Over researched and made myself anxious about coccidiosis

[NatJ]

People don't often come here to rejoice because everything is going swimmingly and their chickens are perfectly healthy. But for the majority of us, that's exactly the case!

Good point! Just for the sake of helping balance things:

I have raised hundreds of chicks, never used medicated feed, never seen a case of coccidiosis.

This was spread over at least 4 different locations in 3 different states across quite a number of years. Chicks have been in garage, other garage, basement, a wide variety of outdoor pens, with broody hens or without. Broody hens have had mail-order chicks, incubator chicks, chicks they hatched themselves. Brooder chicks have been mail order, or from a local feed store, or hatched in an incubator. Bedding has been newspaper, paper towel, wood shavings, wood chips, dry leaves, clods of dirt, hay or straw, probably other things, any combination depending on what was available at the time. Chicks have been a wide variety of breeds and mixes, raised in groups from 2 to 100+ and sometimes in mixed-age groups. I think the only consistent things have been heat source when there was no broody hen (always a heat lamp) and water (always plain tap water, never added anything to it.)

 

[Debbie292d]

Debbie, I usually agree with you but not in this case.

It's okay if we don't agree on something, as I know, we're almost always on the same page.

With this though, it's because I've lived it. If we do not move the pens, and they are on medicated, they don't get coccidiosis. Twice out of a dozen or so times I've been remiss, and they got it.

The best scenario for us to avoid it is to move the darn pen to fresh grass. I just brought home 8 six-week-old silkies two weeks ago. We moved the shed and pen for them. I fed them medicated. They made dust baths and scratched that all up pretty good, so putting them on regular now. Would they have gotten sick had I not? Probably not, but I keep a bag here, so may as well.

 

[Debbie292d]

I worry about it when we get rain in my climate. It's hot and humid anyway, and when we've dealt with coccidiosis, it was after rain. It doesn't seem to matter that the coop and run don't actually get rained into at all. I'm hoping that the older everyone gets, the less it'll be a concern.

Is it possible to move the area they're in at least once a year? I think if they were on fresh dirt/grass, and it rains, they'd be less likely.

For those of us who have to deal with it occasionally, a jug of Corid will just become a permanent fixture in the cupboard.

 

[AnneGirlGG]

Is it possible to move the area they're in at least once a year? I think if they were on fresh dirt/grass, and it rains, they'd be less likely.

For those of us who have to deal with it occasionally, a jug of Corid will just become a permanent fixture in the cupboard.

Not really, unfortunately. Our coop and run, and the run extension we're working on more, are permanent fixtures. Very permanent. My husband says we're going to go live with the chickens for a couple days if we get a hurricane, lol. I am fastidious about cleaning and making sure there is always clean, dry bedding, and hope that it's enough. I do move around the pen that I let babies take field trips in, however. So at the least, the tiniest in the group have a fresh place to scratch.

 

[Echelontheory101]

Hi, welcome to the forum! Glad you joined!


Never be afraid to ask a question on here. This is still the internet, you have to weed through the responses because you can get some internet hysteria but you can get that also just from talking to people. It doesn't have to be the internet. I think you are lucky in that some very good people have been responding to you.

A few years back I wrote up something on Coccidiosis and medicated feed. I'll copy it at the end of this post. It might help you manage better if you understand better what you are dealing with. I have not seen anything that makes me think you are dealing with Coccidiosis.


Debbie, I usually agree with you but not in this case. The medicated feed works by limiting how many of the bug that causes Coccidiosis breeds and multiplies. You cannot catch a viral or bacterial disease if you are never exposed to it. Medicated feed cannot limit how many coccidiosis protozoa reproduce if none are reproducing. Medicated feed does not hurt them if fed before that bug is present but it also does no good. If the bug is present it allows enough to reproduce so the chicks can develop immunity but usually limits the numbers so they don't get sick.

@Echelontheory101 I have no idea what strains of Coccidiosis may be present in your environment. I have no idea when yours will first be exposed to any that may be present. Coccidiosis can kill but most of us manage without it being a big deal. If you recognize the symptoms you can usually treat it.

Good luck!

