New neighbors dog killed 3 of our flock

Update ******

The neighbor offered to cover any cost but we declined as we chose not to replace the 2 dead chickens. I did go the next day and get my daughter a new pet Roan duck. It was nice for about a week until our OTHER neighbor's dog came over and took a chunk out of my Peking drake. Had I not walked out just as she did it - I am sure she would have killed him. The neighborhood we moved into (6 houses on a u shaped street) general mentality is "well, dogs roam and they kill birds what can you do"? Everyone has dogs and everyone lets them roam.

So after many tears from both my kids and myself we gave our beloved pet ducks away and have been keeping the chickens in their coop / run attached to the coop (no more free ranging). It is a far cry from what we planned for OUR property but since our neighbors have no plans to stop their dogs from coming on our property I decided it was best for now. I KNOW the laws are on my side but I just cannot engage in a war over this right now and I am not confident I can shoot all my neighbors dogs w/o traumatizing my children and damaging my relationships with all my neighbors. At the moment we are looking into underground invisible fencing for our dogs since they also on occasion step over property boundaries (although would never kill anything a Golden-doodle and a Chihuahua) . We do want to be responsible with our dogs and certainly cannot demand they keep their dogs on their own property if we are not doing the same.

Thanks for all the advice!
Personally, I'm not really sure why you did not take compensation for the dead chickens. It really isn't about whether you want to replace them but what you lost. But that's up to you.


I guess I'll never understand why it seems that the owner of the dead livestock, the one who did nothing wrong, always thinks they must tiptoe around neighbors' feelings when the neighbor's dog slaughters their birds. It's apparent the neighbor cares zilch about your feelings, your childrens' traumatic experience losing their pets or the law.

Personally, though this is up to you how you want to live your life, I would have the worst taste in my mouth if I must keep mine shut and always live in fear of my flocks being killed while everyone else just does whatever they please, to heck with what's right and what's the law. But, me, I know that an irresponsible dog owner is the one who trashed the so-called relationship in the first place, not me for asking for them to obey the dog laws and compensate me for my loss. We never, ever let our dogs roam when they were alive, as I feel is the responsibility of every single dog owner to put up fencing that will hold their dogs. If our dogs had run the neighborhood and they were shot for harassing/killing livestock, that would be OUR fault and well-deserved.

As far as invisible fencing, I would not depend on that entirely. It may keep your dog in but it sure won't keep others out. Our next door neighbor did that after getting a warning from us about his roaming dog getting coming onto our property and getting close to our flock. The dog zoomed right through it. Of course, he didn't want to go back through and get shocked again. And you also have to have charged batteries in that collar. If not, it's a useless system.
 
Agrees with speckledhen about compensation and roaming dogs......
.....and some of the rest, especially the invisible fence.

But also understand the delicate balance of neighborhood relations,
and the weight of killing someone's pet, even if if it IS a predator after leaving the owners property.

We also need to keep our birds safe and on our property,
even if it means confining them when we'd rather not.

It's balancing act.
 
Suz:

How big of an area do you have to fence? Or in other words, how big of an area would you like to allow your birds to roam around in?

Keeping your dogs in and neighbors dogs out is the easy part. Keeping the chickens in is a bit more of a problem, depending on how big an area you want to allow them the run of.

Rather than invisible electric fence, you would be better served by the visible kind. Electric or other.
 
Agrees with speckledhen about compensation and roaming dogs......
.....and some of the rest, especially the invisible fence.

But also understand the delicate balance of neighborhood relations,
and the weight of killing someone's pet, even if if it IS a predator after leaving the owners property.

We also need to keep our birds safe and on our property,
even if it means confining them when we'd rather not.

