. And, how I get my dogs to ignore the chickens as toys? My entire household is a collage of animals - unwanted, neglected, sick, injured or homeless (fur, feathers and scales). They come to me, I take care of them and they take care of me; providing endless love and eggs (hehehe). Sometimes the first 24 hours in my home gives a critter sensory overload. Once they calm down, look around and see everyone eating together, sleeping together and watching TV together, all is right. I have never had a discipline problem. The house rule is YOU DON'T EAT YOUR ROOMMATES. No one does. I have never had to train, it just happens. I am lucky I guess.

I have had roosters and hens (fully adult) repel Coopers Hawks and lost no chicks to them since when all in close proximity to adults chickens. Red-tailed hawks are not able to hunt me even for rodents because chickens raise alarm and dogs respond. My dogs totally free-range overlap with vulnerable chickens. Dogs even repel Great-horned Owls and we caught a Barred Owl a couple winters back trying for chicks in brooder area.

 

[Mutt Farm]

Respectfully disagree with post that says "it's not the breed, it's the training". I believe it IS the breed AND it IS the training. I hav a BC & even being at the top of the canine intelligence pyramid she will NEVER b an LGD. Her biology is 2 herd. I also hav a chihuahua mix & a dachshund + a boxer/bulldog mix & none of them could ever b trained to guard lifestock & respond in the intelligent way a true LGD does. Get a GOOD BREED of pup 2 start: one that has been used as a LG in its breed's evolution (snaps to all our wise shepherd ancestors!) Then consistently put in the time to capitalize on its natural instincts for about 18 mos, having patience with its immature mistakes, & ur reward will b a faithful & very valuable member of ur farmstead for the next decade. Start ur NEXT LGD when the 1st one is about 3-4 yrs old & the Sr may actually help u train the Jr!

BINGO! Good stuff! Nature vs Nurture, Instinct vs learned behaviors. Science has proven it's both. Animals are born with certain traits and instincts. They never go away. Training can be used to manage or develop the instinct, it's always there. Conversely, an animal that lacks a certain instinct will never develop that but can learn certain behaviors. Studies show that pups begin active learning from the mother as early as 4 weeks, so a good pup from a good working LGD makes sense! About your dogs not guarding, and getting one bred to do that, sad story.. My neighbor has 2 HUGE MEAN Bull Mastiffs that run loose, lots of free range chickens and turkeys and a Chihuahua on 2 acres. The coyotes have killed half the chickens, 8 turkeys and the little dog. The Mastiffs did nothing, but would eat my face if I hopped the fence.

 

[Mutt Farm]

No dog or human will save a chicken from a hawk or other air predator. We have had 2 attacks on our chickens with dogs and humans in the yard at that time.

In one attack our 116 pound German Shepard and two 17 pound Pomeranian were running up and down the fence line barking loudly playing with the neighbor dogs, two 10-12 pound French Bull Dogs, and 4 of us humans were out in the yard in various places. I was standing 2 feet from Kitiara (my RIR hen) when a Coopers Hawk swooped down and attempted to take her away. Luckily she was too heavy. He did pluck out a strip of feathers. She was OK, no bleeding or torn skin.




Just saying - don't feel too comfortable.

And, how I get my dogs to ignore the chickens as toys? My entire household is a collage of animals - unwanted, neglected, sick, injured or homeless (fur, feathers and scales). They come to me, I take care of them and they take care of me; providing endless love and eggs (hehehe). Sometimes the first 24 hours in my home gives a critter sensory overload. Once they calm down, look around and see everyone eating together, sleeping together and watching TV together, all is right. I have never had a discipline problem. The house rule is YOU DON'T EAT YOUR ROOMMATES. No one does. I have never had to train, it just happens. I am lucky I guess.

Glad your hen is ok! Spot on true and FUNNY! Thanks for the post and hawk reminder. We are loaded with Coopers and Red Tails.

 

[ShaVirginia]

Years ago, on farm; our cocker spaniel dam & her pup, tolerated chickens. But, when we built pond and got ducks, the pup was in her glory! She would "herd" the ducks back into their yard & pond. We had to teach her not to put them away during the day. Both were AKC american CockerSpaniels. The pup was from litter bred for eye research. I think it is part of the Spaniel hunting dog history.
Regards

 

[Jhawker]

We have had chickens and dogs for 35 years. It took some training to teach the dogs not to chase chickens. I did have a chicken herding Papillon dog that rounded them up and put them in the coop each evening. No matter how good the watch dog we had we always had to lock the hens up in a secure coop each evening to keep the foxes and racoons out. Then we acquired goats and Livestock Guardian dogs. Ours are Great Pyranees/Anatolian Shepard cross. We haven't lost a chicken or single ear of corn in 6 years. One came to us as a 2 year old. He tended to stay with the goats (good dog) but we monitored things when we let the chickens out. He hadn't been around chickens before and we had to get after him a few times. A year later we got a pup of the same cross. Again Puppies are playful and a squawking chicken excites them. Luckily we had a big broody hen at the time with a passel of chicks. If the pup got within 3 yards she lit into him with fury. That cured him.
The pup has turned into a particularly good poultry dog. We haven't locked up chickens at night for years unless we need them penned for some reason.
I've learned never to trust a dog with very young baby chicks. The peeps just bring out the predator in any size dog. If they are with the hen that hatched them I don't worry but incubated or purchased chicks are penned securely till they are larger.

 

[Jhawker]

My flock is safe from birds of prey August is particularly keen about watching the sky. He has taught my standard poodle to alert to Hawks. We have a safety patrol of Guineas that alert if August is a sleep in the shade on a hot day. He is up and in a full gallop with a booming bark instantly.

 

[michellewardley]

On the maggots, sheep powder for fly strike does an awesome for infestations even deep wounds, its a pesticide, anti bacterial and has antibiotic properties. You can use it on loads f different animals. Don't take any eggs for a coupla weeks after treatment (check with holding period on label). Terramyicin spray or ointment is good for healing.

Re Dogs its in the training. I'd suggest getting an older dog so you don't have to deal with the ratbag stage (terrible 2's)

We have 2 sheep dogs a short haired collie and a black and tan Kelpie, and My american staffy. I spent a lot of time just gardening and eyeballing him, but the other dogs just followed suit.

And yes I still do feed them raw chicken and lamb/sheep & our dogs are never tied up. They dont even steal the eggs and we have no problems with foxes or our cats.

That's my experience anyways.


All the best.
Shell