Red Laced Cornish X and project talk (pics p. 8)

[al6517]

Steve : Yes it is a shame on the breeding front for the whites, The show ring has ruined many a good breed as with other animals like dog's for instance. I have never advocated breeding for the unbreedable off spring, but there is a very strong influence in the show ring and that carries over and encourages these practices. I am determined to breed and keep both hulk's types and some leggier self breeders, which when bred together should give me a roughly 50/50 mix. Getting a bird like these adult white cornish and saying WOW !!! what a cool bad a33 looking bird then realizing in the same breath that the sons-a-buggar can't breed naturaly, is very disheartning. I have visited with several APA judges and they feel that direction is unlikely to change unfortunately.

AL

 

[SteveH]

Quote:
I fully believe the White Cornish can be bred back to a superior meat breed; one even superior to its ancestors from the 50s and before. The two DCs I was able to locate and purchase had faults that would have prevented them from showing well or being used to breed show birds; but they already had developed very broad breasts and heavy thigh and leg meat at 6 months..................................... no waiting a year to eighteen months to see that. I'm sure diet and soft living conditions had a lot to do with that; but without the genetics, how you feed and house them is irrelevant. I was beginning to fear they were either not built right [I don't think they were any leggier than your Hulk, but the youngest was never going to have as thick of shanks as his] or not fertile enough to be very successful at live breeding, and they were approaching 10 and 11 months before they started getting successful; but for some reason as soon as they were put in a run with grass growing they started getting near 100% fertility on the eggs from hens they had previosly seemed unable to mount properly. [Perhaps it was just a recovery period from the harsh winter they endured in my open front coop that was needed] I doubt that the line they came from is the only one with the same attributes, and see no reason why the Whites can't be both improoved and numbers increased by a cross to Darks like them or better, and still be successful at the shows.

 

[KatyTheChickenLady]

first "Rooster Juice" now that is funny!

steve - what if the time you put them on grass just coincidently came at the same time they "came of age" I have two young layer roos that I am allowing to run free right now they mount EVERYTHING but it is obvious that they have no "rooster juice" yet, they're just not old enough. If I had them in a pen trying for fertility I would be sorely disapointed.

 

[SteveH]

Quote:
Possible I suppose, but the day I brought them home they were randy and immediately challenged the roo in the next pen. Both received face wounds through the fence because they would not withdraw their heads from the fence that was preventing an all out rumble with him. This behavior led me to believe they were sexually mature. This was late December, and the wounds and cold weather had them looking more subdued by the next day; judging by their feather condition, they had been raised indoors, and must have been pretty disappointed with their new accomidations. LOL They both lost weight and added as much fluff as the true Cornish are capable of [which isn't much] over the winter............................ but remained healthy even after the big footed one lost the tips of two toes to frostbite.

Gotta fly............................ I have eggs arrived at the P.O..

 

[al6517]

Quote:
I fully believe the White Cornish can be bred back to a superior meat breed; one even superior to its ancestors from the 50s and before. The two DCs I was able to locate and purchase had faults that would have prevented them from showing well or being used to breed show birds; but they already had developed very broad breasts and heavy thigh and leg meat at 6 months..................................... no waiting a year to eighteen months to see that. I'm sure diet and soft living conditions had a lot to do with that; but without the genetics, how you feed and house them is irrelevant. I was beginning to fear they were either not built right [I don't think they were any leggier than your Hulk, but the youngest was never going to have as thick of shanks as his] or not fertile enough to be very successful at live breeding, and they were approaching 10 and 11 months before they started getting successful; but for some reason as soon as they were put in a run with grass growing they started getting near 100% fertility on the eggs from hens they had previosly seemed unable to mount properly. [Perhaps it was just a recovery period from the harsh winter they endured in my open front coop that was needed] I doubt that the line they came from is the only one with the same attributes, and see no reason why the Whites can't be both improoved and numbers increased by a cross to Darks like them or better, and still be successful at the shows.

I think that watching and closely evalutating them daily can have early rewards, and sometimes they will show promise earlier than a yr -18mo. I have found that at the age of 1-4yr's old for roosters are their prime breeding years. Time of the year and their enviroment has a huge effect on fertility, they may only come in for a few months turn on and off several times in that period. Yeah Steve they can be brought back to their hey day as the bird to have, and breeding for it will help that. I sometimes may breed a fault knowing it won't show up in the pairing and if it does in small numbers they can be dealt with, it has to be about the numbers on the ground before good choices can be made. It's a tough deal most of the time.

Feeding can be a huge jump in decision making, getting them to show their best attributes early through a good feed regimin can be critical.
here is a few more pic's of some recent progress on some standard WLR's and some white.
Steve : I made a miss statement earlier single laced was what I meant as desirable not dbl, had a brain fart and it was late LOL.


A new quad I put together tonight, I chose each of these hen's on different merits for hatchings to come. They are all from the same March hatch.

An example of what is a cull in my pen, WLR coloring is off and it's gangly and way to tall, when he fills out he will be impresive for a flock honcho.
1st rooster

2nd Rooster

The new white spring hatch, there are more cooking in the bator but these show good promise early.

Nice wide back on this very young pullet.

One side of the breeder pen, packed with Cornish with more on the way.

As you can see the feed program can be a hassle LOL with 7 different combinations depending on what needs to be done.

 

[WhiteMountainsRanch]

WOW AL!

May I ask what's in the feed bins?

PS. Can I have your 2 rooster culls!??!

 

[KatyTheChickenLady]

you have some beautiful birds al you really do . . . AND YOU KNOW IT!!!

 

[al6517]

Quote:
We can work something out on the cull's I am sure. The feed bin's hold a variety so I can custom mix and match per pen according to what I need in each and their stage of development.
Each bin contains=
cracked corn
22% starter/grower
2-30% breeder conditioner
18% layer
Calf manna
40lbs DE with 10lbs 7dust mixed in

 

[al6517]

Quote:
Awww shoot just a bunch of Ole pot lickers is all LOL.

 

[Gold Griffin Chicken Mom]

I have been reading along but it's time for a question or three:

Al, does the Sevin dust go IN their feed?

What does the calf mana do for them (dietwise)? I recall calf mana being discussed, but don't recall its recommended use.

I currently have gamebird grower (30% protein) to add to foods as needed. Should I get "conditioner", too?

Now back to your regularly scheduled discussion...