It's balancing act.
Most of the stuff I said was, as I mentioned, the way I personally feel about neighbors. I don't care about socializing with neighbors. I've not ever had a consistently good experience with them, not anywhere I've ever lived. They all seem to go wacko on me for some reason so I stick to myself. Even with the neighbor with whom we've had words about the dog numerous times, even after being threatened by his son years ago to come kill every bird in our coops with a shotgun if we shot his ever-escaping/roaming dog, we are cordial. We would help him if he needed it and vice versa. But, the dog situation, we are adamant about. No, we do not want to shoot his dog, his best buddy, as he puts it, but some of my chickens are about the same age or older than that dog (Aussie/Blue Heeler mix) and we value them just as much. He knows it. He even put up a huge chain link area and still, the dog runs down the road with him plus I occasionally see it outside my driveway gate-he lives next door but down a huge hillside from me-he has more acreage than I do, but still, can't keep the dog 100% contained. Do I want to shoot that dog? No, but I will if I have to and he would never know about it.

Suz:

How big of an area do you have to fence? Or in other words, how big of an area would you like to allow your birds to roam around in?

Keeping your dogs in and neighbors dogs out is the easy part. Keeping the chickens in is a bit more of a problem, depending on how big an area you want to allow them the run of.

Rather than invisible electric fence, you would be better served by the visible kind. Electric or other.
Agreed. Adding that if one of my own chickens leaves the perimeter fence and is killed by that dog, that's not the neighbor's fault nor the dog's. No compensation deserved. We put up a perimeter fence that surrounds just over two of our acres, which includes the main house, the barn and other outbuildings. It took a few months, buying one 330 ft roll of livestock fencing at a time but we got it done on a lowly military pension. Anyone can do it that way. I've had only one or two rare escapes since the fence was completed, usually related to panic and flight. Otherwise, they all seem fine to stop at the fence and walk along it when they get there.

If you're interested, you can read about one of the neighbor confrontations here: https://www.backyardchickens.com/t/385404/trapped-a-neighbors-dog-on-my-deck-got-an-earful
 
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Suz:

I'm now curious.......if you have a fence, how did these dogs manage to harm your birds? Were they outside the protected area or ?????
 
Update ******

The neighbor offered to cover any cost but we declined as we chose not to replace the 2 dead chickens. I did go the next day and get my daughter a new pet Roan duck. It was nice for about a week until our OTHER neighbor's dog came over and took a chunk out of my Peking drake. Had I not walked out just as she did it - I am sure she would have killed him. The neighborhood we moved into (6 houses on a u shaped street) general mentality is "well, dogs roam and they kill birds what can you do"? Everyone has dogs and everyone lets them roam.

So after many tears from both my kids and myself we gave our beloved pet ducks away and have been keeping the chickens in their coop / run attached to the coop (no more free ranging). It is a far cry from what we planned for OUR property but since our neighbors have no plans to stop their dogs from coming on our property I decided it was best for now. I KNOW the laws are on my side but I just cannot engage in a war over this right now and I am not confident I can shoot all my neighbors dogs w/o traumatizing my children and damaging my relationships with all my neighbors. At the moment we are looking into underground invisible fencing for our dogs since they also on occasion step over property boundaries (although would never kill anything a Golden-doodle and a Chihuahua) . We do want to be responsible with our dogs and certainly cannot demand they keep their dogs on their own property if we are not doing the same.

Thanks for all the advice!
Wow, is it just me or did you not disclose that YOUR dogs also run free in the neighbor hood?

A Golden Doodle and a Chihuahua.... First off Poodles are meant for hunting and chihuahuas are known for having attitudes way bigger than what their mouths can back up. My vet said she has been bitten by more little dogs than any other and NEVER by a pit bull! And many will bite out of fear which is just as serious as aggression. So even though YOU may think your dogs are harmless, I completely disagree! And YOU are perpetuating the neighborhood attitude that it's ok for your dogs to roam. What the dogs do in your presence verses when there is just the 2 of them could be completely different. Dogs KNOW how to be sneaky!

I wonder what if the neighbors hunting dog mistakes your chihuahua for some kind of prey and commences to abolish it? Will you then be as understanding as you are now?

I used stock yard fencing just like @speckledhen over a period of time to accommodate finances. And you can start small and expand because the posts are easy to move. If your small dog could escape that 330' roll ($150) ( smaller holes at bottom than top), they make 100' roll of 2x2x48 inches for $100 (Home Depot). Incidentally, only my small chicks can get through the bottom holes on the larger one. Regular sized hens cannot. Also this fencing is considered weaved, not welded... as welded fencing can break a piece and become very sharp.

