Newtown, Conn School Shooting

[Poultry Couture]

There's a thread for the guns involved in this thread... Take it there please

 

[Mtn Laurel]

Chickened, I agree. Almost all of the recent situations have been with a shooter in places where "legal" gun carriers are not allowed. If the staff was allowed - or required - to have a weapon, and trained to use it, would we still be hearing how "unarmed administrators" courageously ran into the gunfire, but 20 children still died? Maybe, maybe not. Maybe, if they were allowed to have guns and knew how to use them - there would not have been such a massacre.

It seems that these mentally ill persons are preying on the smallest, weakest, and least protected members of society by targeting schools. It's not accidental. Schools are well known as "No Gun" zones and they know they can maximize the amount of carnage before they will be stopped.

I hate to think that we've come to the point where either an armed guard or a trained staff member is needed to provide protection but I think you have a valid point. Had one of those administrators had a CW and was adequately trained to use it, it's quite possible the shooter wouldn't have gotten down the hall to those classrooms.

I firmly believe that whatever changes we've made to our mental health care system in the past 50 or so years is responsible for these incidents. We seem unable to diagnose those who are dangerous to others and - when they are diagnosed - we have no way to make sure they stay on their medications. There was a time when those who were dangerous to others were institutionalized but that is no longer considered proper treatment. Possibly that's something we need to reconsider.

 

[chickened]

Right now we have public schools with a police presence, usually mid and highschools and usually to combat drugs and alcohol. What would the cost be to have a policeman or a private service to provide a presence if only for a deterrant or train them to recognize and identify people. I mean we can train people to do some amazing things. I am not a kneejerk ******* but this may be the time to start looking at some serious reality based solutions to protect our children when they are not in our care and are in a place that was once considered safe... our schools are not safe.

Banning alcohol was a failure, banning guns would be a failure also, everytime during the Clinton years they banned a gun clip or type of gun sales went up which put more guns in the hands of the public. If this had been a bombing or knife attack would we be even calling for a bomb or knife ban? just curious.

I have avoided the news today after reading a statement on FB by Morgan Freeman, if I find it I will try to post it.

 

[dainerra]

Morgan Freeman's brilliant take on what happened yesterday :

"You want to know why. This may sound cynical, but here's why.


It's because of the way the media reports it. Flip on the news and watch how we treat the Batman theater shoote
r and the Oregon mall shooter like celebrities. Dylan Klebold and Eric Harris are household names, but do you know the name of a single *victim* of Columbine? Disturbed people who would otherwise just off themselves in their basements see the news and want to top it by doing something worse, and going out in a memorable way. Why a grade school? Why children? Because he'll be remembered as a horrible monster, instead of a sad nobody.

CNN's article says that if the body count "holds up", this will rank as the second deadliest shooting behind Virginia Tech, as if statistics somehow make one shooting worse than another. Then they post a video interview of third-graders for all the details of what they saw and heard while the shootings were happening. Fox News has plastered the killer's face on all their reports for hours. Any articles or news stories yet that focus on the victims and ignore the killer's identity? None that I've seen yet. Because they don't sell. So congratulations, sensationalist media, you've just lit the fire for someone to top this and knock off a day care center or a maternity ward next.

You can help by forgetting you ever read this man's name, and remembering the name of at least one victim. You can help by donating to mental health research instead of pointing to gun control as the problem. You can help by turning off the news."

 

[rebelcowboysnb]

The media has a lot to do with these things. Not that it is there fault but fame has its appeal even for someone that wants to kill there self... If the fame was not there would some of the mass shooters have just killed there self in a room somewhere?

 

[Mtn Laurel]

I have avoided the news today after reading a statement on FB by Morgan Freeman, if I find it I will try to post it.

I read Morgan Freeman's statement and it was excellent.

Usually middle and high schools will have guards but in some areas they are unarmed. I'm thinking we need an armed presence in all schools as you are right, our children are no longer safe.

I don't think those advocating a gun ban have really thought it through. Without even considering the constitutional aspects, the mechanics of implementing a full ban is just impossible. We have no clue who has guns or how many. Oh, yes, those registered are known but I'd almost bet that fully half the guns in this country can't be traced. There are guns purchased before registration was required, guns handed down in families, guns acquired in war, guns that were stolen and illegally sold, etc., and there's no way to track them. You could end all gun sales today and it wouldn't put a dent in gun ownership. It's simply not realistic.

Oh, and about knife legislation . . . they have implemented knife laws in England. Can't purchase cutlery until you're 18 along with a long list of assorted knife rules. Wish I was joking but I'm not.

https://www.gov.uk/find-out-if-i-can-buy-or-carry-a-knife

 

[rebelcowboysnb]

There are guns purchased before registration was required

Most states have never had a registration system.

 

[dainerra]

another thing is that, even with all of the current rules, private gun sales aren't tracked anyway. So even those guns that were registered when purchased could have changed hands dozens of times since.

 

[newfoundland]

This debate is unbelievable! Some people will blame anything and everything rather than even consider firearms restrictions. I don't think anyone suggested that all guns be banned, simply restricted. What possible reason could that mother have for owning two hand guns and a semi-automatic weapon? If she were a gun enthusiast and used them for target practice why would they be kept in accessible place? Why should anyone own a semi-automatic weapon anyway? These are nothing but assault weapons. Surely nobody hunts with a semi-automatic, are they really that poor shots? A shotgun is all that is needed to bring down a deer. Where's the sportsmanship in using a semi-automatic? This is not just to do with untreated mental illness, or even more spuriously, the desire for publicity because of the way the media report these tragedies, it is to do with unlimited gun ownership. Despite Q9 claims that UK has worse gun crime, laughable were the circumstances not so tragic, the figures are as follows:
July 2012
England and Wales
Gun ownership 6.2% Shooting fatalities 47

USA
Gun ownership 88.8% Shooting fatalities 9,146

 

[duckinnut]

This debate is unbelievable! Some people will blame anything and everything rather than even consider firearms restrictions. I don't think anyone suggested that all guns be banned, simply restricted. What possible reason could that mother have for owning two hand guns and a semi-automatic weapon? If she were a gun enthusiast and used them for target practice why would they be kept in accessible place? Why should anyone own a semi-automatic weapon anyway? These are nothing but assault weapons. Surely nobody hunts with a semi-automatic, are they really that poor shots? A shotgun is all that is needed to bring down a deer. Where's the sportsmanship in using a semi-automatic? This is not just to do with untreated mental illness, or even more spuriously, the desire for publicity because of the way the media report these tragedies, it is to do with unlimited gun ownership. Despite Q9 claims that UK has worse gun crime, laughable were the circumstances not so tragic, the figures are as follows:
July 2012
England and Wales
Gun ownership 6.2% Shooting fatalities 47

USA
Gun ownership 88.8% Shooting fatalities 9,146

I guess I am quoting you looking for a link to those statistics. Bear in mind not all gun crime is fatal.