REALLY NEED HELP: I've read swollen/sour/impacted/pendulous crop(pic)

[ipana]

Oops, forgot to paste the link:

http://www.broodyhen.co.uk/ket/fowlnotfoul/1staid.htm

 

[Lunakai]

Excellent, thank you. I found a vet nearby who will sell me a feeding tube. I have taken her from the coop and she is in a box in my office. She had a very normal looking poop, but it did smell rather nasty and sour. She only has access to water. I didn't put ACV in it because it is a plastic waterer.

 

[ipana]

I did not find that ACV in the water did anything. In fact, I was told that it could upset the normal pH if you put in the water for all the chickens. At this point, I think you're better served on getting the stuff out. Please remember to keep the hen's head down while you are holding her upside down to get the stuff out. The airway in her mouth would allow her to aspirate if you let her lift her head. When you see that nothing is coming out of her mouth, you can allow her head to come up and then she can breathe more easily.

Keep us posted. Ask any questions that come to you.

 

[Lunakai]

Ipana, I flushed her crop with around 100 CC's of water, but I certainly did not get that out. In fact, it was very hard to get her to vomit. It does feel like a large mass of grass in there. It is very pliable, not like hay, which would be really stiff. It is pretty big and I don't think that it will come up through her mouth. Have you ever done the crop surgery to remove a funky mass? Or is there something that will dissolve it?

 

[ipana]

Yes, I have done the crop surgery. After the sour crop returned, I said that I would never do that again. That's why I worked so hard with the flushing. Each situation is different so no one can fully tell you what will work for your bird. My bird had grass, too. I could feel it. I tried to mash it around using different angles, etc., without hurting her crop or skin. It still took many flushes over several days to get it all out. My experience taught me that the warm water and massaging worked for my situation. I had to vomit her quite a few times. I would do the best I could and hope that it was enough but in the morning, her crop was not flat so I'd have to spend the day trying to work with her. She had a bit of poop so I knew she was getting something. I would inject dilute baby food through the feeding tube to make sure she had some nutrition. I would especially make sure she had that before I put her to bed for the night.

The time that I knew that I had really gotten it was after I had tried and tried and tried. I could get the liquid but I couldn't get the grass. I held her over the toilet so I could see what was coming out. My heart just wouldn't let me give up. Finally, after at least 6X of flushing and vomiting, it began to come out. I think the continuous warm water and massaging just broke it up. I can still see her face when it came out. She had closed her eyes and looked like she was really working to get it out. I think it may have been in her throat at that moment, I don't know. But, all of a sudden, there it was. I could feel then that her crop was flatter than it had been for a long time. By morning, she felt flacid over her crop area...it was empty but the skin was kinda' hanging and loose. It took several days for her to get back to almost normal. It's been several months since she's had a problem but I still pick her up and feel her crop every day! I can almost hear her say "enough already."

She was in the house, in a spare bathroom, and it was not pretty, that's for sure! I put a 2X2 board over the sink and she would roost there. She actually came to like it. Anyway, you will have to determine what to do. If you don't think you can get it out, the only other option that I know is the crop surgery. Someone recently just posted a nice video of how to do it. I think it was Gloria's Gang. I'll try to find a link so you can see it.

Here's the youtube she posted: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mNnY1kiX5H8&feature=mfu_in_order&list=UL


Here's the BYC thread: https://www.backyardchickens.com/forum/viewtopic.php?id=435506&p=1


I so want you to save your precious bird. The important thing for now as you decide what to do...make sure she is getting nutrition. From what you've said so far, you are doing wonderfully for her. Please continue to post for questions or just to let us know how you're doing. You know we all wish we could help you more.

 

[Lunakai]

When you did the flush, how many CC's would you put in? You would flush 6 times a day? I'll try it. I'm up for NOT doing that surgery! I wonder if any digestive enzymes would help. She only has access to water right now, so I should feed her, maybe yogurt and applesauce? Interesting video by the way. Thanks for posting it.

 

[ipana]

I don't know how large a mass your bird has. It's possible that you may not be able to get it by vomiting her. As far as I know, there isn't anything that will break up the mass.

There is a product that was suggested in the event that there is a yeast build-up preventing things from moving through. It is called Nystatin. I tried it but in my case, it didn't work. I don't know if that's an option for you or not. It's a prescription product and is a bit pricey. Your vet may be able to help you on that. First State Veterinary Supply may help but now that it's the weekend, time may be a factor.

I put in differing amounts from 60 to about 100 cc. When I did the larger amounts, I followed with a smaller amount as it didn't generally all come out. As you are holding her upside down, try to massage her crop as you try to push the contents upward. Then, after a flush, let her rest for a few minutes...3 or 4. I would sit with my hen on my lap talking to her and continuing to massage the crop gently.