As far as the general mentality that you are perpetuating about... "dogs kill birds, what can you do?" CONTAIN YOUR DOGS!!!
somad.gif
It is YOUR responsibility. If you can't, then leash them when they go out.

Also the invisible fence is not ideal.... How will it keep the other dogs out? I have seen nice solar powered hot line for around $165. But I have also seen one that is movable and have spoke with people who personally said it works well. Maybe it's an option for you.

https://www.amazon.com/Premier-Poul...id=1472746310&sr=8-25&keywords=electric+fence

I understand not wanting to kill everything in sight or traumatize your daughter. I urge you to think this through, avoid the invisible fence, and take responsibility for your own dogs.

Also, even if I don't agree with your outcome... I DO respect that we ALL have to do what is right for US!

Best wishes for you, your family, your flock, animals, and neighbors!
 
I agree with EggSighted4Life that if your dogs are not contained, you have little to say about anyone else's in the n'hood.

And I also agree about small dogs! A friend of mine, who purchased quite a few birds from me over the years, had a neighbor issue with a pack of Jack Russel terriers. Yes, a pack! They dug under her fences constantly. The neighbor refused to contain the nasty little things (I loathe JRTs, sorry). They slaughtered bird after bird, her PENNED birds. Finally, one day when her father caught one half under the fence, he put a rifle to its head and pulled the trigger, killing it in the act. Of course, the dog owner was incensed! How could someone kill his precious little dog, right? Well, I feel the same way. I don't care if it's a tiny Peek-a-Poo; if it's getting to my birds, it can eat lead. Small dogs can even be worse than larger ones with their fast paced chasing and snapping. They can make birds literally bash their head into trees or other objects and die of fright. So, it matters not the size of the dog, any dog can harass and kill livestock. They can simply run them to death, even a rat terrier size.

You may think your dogs are harmless, but you have zero idea what happens when they meet up with other dogs and form a pack. The pack will do things that the individual dogs might never do. "Pack mentality" is no joke. You may think your dogs are friendly, but how do I? And why should I even care if I don't want it on my property? You see my point? Contain YOUR dogs and protect your chickens from the others. And please, don't refuse compensation next time. They'll never learn if they aren't hit in the wallet. JMHO.
 
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Wow, is it just me or did you not disclose that YOUR dogs also run free in the neighbor hood?

A Golden Doodle and a Chihuahua.... First off Poodles are meant for hunting and chihuahuas are known for having attitudes way bigger than what their mouths can back up. My vet said she has been bitten by more little dogs than any other and NEVER by a pit bull! And many will bite out of fear which is just as serious as aggression. So even though YOU may think your dogs are harmless, I completely disagree! And YOU are perpetuating the neighborhood attitude that it's ok for your dogs to roam. What the dogs do in your presence verses when there is just the 2 of them could be completely different. Dogs KNOW how to be sneaky!

I wonder what if the neighbors hunting dog mistakes your chihuahua for some kind of prey and commences to abolish it? Will you then be as understanding as you are now?

I used stock yard fencing just like @speckledhen over a period of time to accommodate finances. And you can start small and expand because the posts are easy to move. If your small dog could escape that 330' roll ($150) ( smaller holes at bottom than top), they make 100' roll of 2x2x48 inches for $100 (Home Depot). Incidentally, only my small chicks can get through the bottom holes on the larger one. Regular sized hens cannot. Also this fencing is considered weaved, not welded... as welded fencing can break a piece and become very sharp.

As far as the general mentality that you are perpetuating about... "dogs kill birds, what can you do?" CONTAIN YOUR DOGS!!!
somad.gif
It is YOUR responsibility. If you can't, then leash them when they go out.

Also the invisible fence is not ideal.... How will it keep the other dogs out? I have seen nice solar powered hot line for around $165. But I have also seen one that is movable and have spoke with people who personally said it works well. Maybe it's an option for you.

https://www.amazon.com/Premier-Poul...id=1472746310&sr=8-25&keywords=electric+fence

I understand not wanting to kill everything in sight or traumatize your daughter. I urge you to think this through, avoid the invisible fence, and take responsibility for your own dogs.

