Personally I would feel better if the USDA would use the money spent on NAIS to hire more line inspectors, re-open testing labs that have been shut down and come up with some BSE and AI field tests that show results better than the ones now do. At last I knew they were still shipping BSE samples to the UK for verification.
NoNAIS.org
- Thread starter spook
- Start date
I don't know if you guys have seen the footage of the slaughter house in the Qu'apelle Valley in Sask, Canada... I think we need to invest our cash in hiring more inspectors, and monitering slaughter houses better. Look up the story, and you'll see what I mean.
As far as having governmental ability to track individual animals from birth to processing- well, my girls are never going to be "processed". They are never going to enter the food chain. They are pets that lay eggs which we eat and give the occasional dozen to co-workers who are OK with unprocessed unsterilized (or whatever they do to eggs to make them safe for sale) eggs.
IF- heaven forbid -there is an outbreak of avian flu in our area I would hope it would be on the news and we would be able to shut our hens in their house as quarranteen until they either got sick or "proved" they didn't have the flu. NAIS would not give us the option- they would be culled.
From Raeinbeau:
IF- heaven forbid -there is an outbreak of avian flu in our area I would hope it would be on the news and we would be able to shut our hens in their house as quarranteen until they either got sick or "proved" they didn't have the flu. NAIS would not give us the option- they would be culled.
From Raeinbeau:
MayberrySaint wrote:
It is almost impossible to contradict all the government-conspiracy theories generated by left-wing, eco-farmer groups concerning NAIS....
Edited to add: I am far from a left-wing liberal, as a matter of fact, I'm probably one of the most conservative women anyone is ever going to come across. I take care of myself and my own and don't look to anyone for help. I do care passionately about the food supply in this country, however, and have watched the steady decline in quality since the early 70's - right about the time big ag really started to control it. Sorry, but it's not just conspiracy theorists who are against NAIS, it's any thinking American who values their freedom and their food.
I suppose I am a left wing, eco-farmer. And I agree with my conservative fellow livestock raisers 100%. When the left AND the right agree on something- it stinks.
It is almost impossible to contradict all the government-conspiracy theories generated by left-wing, eco-farmer groups concerning NAIS....
Edited to add: I am far from a left-wing liberal, as a matter of fact, I'm probably one of the most conservative women anyone is ever going to come across. I take care of myself and my own and don't look to anyone for help. I do care passionately about the food supply in this country, however, and have watched the steady decline in quality since the early 70's - right about the time big ag really started to control it. Sorry, but it's not just conspiracy theorists who are against NAIS, it's any thinking American who values their freedom and their food.
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Not trying to be argumentative, Cyn. I really want factual non emotional answers from people who have read and understand both sides.
Cyn. did explain it to the tee. There are no pros to this program for the little man. NONE! I have read the agreement, spoke with the USDA office in Richmond, VA about it, and have come to the conclusion that there are absolutely no benefits for the little man. NONE! PERIOD! This is just one more way for the government to step in and take over where they should not. Don't want to take Cyn's or my word for it? Pick up the phone and call your states USDA office. You don't want to give them your info. but just ask what the benefits are in signing that NAIS form. They will not be able to tell you of one single benefit to you. They just referred me right back to the NAIS form. So you tell me what you think the benefits are. Someone employed by the government sure couldn't.
Not trying to be argumentative, Cyn. I really want factual non emotional answers from people who have read and understand both sides.
Cyn. did explain it to the tee. There are no pros to this program for the little man. NONE! I have read the agreement, spoke with the USDA office in Richmond, VA about it, and have come to the conclusion that there are absolutely no benefits for the little man. NONE! PERIOD! This is just one more way for the government to step in and take over where they should not. Don't want to take Cyn's or my word for it? Pick up the phone and call your states USDA office. You don't want to give them your info. but just ask what the benefits are in signing that NAIS form. They will not be able to tell you of one single benefit to you. They just referred me right back to the NAIS form. So you tell me what you think the benefits are. Someone employed by the government sure couldn't.
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- Jan 25, 2008
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Even in a 1-2 mile radius "kill-zone" we could loose years of our lives spent to build a quality flock. A friend of mine spent 35 years breeding her Marans to be "ideal" to her. Should she loose those 35 years of work because some commercial producer near her had X disease? I don't think so. Especially if her birds are not infected.
The whole idea of NAIS being there so you "know where your food came from," I find a little silly. Most of us know where those commercial meats come from, and we already know we don't like it. It is the reason some of us raise our own meat. There are "suppose" to be rules and regulations already so you "know" where your food came from and that it is at least edible. These rules and regulations fail the system already, what does a bigger program and more rules, money, and regulations, now applied to small poultry keepers, going to help? NAIS is giving exceptions to those places "we get our food from".
If NAIS is there to prevent disease and benefit everyone(!) then the rules should be just as strict to the commercial keepers as they would be for the hobby keepers. The commercial keepers should have to mark every bird and tell exactly what happened to that bird. Did that Broiler die of a disease or did it die of a heart attack? You can bet they aren't going to test all the downed Broilers in the commercial industry. Then we get to talk about the battery industry. *sigh* We have all seen and heard and know of how the birds fair in such conditions. With NAIS the battery farms should have to mark and track every single battery hen. Did that hen die from getting stuck in the wire, did it get killed by the other hens, is it SICK, was it an infection, a tumor, cancer. The commercial producers will not have to adhere to these rules.
It just seems that NAIS is targeting the "little guys".
I would hate to think that after putting so much work into my Java, that my flock would be confiscated and destroyed because the big buys didn't practice good animal husbandry. I mean there are so few Java left, only one or two big flocks/breeders, a couple of ironically placed "kill-zones" and they're gone. The Java would be exstinct, and those people who worked hard to preserve them, their efforts would have been a lesson in futility and Murphy's law.
