Pellet vs Free Range/Foraging

[Aunt Angus]

.... unless we broke them, Perhaps we need to ask if our selection made it impossible for them to live like their wild jungle fowl ancestors. Maybe they're not fast enough or maybe their nutritional needs are different because of their breeding or maybe they do not have the cultural heritage that a wild hen passes to her brood.

So well said.

 

[Weeg]

.... unless we broke them, Perhaps we need to ask if our selection made it impossible for them to live like their wild jungle fowl ancestors. Maybe they're not fast enough or maybe their nutritional needs are different because of their breeding or maybe they do not have the cultural heritage that a wild hen passes to her brood.

This ^^
While I do believe chickens diet should be as similar to a wild birds as possible, chickens certainly do have different nutritional needs than their wild ancestors. Thats for sure.

Kind of like dogs. Dogs have much different nutritional needs than wolves. They can be bigger, hairier, more or less active, active in different ways, preforming different jobs, etc than wild wolves. But, dogs still thrive on a raw diet, which is as close to their wild ancestors diet as possible. They thrive off of what they are built to eat. That doesn't mean you could feed a dog only with whole prey though, it needs balance.

Chickens are the same way, they should be eating what their wild ancestors are built to eat, but their diet needs to be more balanced to make up with what greedy people bred into them. Excessive egg laying.

 

[TheFatBlueCat]

the good news is, all those legumes are nitrogen fixers, and will improve soil quality with time. They are also (when the birds eat them, anyways) a high protein source, and while the AA levels don't tend to be balanced, the high relative amounts of protein often make them better sources for certain AAs, pound per pound, than better "balanced" protein sources of less total protein.

Here's the Feedipedia page for clovers (follow the links). I have white, yellow, and crimson in my own pasture. Mabe red as well (not a deliberate planting). Look on the "nutritional aspects" tab for white clovers, which discuss chickens particularly. The others, largely, do not - but have similar considerations for rabbits, sheeps, goats, and cattle, so I **ASSUME** that similar findings with red, yellow, crimson, etc clovers and chickens would be discovered as with white clover. Oh, i have "subclover" (subterranian clover) too - which has some useful studies out of Brazil w/ regard free range diets. I didn't plant it, its a native ddeposited on my soils likely by passing birds, and many of the studies are in Spanish, so I've not read them.

I have read this one.

I should mention the clovers took a while to become established - at the start of this year, I could hardly find examples of the yellow and crimson for photography - but with the more seasonal rains, they are croppign up in previously barren places.

Sorry I haven't read all the way ahead, but just thought I would mention if you are seeking clover info, try searching it on New Zealand based sites. We have pasture-based systems for all our hooved agriculture (beef, dairy and sheep) and there is a fair amount of research on a range of clovers including subterranean. It isn't chicken specific but I have found it very informative.

 

[3KillerBs]

.... unless we broke them, Perhaps we need to ask if our selection made it impossible for them to live like their wild jungle fowl ancestors. Maybe they're not fast enough or maybe their nutritional needs are different because of their breeding or maybe they do not have the cultural heritage that a wild hen passes to her brood.

Making chickens more productive -- larger, meatier, capable of laying far more eggs, etc. -- is not "breaking" them.

Gallus domesticus is no longer the same thing as Gallus gallus. They eat differently because than are different.

 

[Aunt Angus]

Making chickens more productive -- larger, meatier, capable of laying far more eggs, etc. -- is not "breaking" them.

Gallus domesticus is no longer the same thing as Gallus gallus. They eat differently because than are different.

I think it's a lil bit on the exploitative side.... Kinda led to susceptibility to reproductive issues.... Made them a skosh human-dependent....

 

[3KillerBs]

I think it's a lil bit on the exploitative side.... Kinda led to susceptibility to reproductive issues.... Made them a skosh human-dependent....

Modern chickens provide millions and millions of people with abundant, inexpensive protein.

Low-input, low-production breeds capable of living off forage and waste exist and people who only want about 50 eggs per hen per year have the option of raising them in a low-input system. There are people in this thread who have the land, the climate, and the willingness to do so.

But it's not a realistic idea for the average backyarder. We feed our birds and they feed us.

 

[Joey and dolly]

Depending on what they are eating while free-ranging, things may be toxic or could not be supplemental.

 

[Shadrach]

Lets say a high egg production breed lays 1000 eggs in her lifetime.
Lets say she has an average lifespan of 4 years.
6 eggs here in the UK costs around £1.50. This works out at £0.25 per egg.
1000 eggs comes to £250.00 worth of eggs in the hens lifetime.

A high production breed needs 100 grams of feed per day. Over 4 years this amounts to:

365 days x 100 grams = 36500 grams for one year.

4 years x 36500 = 146000 grams over her lifespan.

A 20 kg bag of feed (20000 grams) costs on average £20.00 in the UK taking into account delivery etc.
Feed works out at £1.00 per kilo on the price above.
0.10 per 100 grams.
100 grams at £0.10 x 365 days = £36.50 per year.
4 years = £146.00.

This leaves you with roughly £100.00 for coop, waterer feeders, feed trays, maintenance, health treatment at it’s most basic (mites, lice etc) in order to make a profit.

I don’t know what the average backyard coop costs but I’ve seen coops from a few hundred pounds to a few thousand.

I think for most fully confined backyard chicken keepers the hopeful “we feed them and they feed us” is in reality more like, we feed them and get some really expensive eggs for our troubles.

 

[Alagirl]

Lets say a high egg production breed lays 1000 eggs in her lifetime.
Lets say she has an average lifespan of 4 years.
6 eggs here in the UK costs around £1.50. This works out at £0.25 per egg.
1000 eggs comes to £250.00 worth of eggs in the hens lifetime.

A high production breed needs 100 grams of feed per day. Over 4 years this amounts to:

365 days x 100 grams = 36500 grams for one year.

4 years x 36500 = 146000 grams over her lifespan.

A 20 kg bag of feed (20000 grams) costs on average £20.00 in the UK taking into account delivery etc.
Feed works out at £1.00 per kilo on the price above.
0.10 per 100 grams.
100 grams at £0.10 x 365 days = £36.50 per year.
4 years = £146.00.

This leaves you with roughly £100.00 for coop, waterer feeders, feed trays, maintenance, health treatment at it’s most basic (mites, lice etc) in order to make a profit.

I don’t know what the average backyard coop costs but I’ve seen coops from a few hundred pounds to a few thousand.

I think for most fully confined backyard chicken keepers the hopeful “we feed them and they feed us” is in reality more like, we feed them and get some really expensive eggs for our troubles.

I think you are looking at the wrong supermarket eggs to compare to.

 

[NatJ]

I think you are looking at the wrong supermarket eggs to compare to.

I think it depends on which eggs a person would buy.

When I buy eggs in the store, I buy the cheapest ones. Chickens are only a money-saver for me if they produce eggs cheaper than the cheapest ones in the store.

I have a friend that buys organic free-range eggs when they don't have chickens of their own. As long as they can produce home-raised eggs cheaper than the organic free-range ones, they do save money by having their own chickens.

(Of course saving money is not the only reason to have chickens.)