For food, if you have some, I would still give her the baby food...the kind with meat. It is easy for her to digest. If she doesn't eat it herself, dilute it (maybe 60:40 food to water) and inject it through the feeding tube. It will take 2-3 jars per day of the higher calorie baby food like ham and gravy. I fed my bird 3-4 times a day even though I would be vomiting her. I would feed her and then wait 2-3 hours, etc. Getting something into her before she goes to bed is important.She'll have runny poop but runny poop is better than no poop at all! Let's hope she has runny poop, that is. I keep harping on the food because these birds can starve. If you're feeling that her weight is dropping, it is even more critical to get food to her. I don't remember if you said that your bird is pooping or not. That's an important piece of info. Poop means something is getting through, be it ever so slight.

Hang in there. Please keep posting.

 

[ipana]

Lunaki, your situation stays on my mind so while I was pondering, an "ole timey" method of dealing with sour crop came to my mind. Someone on BYC board had mentioned it when I was struggling with this a year ago. I believe she told me at the time that an old farmer had told her about it and she had done it and it worked. I did it and it worked way back but when I tried it again as the sour crop returned several times, it didn't work. But, you can consider it. As they say, "it wouldn't hurt."

After you've removed as much of the crop contents as you can, inject 5cc of wine through your feeding tube and wait 3-4 hours, giving the hen no food or water during those hours. On the successful time for me, all of a sudden, my hen just spewed out a bunch of poop. She had not pooped a lot until then. From then on, things began moving through. I still kept her on the soft diet for 2 days before I began adding back in the crumbles.

The problem with my sweet little bird is that she cannot have ANY grass. I learned that the hard way. After the first round of dealing with this, she finally got back to her "family." About two weeks later, she began having the squishy crop again. We struggled through getting that cleared up and she returned again. Even though I was getting grass out of her, it still didn't occur to me that she could have NO grass. After I took her off any grass, she has done wonderfully well. When the others get a little "road trip," she has to stay home. She doesn't seem to mind in that she isn't fretting that she isn't with them. It appears that she's quite happy even when by herself. So, when you get your bird straightened around, consider keeping her off all grass. I'm sure you don't want to have to go through this again.

Now, back to the wine...I don't drink so I had no clue as to what to get. When I went to the grocery store, I couldn't believe all the choices! Guess I don't get out much.

Anyway, the cheapest kind is just fine. Do not give more than 5cc. And, don't use any water to get it all down the tube. I took off the syringe and blew gently to make sure it was all out of the tube.

It's just a thought. You may choose to ignore it and that's OK. I'm just trying to think of things to help.

I won't be home most of the afternoon but I'll check the board again this evening. I'm pulling for you and your hen.

 

[erinem]

You might want to use a "crop bra" for a while to support her crop in the proper position for emptying. I used to work for a parrot store handfeeding babies - every now and then when we started to offer a baby solid food, we'd get a baby that would pack his crop so full that it wouldn't empty. We would syringe feed warm water and massage the crop until it all emptied, but when that crop had been stretched that far once, it was very easy for it to sag down and stop emptying again. An older woman that I worked with had been caring for parrots her whole life, and she would make these babies a "crop bra". It was just some vet wrap, wrapped around their body and criss-crossed over their chest to support their saggy crop. Over time, the crop returns to its normal size and the bra can come off. Your girl's crop looks so pendulous, I'd worry that the problem might recur when she goes back to eating normally.

I just did some googling, and found a company that actually sells crop bras!
http://crazykfarm.mybigcommerce.com/products/Birdy-Bra-Crop-Supporter-{47}-Chest-Protector.html
A homemade one should work just as well. Just a suggestion

Also, if you're feeding baby food, check the ingredients for onions or garlic. The meat-flavored varieties often contain a ton of onion powder, which can cause a hemolytic anemia if given in large enough quantities for a long enough period of time. I'm a vet student, and our clinicians constantly harp on us about asking if an owner has been feeding baby food. It's surprisingly common to find a pet that hasn't been eating well for a while because of one illness that also has an unexplained anemia, then when you question the owner, you find out they've been feeding a lot of baby food because it's all the animal would eat. I can't find any published data on how much is too much for a chicken. I would guess that you'd have to work pretty hard to actually feed enough onion for it to be life-threatening, but I'd err on the side of caution.

 

[ipana]

erinem, thanks for the baby food caution. Wouldn't have ever known that. Also, for the crop bra. Don't need one just now but you never know. Thanks again. Loved your signature...having that many animals. Good one.