Now, that write-up

"First you need to know what the "medicated" is in the medicated feed. It should be on the label. Usually it is Amprolium, Amprol, some such product, but until you read the label, you really don't know. Most "medicated' feed from major brands for chicks that will be layers uses Amprolium, but there are a few out there mostly for broilers that use other medicines. I'll assume yours is an Amprolium product, but if it is not, then realize everything I say about it may not apply. And it is possible that the "medicated" is Amprolium AND something else.

Amprolium is not an antibiotic. It does not kill anything. It inhibits the protozoa that cause coccidiosis (often called Cocci on this forum) from multiplying in the chicken's system. It does not prevent the protozoa from multiplying; it just slows that multiplication down. There are several different strains of protozoa that can cause Cocci, some more severe than others. Chickens can develop immunity to a specific strain of the protozoa, but that does not give them immunity to all protozoa that cause Cocci.

It is not a big deal for the chicken’s intestines to contain some of the protozoa that cause Cocci. The problem comes in when the number of those protozoa gets huge. The protozoa can multiply in the chicken’s intestines but also in wet manure. For them to reproduce they need some moisture. Slightly damp isn't an issue, soaking wet is. Different protozoa strains have different strengths, but for almost all cases, if you keep the brooder dry, you will not have a problem.

To develop immunity to a specific strain, that protozoa needs to be in the chicks intestines for two or three weeks. The normal sequence is that a chick has the protozoa. It poops and some of the cysts that develop the protozoa come out in the poop. If the poop is slightly damp, those cysts develop and will then develop in the chick's intestines when the chicks eat that poop. This cycle needs go on for a few weeks so all chicks are exposed and they are exposed long enough to develop immunity. A couple of important points here. You do need to watch them to see if they are getting sick. And the key is to keep the brooder dry yet allow some of the poop to stay damp. Not soaking wet, just barely damp. Wet poop can lead to serious problems.

What sometimes happens is that people keep chicks in a brooder and feed them medicated feed while they are in the brooder. Those chicks are never exposed to the Cocci protozoa that lives in the dirt in their run, so they never develop the immunity to it. Then, they are switched to non-medicated feed and put on the ground where they are for the first time exposed to the protozoa. They do not have immunity, they do not have the protection of the medicated feed, so they get sick. Feeding medicated feed while in the brooder was a complete waste.

I do not feed medicated feed. I keep the brooder dry to not allow the protozoa to breed uncontrollably. The third day that they are in the brooder, I take a scoop of dirt from the run and feed it to them so I can introduce the protozoa and they can develop the immunity they need to the strain they need to develop an immunity to. Since I keep my brooder extremely dry and the water clean the protozoa can't reproduce so every three days I give them more dirt from the run so they get more protozoa and can develop immunity. I don't lose chicks to Cocci when they hit the ground.

There is absolutely nothing wrong with feeding medicated feed to chicks, whether the protozoa are present or not. It will not hurt them. They can still develop the immunity they need. But unless the protozoa are present, it also does no good.

If you get your chicks vaccinated for Cocci, do not feed medicated feed. It can negate the vaccinations."

Thanks so much! I gave them a plug id sod from their run that they'll be in earlier this week. And this morning I stopped all the sav a chick and their poops firmed right up so that is 100% what the issue was with the watery poo luckily! Just got in my own head haha. And thanks for all the information!!

 

[Echelontheory101]

Good point! Just for the sake of helping balance things:

I have raised hundreds of chicks, never used medicated feed, never seen a case of coccidiosis.

This was spread over at least 4 different locations in 3 different states across quite a number of years. Chicks have been in garage, other garage, basement, a wide variety of outdoor pens, with broody hens or without. Broody hens have had mail-order chicks, incubator chicks, chicks they hatched themselves. Brooder chicks have been mail order, or from a local feed store, or hatched in an incubator. Bedding has been newspaper, paper towel, wood shavings, wood chips, dry leaves, clods of dirt, hay or straw, probably other things, any combination depending on what was available at the time. Chicks have been a wide variety of breeds and mixes, raised in groups from 2 to 100+ and sometimes in mixed-age groups. I think the only consistent things have been heat source when there was no broody hen (always a heat lamp) and water (always plain tap water, never added anything to it.)

Thank you!!!

 

[AnneGirlGG]

Thanks so much! I gave them a plug id sod from their run that they'll be in earlier this week. And this morning I stopped all the sav a chick and their poops firmed right up so that is 100% what the issue was with the watery poo luckily! Just got in my own head haha. And thanks for all the information!!

