Questions about selling future chicks

[JacinLarkwell]

I do not have to be NPIP to sell, however when most big chicken peop areround you are NPIP, it does make selling harder since they cant buy from you

 

[U_Stormcrow]

Oh, and good luck putting your RIR/Orp over your CornishX ladies. The outcome is a crap shoot. I have a CornishX hen in my own breed project (seems like every new owner, briefly, has a breed project), the outcome is chaotic and likely not at all what you would expect. Chicken genetics are strange.

For that particular cross, I'm batting 50/50 on size, and the outcome is always white with leakage. UGLY birds. No second generations yet.

/edit - Picture of S White, one of the RUG (Rooster of Unknown Genetics)/CornishX offspring. This one happened to get the size gene and was 6 lb 1 oz at 20 weeks, on a diet of once daily feeding plus free range. 3 lb, 12 oz at 9 weeks - when the growth started slowing.

So you can see the "pattern" - Let's just say it won't carry a price premium on Craigslist.

and this is the bird at birth, then a couple weeks later.

 

[Ridgerunner]

I've tried looking through WA state regulations, but haven't really found the info I'm looking for,

I'd contact your county extension office and talk to them. If they can't answer your questions themselves they should be able to put you in contact with someone who can.

Each state sets its program up differently. They test for different things and have different ways to manage that. Many people would be shocked to find what most states do not test for. NPIP is a very misunderstood system. It was primarily set up to stop Pullorum, a disease that was threatening the commercial chicken industry plus a lot of backyard flocks. It worked, Pullorum is now pretty rare. Some states have added a requirement to test for other diseases, some haven't. In general they do not test for Marek's or Coccidia for example. Some do for Avian Flu. Some test for other things. They often have requirements concerning keeping a closed flock where you do not expose your chickens to any that are not NPIP in that state's requirements.

Each state has its own ways to set up testing, costs and who can test. In Arkansas you can attend a class and become a certified inspector, fairly easy to test your own. Other states make it harder.

I don't now how to say it any clearer, each state has it's own requirements and how they do it. Until you find out what those are for a specific state you just don't know. NPIP does not mean they are disease free, it means they did not have the specific diseases they test for the day they were tested.

I don't know what you may be required to do when selling chicks within Washington State. If you sell across state lines you need to meet the NPIP requirements of the state you are selling into, not Washington State's requirements. There may be exemptions, where if you sell below a certain number you don't need it.

I took a quick look at your state requirements. You probably don't want to do that unless you are planning on doing more than I think you are. But don't just throw up your hands and quit before you find out if that does apply to what you want to do. It's possible that if you stay in state and sell below a certain number of birds that may not apply to you.

https://agr.wa.gov/departments/animals-livestock-and-pets/avian-health/avian-npip

 

[Weeg]

Well, I don't hatch to sell very often, I try to though. Usually once, or twice, during spring, or summer.
I'm not NPIP Certified, but planning on it. I know about having annual testings, but don't remember anything about annual vet inspections. I think it varies from state, to state.

Okay, maybe it was a single vet inspection. I stoped reading after annual testing lol!

 

[Weeg]

Look up the specific legal requirements needed in your area. In my state, to sell chicks legally you need to get the flock tested for free by the state for a couple of diseases. I actually have my test scheduled for July. Being certified disease free allows one to sell chicks and hatching eggs legally in Massachusetts. It is also the first step towards NPIP certification. Maybe your state doesn't need that but a lot of them do. It is up to you if you want your venture to be legal, but it'd definitely be advantageous to at least know the laws in your state, whether complying with or breaking them. The choice is yours entirely. Just sharing some information.

This is great info! I wouldn't be opposed to getting tests done if thats complexity necessary. If it wasn't necessary I would try to avoid it, but I also get the whole point that you have to be sure. I'll try to find the legal requirements and double check what that says.

 

[Weeg]

My honest opinion: most chicken keepers go through wanting to do this. MANY smallish farms exist that do it, even more large hatcheries with sexing guarantess etc, and craigslist is flooded with chicks from unlicensed people. So if you are set on doing it, try to find a niche for your area and fill it honorably. I know hatching chicks is fun, but form a biz stand point it is not very sound. Personally, after passing my disease test, I plan to cross and regularly hatch heritage New Hampshires and Delawares. This will give me a heritage cross sexlink. The females should be excellent layers and can add replacements to my flock or be sold as females. The males will be my meat birds, thus breaking the chains of ordering cornish x every time I want to grow chicken meat. This way I only have known females to sell, and they already pay for themselves with meat and money saved buying meat chicks. Any extra girls sold will be a bonus. I am starting with heritage Henry Noll lines bred for meat (new hampshires) and egg prod (delawares). I expect to make ZERO money off this anytime soon but MAYBE pay for chicken feed next year and DEFINITELY create a sustainable source of meat chicks that will pay for itself in time.
I will also keep a pure line of each breed, breeding for the standard and eventually maybe showing and selling to that crowd. That is a long term goal.

