Rehabilitating a Rooster

[Wyorp Rock]

Well I may have been to optimistic. I got home from taking care of a client’s home aquarium and when I walked in the room he was flapping away and being silly in the bathroom. By the time I got in there, I saw something that I hoped was water but I’m pretty sure is mucus being flung from his beak. He had a few wet sounding coughs and I’m thinking MG is probably the cause. It’s so frustrating because I have no idea how I got it, and there’s no way to get rid of it. I know Denegard treats it but I’m not sure I can get any before he’ll be too far gone. Is there anything more readily available I might be able to find? I have two mom and pop feed stores near and TSC and Atwood’s.

I'm sorry to hear that!
Do you have anything that you used for treatment the last time - maybe Tylan?

The Tylan injectable was been taken off store shelves last year, so I doubt you will find that unless your Mom/Pop store has some stashed somewhere.
I don't have Atwoods so...not sure what they have.

You are in a pickle, so LA 200 may be your best option IF the cause of his coughs are due to MG. Info on LA 200 is confusing at best for me - it's not really clear if you can give it orally or if it's injection only. Hopefully @Eggcessive will chime in with her thoughts on that.
Anyway. In my notes for LA 200 (Oxytetracycline 200mg/ml) dosage is 25-40mg/kg so that translates to 0.06 to 0.10 ml per pound of weight.

It's sad that he's having trouble with this. I hope he gets better. If he's part of your breeding program it may be worth getting some testing to find out what you're dealing with. I know sometimes that's not an option.

 

[Eggcessive]

Check his crop in case he could have dropped some water or is regurgitating some fluid from his crop. As @Wyorp Rock said, about all feed stores have for MG is the refrigerated LA200 tetracycline nowadays. I would give 0.5 ml (100mg) daily since it is fairly safe. You will need a needle and syringe since it is injectable to remove it from the vial, but many are using it orally. You can get Tylosin powder for the water here:
https://www.nepigeonsupplies.com/product/tylosin-powder/Foys may have it, but jedds seems to be out of stock temporarily.

 

[Fairview01]

I won't go into the entire story but if you'd like to read it please see here:

https://www.backyardchickens.com/threads/the-imported-english-orpington-thread.386051/page-2297 - Post 22,963

Anyway, I currently have a Blue Orpington rooster in my bathroom after he badly lost a fight to a hormonal gander, and was then picked on for days by the other flock rooster and two young cockerels because he was feeling off.

How big is your flock - number of hens? How big is the coop/run? For 4 roosters/cockerels it wouldn't be out of the question to have at least 50 hens so each can have a decent harem and minimize competition for breeding rights.

If this rooster does recover he is no longer part of the flock hierarchy and there is a better than average choice that the remaining 3 roosters will kill him when reintroduced.

Good to know. I remember the good ol' days when Texas A&M just showed up and did it for me. lol With the antigen shortage I haven't even tried to schedule another testing. Plus there are no testers in my county so it's a huge pain to get someone to come out.

It's very unlikely your rooster would test positive for P/T unless he was hatched from a hen that was positive. P/T is a vertically transmitted disease. Very rarely is it horizontally transmitted. The other reason he probably will not test positive is that it has been several decades since the last positive result occurred in the nation and it was on the east cost.

You can have him tested for AI by having a vet take a throat swab and send it to one of the 2 state labs. However of he has AI your entire flock would be infected. It is a horizontally transmitted disease and when one shows symptoms the entire flock is typically infected.

 

[ColtHandorf]

Do you have anything that you used for treatment the last time - maybe Tylan?

I used Denagard and don't have any left. :/

It's sad that he's having trouble with this. I hope he gets better. If he's part of your breeding program it may be worth getting some testing to find out what you're dealing with. I know sometimes that's not an option.

Thank you for the kind words. He was crowing again this morning. But he still looks poorly. I would like to have them tested to know for sure. I've been wanting to get NPIP certified, but I haven't had much luck with the antigen shortage and there are no testers in my county. I suppose I could take him/some to a vet for testing, but I am going to assume that will be ridiculously expensive.

Check his crop in case he could have dropped some water or is regurgitating some fluid from his crop. As @Wyorp Rock said, about all feed stores have for MG is the refrigerated LA200 tetracycline nowadays. I would give 0.5 ml (100mg) daily since it is fairly safe. You will need a needle and syringe since it is injectable to remove it from the vial, but many are using it orally.

Thank you for that helpful information. I thought I read Tetracycline would treat it. But it's impossible to find in pet stores for treating aquarium fish illnesses because most stores pulled it off the shelves. I will see if I can find something for him.

 

[Eggcessive]

@Kiki might have information about more inexpensive testing in TX for respiratory diseases through the state vet. Zoologix can send you swabs to collect for a pcr respiratory panel for about $90, and that tests for a whole list of diseases:
http://www.zoologix.com/avian/Datasheets/PoultryRespiratoryPanel.htm

 

[Wyorp Rock]

A vet doing your testing would be very expensive.
Almost every state has a state lab. Some labs accept samples from private parties, while other's require the sample to come from a vet - each state is different.
It doesn't hurt to ask what they do, how much, etc. It may be doable, but on the other hand you do have to consider your budget, goals, etc. Completely understandable.

Most antibiotics, you would need to order online. Only a few injectables are available in stores. Since you have had a history of illness, if it's possible, it may be a good idea to have something on hand for emergency or if you have some birds showing symptoms. Of course that also requires storage and $$ too.

