Not an Emergency...Marek's in the Flock

[aurinia]

Sorry to say, I think I belong here now.

I posted a thread in the Emergencies/Diseases forum and haven't had any responses (and not many views, really). I hope its alright if I copy the post here in hopes of getting some advice...

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[seminolewind]

Fluffed up and lethargic sounds more like coccidiosis. Or enteritis. I would immediately put them on corid or sulfaDImethoxine asap. With Marek's, most of the time they look and act fine while they waste and get paralysis.

A few months ago, I found one of my hens (vaccinated) in paralysis, sprawled in the dirt, and wasted. I have nothing to lose by putting her on something for cocci and an antibiotic. Turns out I think she was really dehydrated to the point she couldn't walk. Since her 7 days of treatment and tube feedings to make sure she gets fluids and the meds, she was running around in no time. You have nothing to lose by treating and giving B vitamins.

If a chicken dies put it in a double plastic bag in the fridge and follow the instructions for sending the body to a lab for a necropsy. It's the only way to know for sure.

If it's Marek's, your chicken life is not over. You will just have to do some things differently. Get vaccinated day old chicks from a hatchery. Then they have to be quarantined for a few weeks to let the vaccine build their resistance. The eggs are fine to eat, hatch or sell. But if you sell chicks you've hatched they are exposed. So get that necropsy to know for sure.

 

[aurinia]

Thank you. Is it possible for them to have cocci even if their poop is completely normal? She is still eating, drinking and pooping normally and at this point isn't losing weight (which isn't how the others were, unfortunately) but just looks like she feels unwell. Dosing them all with Corid won't hurt, so I'll start them on that today. I had wondered about enteritis as well, after reading about it on here and they just finished a week's course of sulfadimethoxine. I have been putting NutriDrench in their water and the ones that show symptoms also get a few drops of polyvisol for the B2 that the NutriDrench doesn't have in it. They have plenty of fresh food and water and treats are generally organic scratch, watermelon, fresh greens and occasionally meal worms. Is there anything else that I can try? What exactly would cause enteritis, and would that cause the paralysis, too?

 

[Eggcessive]

Thank you. Is it possible for them to have cocci even if their poop is completely normal? She is still eating, drinking and pooping normally and at this point isn't losing weight (which isn't how the others were, unfortunately) but just looks like she feels unwell. Dosing them all with Corid won't hurt, so I'll start them on that today. I had wondered about enteritis as well, after reading about it on here and they just finished a week's course of sulfadimethoxine. I have been putting NutriDrench in their water and the ones that show symptoms also get a few drops of polyvisol for the B2 that the NutriDrench doesn't have in it. They have plenty of fresh food and water and treats are generally organic scratch, watermelon, fresh greens and occasionally meal worms. Is there anything else that I can try? What exactly would cause enteritis, and would that cause the paralysis, too?

Sulfadimethoxine will treat for the worst 2 strains of coccidia, so the the Corid probably isn't necessary, but others may disagree. Make sure they are getting some probiotics or a little buttermilk or plain yogurt. With Mareks and other diseases such as avian leukosis that can cause lowered immunity to common illnesses, cocci is fairly common.

Edited for spelling.

 

[ochochicas]

Thank you. Is it possible for them to have cocci even if their poop is completely normal? She is still eating, drinking and pooping normally and at this point isn't losing weight (which isn't how the others were, unfortunately) but just looks like she feels unwell. Dosing them all with Corid won't hurt, so I'll start them on that today. I had wondered about enteritis as well, after reading about it on here and they just finished a week's course of sulfadimethoxine. I have been putting NutriDrench in their water and the ones that show symptoms also get a few drops of polyvisol for the B2 that the NutriDrench doesn't have in it. They have plenty of fresh food and water and treats are generally organic scratch, watermelon, fresh greens and occasionally meal worms. Is there anything else that I can try? What exactly would cause enteritis, and would that cause the paralysis, too?

The virus attacks the sciatic nerve that controls the legs. The signals are unable to travel down the leg and the birds can't move them. That is what the state vet told me.

It is possible that your birds were exposed to Marek's at the store when they were babies. It could also have been introduced to your property by wild birds. Other species can be carriers but the virus does not actually make them sick or kill them. It can come from anywhere. It could have been brought in on your shoes after a trip to the feed store if you crossed paths with someone that had it on their clothing. If it is going to happen, it is going to happen. It is really hard to avoid coming into contact with it. I read someplace that all birds by one year old have probably been exposed to Marek's. The key to survival is them having enough immunity to survive it when they are exposed to a dose big enough to make them sick.

Like Seminole said, this isn't the end of your chicken days, you just have to change things up a bit and will have to have vaccinated chicks in the future. And you really should send one of your birds to the lab for diagnosis.

 

[aurinia]

Is it fairly common for a bird to recover from paralysis? My PR could not use her legs at all but is now walking, jumping, running, etc and appears to be fine other than the tumor that is now growing on her face (I can try and get a pic of that this afternoon). Most of the stories I've read on here, the paralysis seems to be more long-lasting than hers. So perhaps hers was something else, although the tumor makes me think otherwise.

 

[ochochicas]

On a happier note, these two little cuties are six months old now. They just turned 26 weeks old and have been with the flock for four months. They are the first of my vaccinated chicks that hatched in my incubator. They were vaccinated at 18 days and again at 6 weeks. In order to keep them isolated from the virus they lived in the house for the first 9 weeks. Thank goodness there were only two or the house would have been rather smelly. They are both laying little pullet eggs (45 grams) and showing no signs of illness. I'm hopefully for the future of the flock.

 

[seminolewind]

Thank you. Is it possible for them to have cocci even if their poop is completely normal? She is still eating, drinking and pooping normally and at this point isn't losing weight (which isn't how the others were, unfortunately) but just looks like she feels unwell. Dosing them all with Corid won't hurt, so I'll start them on that today. I had wondered about enteritis as well, after reading about it on here and they just finished a week's course of sulfadimethoxine. I have been putting NutriDrench in their water and the ones that show symptoms also get a few drops of polyvisol for the B2 that the NutriDrench doesn't have in it. They have plenty of fresh food and water and treats are generally organic scratch, watermelon, fresh greens and occasionally meal worms. Is there anything else that I can try? What exactly would cause enteritis, and would that cause the paralysis, too?

Enteritis is like cocci in that the cocci or something else is killing the small intestine. A lot of times it's cocci that does the damage and other bacteria that move in. That's why I use an antibiotic as well for clostridium and e. coli. I am not a vet. Just someone who knows that these microbes and Marek's break the rules all the time. And Marek's causes immunosuppression, which allows illnesses in quite easily.

I'm trying to guess at what's going on with chickens by what I've experienced. Coccidiosis has several different strains and most do not cause bloody stool. If she did a week of sulfadimethoxine, I would say try something else like Tylan, Amoxicillin, Baytril, LS 50. Those are the ones I know off the top of myhead.

My chickens with Marek's that died never looked sick until the very end. With paralysis or not, they did not act sick and fluffed up.

Those pictures a few posts above are of an 18 month old hen who acted perfectly normal except for wasting. She was a vaccinated chick with 10 others. The first one that died had Marek's confirmed by a lab. Now this one. She had gotten meds for 7 days and looked fine. But her insides were covered profusely with these little white tumors and her liver was like meal. I can't say it was Marek's, but it seems like it was. I just can't find pictures of Marek's tumors that look like that.

Which is why I think "where is Casportpony?????" She always has lots of pictures.

 

[seminolewind]

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[seminolewind]

Quote: I agree with you.