That makes a lot of sense. I don't want to be that person who passes a disease to another person flock, or is illegal selling chicks. I had a bad experience with eom hatching eggs I purchased from a BYC member, I later learned from a thread he posted that his flock had Mareks and he hadn't told me. I will definitely look into testing.
I also agree about the money making. I'm less interested in the income, really, I just think it will be a fun project to try out. Maybe if I start a single testing and selling some mixed breeds and a few pures, I will evenutlay expand my interest to NPIP, etc. I think this is a good starting point.
Plus, any extra roosters can be meat for our family, and even though I could never take part in that, I know its humane and better then putting them in a bad situation.

 

[Weeg]

Here in FL, NPIP testing is free, and occurs twice yearly to maintain one's certification. Its the ONLY way to legally sell birds that cross state lines, and since I am close to at least one State border, I consider it a necessity. I also consider it responsible, as I have a high degree of confidence I'm selling a good product, honestly described, most likely free of disease (there re no guarantees in life, except that none of us gets out alive). Most of my Craigslist "competition" is not certified, most have a side (or main) business in selling shell eggs, and in some cases are blatantly breaking the law (in such minor ways no one cares, and that they indicate what they are doing on their Craigslist ad means they are at least honest about it).

Thank you for better explaining NPIP certification to me. I'm very happy to hear its free, and makes me much more willing to do it if all I have to do is send testing into a lab. Thats perfectly fine with me.
I'm so glad I made this thread, even after reading so few posts. I don't want to be the illegal person possibly passing disease to others, I want to be responsible. I'll try to find my state requirements, and look into getting NPIP certification since that seems to be the most responsible path to choose.

 

[U_Stormcrow]

Thank you for better explaining NPIP certification to me. I'm very happy to hear its free, and makes me much more willing to do it if all I have to do is send testing into a lab. Thats perfectly fine with me.
I'm so glad I made this thread, even after reading so few posts. I don't want to be the illegal person possibly passing disease to others, I want to be responsible. I'll try to find my state requirements, and look into getting NPIP certification since that seems to be the most responsible path to choose.

Its free in FLorida. It does NOT appear to be free in WA, where you live. Testing generally involves a certified inspector coming to your property, doing some number of visual checks, then testing your breeding birds on site for some number of avian diseases. Here its (at minimum) Avian Influenza (AI) and Exotic Newcastle Disease (END/ vND). I believe they also look for S Pullorum (which was the original purpose of NPIP) and S Gallinarum as well.

One site I saw suggested WA was $85/hr for the inspectors time, and required a minimum breeder flock over a particular age of 30 birds. Additionally, there was a physical premises inspection in WA more thorough than what we have in FL. I'd estimate 2-3 hours to do it all first time. You do need to look into your state's specific requirements.

 

[Weeg]

Its free in FLorida. It does NOT appear to be free in WA, where you live. Testing generally involves a certified inspector coming to your property, doing some number of visual checks, then testing your breeding birds on site for some number of avian diseases. Here its (at minimum) Avian Influenza (AI) and Exotic Newcastle Disease (END/ vND). I believe they also look for S Pullorum (which was the original purpose of NPIP) and S Gallinarum as well.

One site I saw suggested WA was $85/hr for the inspectors time, and required a minimum breeder flock over a particular age of 30 birds. Additionally, there was a physical premises inspection in WA more thorough than what we have in FL. I'd estimate 2-3 hours to do it all first time. You do need to look into your state's specific requirements.

Thank you, this answered all the other questions I was about to ask. I did read about inspector, etc. but only briefly. I was going to finish reading the passage, but seems you've answered the rest of my NPIP questions.
All of the test, inspections, etc. are what is truing me away from NPIP. I don't think I'm going to make that my goal for the start, but at the very least, I'll look into doing some testing for Mareks and other diseases before selling. I have a lot of time before these guys start laying hatchable eggs, so tons of time to figure out my plan.

 

[Weeg]

I don't know what you may be required to do when selling chicks within Washington State. If you sell across state lines you need to meet the NPIP requirements of the state you are selling into, not Washington State's requirements. There may be exemptions, where if you sell below a certain number you don't need it.

This I did know, and if I didn't get NPIP I won't be able to ship eggs/chicks, or sell outside of the state.
So far what I'm getting from this, is that NPIP is a big effort haha. It varies from state to state, and to answer all my questions I should call my country extension office and talk to them. You can sell chicks without certification, but its somewhat irresponsible and can be illegal.
This is great info, all stuff I need to know to look into, and know in general.