That's great to hear!

 

[Vickie9304]

Thank you so much! I have major health anxiety and the funny thing is getting these chickens the anxiety has stopped being about my health which is so great and refreshing and now its just glommed right on to them LOL. I'm trying to remind myself if I have a fully stocked chicken first aid kit with literally probably every supplement and medication mentioned in these threads over the last couple of months just in case and like you said I know what to look out for and just trying to remind myself that they're little GI tracts are only nine days old and I'm obsessively getting them to drink water off of a paintbrush (they like pecking at it) because I'm worried they arent drinking enough (which they are ) so it's probably watery because they're drinking more than they need to. Honestly I cant wait to get them out to the coop/run and away from down the hall from my bedroom because im watching them constantly haha and need to stop googling

I know you mentioned younger birds. Is there usually an age where theyre "in the clear" for the most part as far as built up immunity?

What do you have in your chicken first aide? I'm thinking about getting some hens, but I'm still on the fence and trying to learn what I can.

 

[Echelontheory101]

What do you have in your chicken first aide? I'm thinking about getting some hens, but I'm still on the fence and trying to learn what I can.

So i bought a tractor supply tool bag https://www.tractorsupply.com/tsc/p...n-wide-mouth-tool-bag-with-14-pockets-2525318 which is the perfect size about the size of an average purse. Below is my list of whats in there now, alot of it is mostly wound Care in case of predator attacks and a few things are supplements or medications for illnesses. Be advised this is all sorts of just in case for alot of different things, alot of the meds and supplements you woudnt use together *also not in the bag list but things I always have in the house anyway, that if you dont normally, I would put in the bag, like antibiotic ointment, hydrocortisone cream, epsom salts, peroxide etc. *

-Safe-Guard AquaSol Dewormer for Chickens,
-Goodwinol VetRx Remedy Poultry Supplement
-Miracle Care Kwik-Stop Styptic Powder
-Durvet Controlled Iodine Farm Animal First Aid Spray
-Andover Healthcare PetFlex Dog, Cat & Small Animal Bandage, Neon Pink, 2-in
-Bovidr Laboratories Nutri-Drench Poultry Supplement
-Lixit Handfeeding Syringe, 35-mL, 1 count
-Vetericyn Plus Antimicrobial Wound Care Spray
-Tylosin Powder for CRD Treatment in Pigeons, Cage Birds & Pet Chickens × 1
-Corid 20% Soluble Powder
-sav-a-chic elctrolyte and probiotic powder packets

I bought everything on Chewy except for the Corid I got that at tractor supply cause chewy was sold out and the tylosin I bought from jedds bird supplies online because chewy requires a vet prescription for it but jedds doesn't

 

[BigBlueHen53]

A bottle of Citracal or its generic equivalent is also a good idea to have on hand, this is calcium citrate +D3 tablets; get the minis if you can. This is very useful for if you have a chicken dropping shell-less eggs or one you think might be eggbound.

For wounds: Triple antibiotic ointment WITHOUT pain reliever, like Neosporin Original or its generic equivalent. Pain releiver, anything ending in -caine, is toxic to chickens.

A spray bottle. When I had a wounded chicken (neighbor's dog), I made up a batch of sterile saline, put it in the spray bottle, and used it to flush her wound twice daily. That way I could wash it without having to physically scrub. She seemed to enjoy it.

Maybe a big, long-handled fishing net in case you have to catch a chicken during the day? I usually wotk on my hens after they've gone to roost, but you never know. They don't see well at night, so it's a lot easier. Which brings me to this:

A good headlamp! Leaves your hands free to work. Walmart has cheap ones that will work. But I just spent $20 for a really good one at Home Depot you can wear on your head or around your neck. It has two bright lights, one on either side. I colored one red with permanent marker, works GREAT! Chickens don't see well in red light. Keeps them calm. And finally:

GLOVES. I get the 5 mil, medium size Nitrile gloves from Harbor Freight. If you need to treat, say, bumblefoot, wear gloves. That's staph. You can get an infection and you don't need that! Protect yourself. I wear them when I clean the coop and in all honesty I keep some in the kitchen for handling raw chicken. Very useful!

Those are my suggestions.