 

[Kiki]

@Kiki might have information about more inexpensive testing in TX for respiratory diseases through the state vet. Zoologix can send you swabs to collect for a pcr respiratory panel for about $90, and that tests for a whole list of diseases:
http://www.zoologix.com/avian/Datasheets/PoultryRespiratoryPanel.htm

Swab testing is fairly cheap:
https://tvmdl.tamu.edu/tests/?species=avian

 

[ColtHandorf]

How big is your flock - number of hens? How big is the coop/run? For 4 roosters/cockerels it wouldn't be out of the question to have at least 50 hens so each can have a decent harem and minimize competition for breeding rights.

Not that it matters in the slightest, but there are:

Females:

- 4x Silver-laced
- 1x Black hen
- 1x Blue pullet
- 1x Chocolate pullet
- 1x Lavender pullet
- 2x White (one pullet and one hen)

Males:

- 1x Silver-laced - 2.5 years
- 1x Silver-laced - 6 months
- 1x White - 6 months
- 1x Blue - 1 year

The Silver-laced and White Orpington cockerels just began attempting to breed this month. They are not very good at it. Suede (the Blue Orpington) has been with Hollywood since he was about five months old. English Orpingtons mature at a much slower rate than many other breeds and he didn't begin crowing until after nine months and breeding until 10. There have been zero issues with the four of them together until Suede was injured by the gander and even then the other three males didn't actively attack or flog him, but he was very nervous around the other birds and when he would run away they took advantage of the situation to simply bully him with their presence.

In regards to the size of their run; you can see this image for additional clarification:

The light pink lines is the original pen. The black lines designate the fenced in backyard with a five foot fence, versus the 3.5 foot chain link fence you can just make out in the bottom right corner of that area against the house. The fenced in back yard they had access to every day is approximately 5,400 square feet. Their pen is something like 600 square feet.

Since the incident I have moved the Orpingtons, separated out by color (sort of) into their own pen in the barn you see to the bottom left corner of the image. The barn is divided into three sections each about 300 square feet. The blue lines are where the pens will be expanded at the end of the month and will come out at least an additional 20 feet, making each of the breeding pens about 500 square feet.

If this rooster does recover he is no longer part of the flock hierarchy and there is a better than average choice that the remaining 3 roosters will kill him when reintroduced.

As this is not my first time raising chickens I am aware that mixing adult roosters generally ends poorly. Which is why I have raised the younger cockerels from three months on up with the dominant male and the 11 month old back up Silver-laced cockerel is in a tractor. Earlier in this thread I stated that the birds had been separated out, so if Suede got to go on supervised field trips to see his girls (Blue, Black, Chocolate, and Lavender currently) they were in their own pen and he was in no danger of having an encounter with the other males, thereby preserving the small amount of pride/dignity he's managed to hold on to.

It's very unlikely your rooster would test positive for P/T unless he was hatched from a hen that was positive. P/T is a vertically transmitted disease. Very rarely is it horizontally transmitted. The other reason he probably will not test positive is that it has been several decades since the last positive result occurred in the nation and it was on the east cost.

You can have him tested for AI by having a vet take a throat swab and send it to one of the 2 state labs. However of he has AI your entire flock would be infected. It is a horizontally transmitted disease and when one shows symptoms the entire flock is typically infected.

Thank you for that information.

Zoologix can send you swabs to collect for a pcr respiratory panel for about $90, and that tests for a whole list of diseases.

Thank you. Honestly MG is contagious enough that if he tested positive I'd assume they all had it. I think the $90 for a definite answer would be worth it.

On that note, assuming it is MG, is there some sort of schedule I should follow in order to keep the birds from actively showing symptoms? My understanding is it is a bit like Herpes, except of course it is a respiratory illness. But it behaves the same way. It lies dormant until the bird undergoes a great stress and then it strikes.

 

[ColtHandorf]

A vet doing your testing would be very expensive.
Almost every state has a state lab. Some labs accept samples from private parties, while other's require the sample to come from a vet - each state is different.
It doesn't hurt to ask what they do, how much, etc. It may be doable, but on the other hand you do have to consider your budget, goals, etc. Completely understandable.

I figured as much, but I will ask the vet my dogs are seeing.

Most antibiotics, you would need to order online. Only a few injectables are available in stores. Since you have had a history of illness, if it's possible, it may be a good idea to have something on hand for emergency or if you have some birds showing symptoms. Of course that also requires storage and $$ too.

Yes, I used to breed a lot of finches and small hookbills and had an arsenal of supplements, vitamins, minerals, medicines, electrolytes, etc for them. Honestly I've never had this many health issues with birds, and I used to have about 2000-2500 fifteen years ago in over 60 breeds/species. But these English Orpingtons...when they get sick they get real sick.

Swab testing is fairly cheap.

Thank you for that link. I actually work at an A&M University, it is in Commerce though. makes me wish I could just call up the vet down there and get them to run the tests. lol But I'll certainly look into it.

 

[Kiki]

I figured as much, but I will ask the vet my dogs are seeing.



Yes, I used to breed a lot of finches and small hookbills and had an arsenal of supplements, vitamins, minerals, medicines, electrolytes, etc for them. Honestly I've never had this many health issues with birds, and I used to have about 2000-2500 fifteen years ago in over 60 breeds/species. But these English Orpingtons...when they get sick they get real sick.



Thank you for that link. I actually work at an A&M University, it is in Commerce though. makes me wish I could just call up the vet down there and get them to run the tests. lol But I'll certainly look into it.

Call them...it's free to ask.