Also, even if I don't agree with your outcome... I DO respect that we ALL have to do what is right for US!

Best wishes for you, your family, your flock, animals, and neighbors!

WOW. Your post is something else. I am in the middle of researching the electric underground fence and am quite confident I will make an informed and educated choice. I am not sure exactly what you mean that I am the one perpetuating the idea that dogs roam and kill bids. You have made A LOT of assumptions here. For instance that I do not supervise my dogs and that they roam unsupervised. Incorrect. I am not attempting to keep the other dogs out with the underground fence I am focusing on controlling my own dogs with this. So for instance I would like to prevent when a neighbors dog comes on my property or is walking down the road any of my dogs from following them a few steps off our property - even though when I call them back they come right back AND I yes would like the option of letting them out unsupervised. Gotta go because the third company I have providing fencing estimates out of many us here.
 
As info my dogs DO NOT roam free and unsupervised. However, as mentioned by others as being possible they have fooled me a few times and been standing in the road when I look up. We live on a dirt road where each lot has 10+ acres with only a few lots. As I stated I am addressing the fact that my dogs have stepped over boundaries I am taking steps to prevent that. Meanwhile I continue to supervise them when they are out or gate them on my deck. I certainly do not leave the house with them roaming as is a norm for others here. Also, as info I am the only person in my neighborhood with birds or livestock of any kind. No one else has any outdoor animals other then large dogs many of which live outside full time or have continuous access to get outside through a dog door. No one in the neighborhood has fencing and many of the dogs roam unsupervised constantly (like when their owners are at work or at night). The few times my dogs have stepped over boundaries have been a few feet over and we call them back. Many of the dogs here roam from yard to yard and over several acres. Our neighbors dog comes on our deck at night. Our other neighbors dog walked into my house one day when my kids left a door open and also got in our coop and killed chickens.

I totally don't understand some of the comments here when my post was in part about me feeling that dogs should not roam free and that I must keep my dogs contained. My Chihuahua and Goldendoodle have never gone after our ducks or chickens - they are actually afraid of them. They are indoor dogs who sleep inside at night and are in the house when we are not home.

One final thought I understand it can be a challenge to fully 100% at all times contain pets. What I wish is that my all my dog owning neighbors made some effort to do so / it was something they felt was necessary or even required of them as pet owners. That does not seem to be the case here.
 
WOW. Your post is something else. I am in the middle of researching the electric underground fence and am quite confident I will make an informed and educated choice. I am not sure exactly what you mean that I am the one perpetuating the idea that dogs roam and kill bids. You have made A LOT of assumptions here. For instance that I do not supervise my dogs and that they roam unsupervised. Incorrect. I am not attempting to keep the other dogs out with the underground fence I am focusing on controlling my own dogs with this. So for instance I would like to prevent when a neighbors dog comes on my property or is walking down the road any of my dogs from following them a few steps off our property - even though when I call them back they come right back AND I yes would like the option of letting them out unsupervised. Gotta go because the third company I have providing fencing estimates out of many us here.
Sorry, thought I was being friendly, respectful, and making suggestions to try and help protect your family and animals in case the new neighbors hunting dog thought your pup looked like a fast moving rabbit or something else enticing to chase and then shake like a rag doll.....

I was actually talking about your neighbors dog being unsupervised. But that even though you thought your dogs wouldn't hurt anything, it is possible.

I understand you were already looking at options to contain your dogs before my post. I was trying to express that IMHO it might be better protection for your property if you were able to keep the other dogs out as opposed to keeping yours in, but would actually do both at the same time.

That's awesome that your dogs have good recall! Of course it is a relief to be able to let your dogs in your yard unsupervised without fear of them being ran over, attacked, stolen or anything else that could happen. Of course fences aren't perfect but the do help.

Maybe I didn't include enough happy faces to indicate I was sincere. I am sure your family has been through a lot!
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I truly hope for the best for you and mean no harm to anyone on the forum.
hugs.gif
 

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