One has passed and the other is mysteriously ill-- can I have advice?

Discussion in 'Emergencies / Diseases / Injuries and Cures' started by Kazzandra, Sep 19, 2019.

  1. Kazzandra

    Kazzandra Songster

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    All was well until last Thursday night with my flock, and had been for six long years, disease-wise, which is the last time I had personally had an illness, which was severe sour crop that caused a 6 year old ameraucana to pass.

    I noticed Vertie, a 3 year old ameraucana, was down on the floor, but I'd seen her trying to lay and sit on eggs in the yard, and she was still laying an egg every day. I thought it was related to her trying to be broody. But the next morning she had visible liquids on the ground around her (wetness-- not sure from what). I let her out-- she went back to her nest, and stayed on it through a thunderstorm. The most marked symptom of anything being off was she seemed out of breath (but not gasping), but it was also 82-85 degrees and humid. However, I knew she wasn't doing great when I picked her up and put her down and she sat down where I placed her. She seemed dazed.

    That night I decided to check her for sour crop, and squeezed on her crop, and she started puking. She puked up her contents without issues, and it didn't smell sour, and I gave her some oil and apple cider vinegar in a syringe. She had no upper respirtory signs or issues. Her eyes seemed a little constricted, however. None of this went down her trachea, but when I left her for the night I had a feeling she wouldn't be alive in the morning. She had collapsed with her head in front of her, breathing slowly and deeply. She was dead that coming morning. As I mentioned, the only noticeable synptom was her going broody, as she has never done that before and as an ameaucana, it is irregular.

    I've been keeping everyone up this week due to hawk season and this issue, as I wasn't sure what happened. We also had a cat go missing a few days before that and I've been worried. But tonight I found one of my nonvaccinated chickens (a roo) from this May that hatched here (half houdan, half silkie) belly up on the run floor, gasping for air, with his neck twisting. His comb was a bit cold when I found him. No injuries or broken skin apparent. I brought him in, and with time he straightened out, and is able to stand on his own, but his neck remains underneath him. Temp, pulse, and respiration seem normal. I have video from the hours before, but the IR video, as it was past dusk when I found him, isn't too useful. I can confirm he seemed completely normal not even an hour before. It's possible he could have jammed himself on the kennel fencing or got tangled in the hawk netting, but that would have been off camera.

    I let him sit in my room for a while, looking like this.

    [​IMG]

    He won't open his eyes for me unless I pull them open. There are no liquids from his nare, his eye, or any signs of conjuctivitis. No respitory distress. His droppings are/were normal. He has been wormed. Nothing in his throat I can see. I'm not sure how to go about treating this. I have Tylan but I don't feel comfortable hitting him with that if this is an unrelated injury.

    What would you do?
     
    Last edited: Sep 19, 2019
  2. Sequel

    Sequel Free Ranging

    :hugs First I will send a hug because that is so distressing! Then I will call in some cavalry! @azygous @Wyorp Rock @Eggcessive . I hope you have a good outcome!
     
  3. Kazzandra

    Kazzandra Songster

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    May 14, 2009
    NC Appalachian Mountains
    As I isolated him last night outside, because I was afraid I had something catching and don't want to put my parrot at risk, I went out just now, as soon as it was light, to check on him.

    His condition hasn't changed. He's still holding his neck low. He passed some urates in the night-- no doubt becaue he hadn't ate in the evening much when this happened. I can't seem to get him to eat or drink yet, and don't want to start syringeing until I have to. I feel it's likely he injured himself, but my one run cam doesn't show part of the run or in the coops. There was a very loud concert near us last night and I do have some videos of them startling. I'm wondering if this happened on the down time between the motion detection.
    Here he is fine not an hour before:
    [​IMG]
    upload_2019-9-20_7-44-32.png
    This is the run 5 minutes before I found him. He was in front of the black dish there near the door, belly up. I can't help but feel
    [​IMG]
    this is something, but then again it's awfully dark and I can't tell. It's probable this is an unrelated injury. The first chicken sounded like a hemorhage of an organ or something, as another emergency thread matched her symptoms almost entirely. It's just a shame necropsies require so many resources to acquire. I've been scared it's something catching, but he hasn't had the same issues as the other chicken. Fingers crossed he's injured his neck by choking himself in fright. I plan to give him vitamin e/selenium, despite him being usually on 18 percent feed. Any other supportive care I can give?
     
    Last edited: Sep 20, 2019
  4. azygous

    azygous Crossing the Road

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    A mystery. It does sound like an accident injury. Sometimes, all we can do is take wild guesses. You're already doing what I would recommend - the vitamin E therapy. I hope he recovers.
     