I just think that with NAIS, everyone should have to play by the same rules.
-Kim
The whole idea of NAIS being there so you "know where your food came from," I find a little silly. Most of us know where those commercial meats come from, and we already know we don't like it. It is the reason some of us raise our own meat. There are "suppose" to be rules and regulations already so you "know" where your food came from and that it is at least edible. These rules and regulations fail the system already, what does a bigger program and more rules, money, and regulations, now applied to small poultry keepers, going to help? NAIS is giving exceptions to those places "we get our food from".
If NAIS is there to prevent disease and benefit everyone(!) then the rules should be just as strict to the commercial keepers as they would be for the hobby keepers. The commercial keepers should have to mark every bird and tell exactly what happened to that bird. Did that Broiler die of a disease or did it die of a heart attack? You can bet they aren't going to test all the downed Broilers in the commercial industry. Then we get to talk about the battery industry. *sigh* We have all seen and heard and know of how the birds fair in such conditions. With NAIS the battery farms should have to mark and track every single battery hen. Did that hen die from getting stuck in the wire, did it get killed by the other hens, is it SICK, was it an infection, a tumor, cancer. The commercial producers will not have to adhere to these rules.
It just seems that NAIS is targeting the "little guys".
I would hate to think that after putting so much work into my Java, that my flock would be confiscated and destroyed because the big buys didn't practice good animal husbandry. I mean there are so few Java left, only one or two big flocks/breeders, a couple of ironically placed "kill-zones" and they're gone. The Java would be exstinct, and those people who worked hard to preserve them, their efforts would have been a lesson in futility and Murphy's law.
I just think that with NAIS, everyone should have to play by the same rules.
-Kim
Quote:
You're welcome. That's been in my signature line since I started here.
You're welcome. That's been in my signature line since I started here.
I'm against NAIS. After the Henshaw Incident I have zero confidence in the USDA's words that the NAIS is to help us all. Looking at the official NAIS website the amount of reporting that will have to be done by even us the backyard flock growers is ridiculous! Having to tag and report every bird born on my property plus deaths not to mention all the other animals I raise it seems the NAIS would discourage people to not farm. And as before mentioned big producers only have to ID their animals in groups rather than individuals as small producers will have to. -If- it was more unified with everyone under the same rules and regulations I would be more willing to consider it but as things stand NAIS so far as just another hierarchy tier program.
I would like to know where the hatcheries stand on the issue. McM, Ideal, Stromberg and so on could be put out of business if people are discouraged by the NAIS registration and fees, penalties and what else they can add in.
As it is structured now the NAIS is too invasive of our property rights and can do more harm than good. Seriously...is this the legacy we want to leave future generations? DO we want to see traditional farming go the way of the dodo? Do we want all we eat to be provided by the big ag corps?
Forget heritage breeds too if we go into mandatory NAIS. Heritage birds take too much time to develop in business sense so we will see more Cornish rock x's, broad breasted turkeys and other 'super hybrids' in farms. Even the small producers who remain in the whole game will want to rush birds to market with the fees associated with the NAIS will have to save money elsewhere or pass the expense onto the consumer as well.
This is how I see the whole thing and why I'm against the mandatory implementation of this system.
And as quoted before by others Benjamin Franklin was a genius and his quote holds to this day! This is the varient I've heard:
"Any society that would give up a little liberty to gain a little security will deserve neither and lose both."
I would like to know where the hatcheries stand on the issue. McM, Ideal, Stromberg and so on could be put out of business if people are discouraged by the NAIS registration and fees, penalties and what else they can add in.
As it is structured now the NAIS is too invasive of our property rights and can do more harm than good. Seriously...is this the legacy we want to leave future generations? DO we want to see traditional farming go the way of the dodo? Do we want all we eat to be provided by the big ag corps?
Forget heritage breeds too if we go into mandatory NAIS. Heritage birds take too much time to develop in business sense so we will see more Cornish rock x's, broad breasted turkeys and other 'super hybrids' in farms. Even the small producers who remain in the whole game will want to rush birds to market with the fees associated with the NAIS will have to save money elsewhere or pass the expense onto the consumer as well.
This is how I see the whole thing and why I'm against the mandatory implementation of this system.
And as quoted before by others Benjamin Franklin was a genius and his quote holds to this day! This is the varient I've heard:
"Any society that would give up a little liberty to gain a little security will deserve neither and lose both."
Take the time to write your representatives in congress and voice your opinons.
Ok, I have skimmed through this thread and I already knew I was against NAIS too, but in Wisconsin we still have to register our premises if we have any livestock besides rabbits, cats or dogs....as far as I understand it, Animal ID is still voluntary here, with pushes to encourage you to do itm but you don't have to if you register your premises.
... ugh...If anyone has any info on premises registration, I am all ears. I hate reading about the stuff on "official" pages, but have been doing the best I can. Also, we rent, but the egg business will be ours...does my landlord have to register? or do we?
I really hope that this will not be the cause of my dreams crumbling down around my ears.
... ugh...If anyone has any info on premises registration, I am all ears. I hate reading about the stuff on "official" pages, but have been doing the best I can. Also, we rent, but the egg business will be ours...does my landlord have to register? or do we?
I really hope that this will not be the cause of my dreams crumbling down around my ears.
I think NAIS is the most ridiculous thing this government has ever come up with. I can't believe that supposed intelligent and professional people can come up with something so stupid. I do not see one way this program will benefit anyone except the commercial poultry producer and maybe not even him/her.
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