  5. Eggcessive

    Eggcessive Enabler

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    Sorry about your other chicken. A full and squishy crop should not be squeezed or massaged, since that can cause them to vomit and choke. A crop may be full and squishy when the crop is slow, and I have seen some broodies with squishy crops.

    It sounds like wry neck or torticolis, which is a neurological symptom. It can be a result of a head injury, a vitamin E or B1 thiamine deficiency, or from a disease, such as Mareks or several others that affect the brain. Give 400 IU of vitamin E , some thiamine in a poultry vitamin, and a little chopped egg for a small amount of the mineral selenium is the usual treatment. A supplement such as Poultry NutriDrench has all of those, but not that much E. Offer small amounts of watery chicken feed, egg, tuna, or wet cat food are some ways to get fluids and food into him. Liquids are more important now to keep him hydrated. Time will tell what is wrong. If you should lose him, contact your state vet feom this list to get a necropsy:
    https://www.metzerfarms.com/PoultryLabs.cfm
     
  6. Kazzandra

    Kazzandra Songster

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    May 14, 2009
    NC Appalachian Mountains
    Thank you very much, Eggcessive.
    I feel as he's half silkie it's probably wry neck, but I do wonder if I have Marak's in the flock. The first girl was vaccinated, but I understand it can cause tumours that can burst or disable with time, and this boy is unvaccinated, as he was born this spring here, but is half silkie, approaching 4 months old.
    Then again it's just as likely he was scared by the concert, and that was enough stress. I'll keep him on the regimen and see if we can come out the other side of this, and update this thread. I find it odd because after the first girl passed, I put vitamins/electrolyes in their water for the 5 days leading up to this as a general aid-- so he was technically already on part of the treatment.
     
  7. Eggcessive

    Eggcessive Enabler

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    Most poultry vitamins do not contain enough of the vitamin E which is used to treat wry neck. Sunflower seeds and crushed almonds contain a lot of vitamin E. Of course, he needs a balanced chick feed as well.
     
  8. Kazzandra

    Kazzandra Songster

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    May 14, 2009
    NC Appalachian Mountains
    Wanted to update this thread for those who search wry neck and see my boy's story.

    I have good news-- he has since almost made a complete recovery in this past week and a half. I split him off into a separate cage and had him on 400mg vitamin E via syringe and some poultry vitamins (nutri-drench, but rather expired) to make sure he was drinking. I hand fed him scrambled eggs the first few days and had fed him because I found that he could not eat his crumbles well, but scratch he could, so I started putting E on that and letting him eat as much as he could. Looked for Selenium and couldn't find it anywhere locally, so had to order it.

    I tried a rather large dose of CBD oil while he was still obviously in pain and sleeping a lot the first days. It didn't seem to immediately help anything but I don't think it hurt him either.

    The real turn around was when I gave him almost 1500mg of turmeric/curcumin. That's when he started being able to hold his head up again. It was worse for a few days after that because he was starting to try to be a normal chicken again and was failing at balancing well therefore and stumbling a great deal, and the other chickens found that very offensive and would try to peck him if they had access. Some days I just put the whole mixture in his food if I didn't have time for syringe time once he started bein able to drink and eat on his own again, after 3 days or so. Other days I made sure he got it all.

    I kept him on the curcumin and E and vitamin water, mostly via syringe. By the time the selenium came this Friday, he was almost better. I've given him an 8th of a 200 microgram, for 25 micrograms a day since then, and that seemed to be the rest of what he needed. He was able to be out with everyone today, though I gave him his treatment and put him in his cage for the night for extra security.

    During this whole time, one particular symptom is that he has tried and tried to scratch at his right ear since he could-- I figure it's a symptom of the pressure alleviating in his head perhaps?

    So if you see a chicken come down with this suddenly, don't freak out like I did and assume everyone has Newcastle's and must be put down-- try to wait and see and support them through this tough time. I was prepared to go a month before I put him down but he's pretty much better after only 10 days.

    As far as the original hen goes, I'm convinced it was some sudden organ failure or perhaps we do have Marak's around and a tumour bust. But this unvaccinated male chicken survived and seems normal if that's the case, at least for now.
     
    Last edited: Sep 30, 2019
    doublecrossranch and Sequel like this.
  9. Sequel

    Sequel Free Ranging

    :yesss: I am so happy for you! Thanks so much for the update!
     
    doublecrossranch and Kazzandra like this.
  10. Eggcessive

    Eggcessive Enabler

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    Glad that he has recovered, and I am sure that you are very glad. If you look back in post 5, egg is a great source of selenium. Only a small amount of selenium is necessary for treatment of wry neck, and tuna and sunflower seed shave plenty of it, as well as containing vitamin E. Thank younfor the update.
     

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