So they are going to do it again

[Garden Peas]

All other debate aside, what I was trying to get opinions on was one of my birds. It is the oddball with the BS feathers on it's wing. He is no more than 50% white and it has been my personal experience with Pieds that they get more color not more white as they age. He is still young so I know he will change, but I've raised enough to know that he just looks different. I think he is covered with silvered feathers, I think his train, wings and back will all have that silver dusted plumage. But do I represent him as a "Silver Pied" when everyone I've ever spoken to has stated the opinion that a "Silver Pied" cannot have more than 80-90% colored feathers? I think maybe you meant to say must have 80-90% white? Or, can't have more than 10-20% colored feathers?This is my quandary, I do not want to have a bunch of people saying I am calling him something he is not. Anybody get my drift? I took some more pics of him, but they all came out looking blue-ish, because I had something set wrong. Darn Camera!

Better:

He is a beautiful bird!

 

[Garden Peas]

Oh, and one more thought...

I have wondered (and maybe expressed elsewhere on this forum) whether our "black shoulder" gene is actually another kind of color suppression or color restriction gene. Without belaboring the point this evening, if it does, in fact, operate to suppress the expression of color to certain locations (think bay gene in horses), then the fact that Governor Ralph Moonbeam is a black shoulder or at a minimum split black shoulder, could also be working to restrict or suppress the color on the bird...

Can someone post pics of black shoulder silver pieds?

 

[Garden Peas]

Sigh, maybe I could just belabor it a little bit, before I forget completely...

(Getting older and forgetful is a pain)

In some ways, the black shoulder gene seems a bit like the white eye gene. Both of them appear to me to affect the expression of color WITHIN THE FEATHER ITSELF. So you get a different pattern on individual feathers with the black shoulder gene, and you get white ocelli with the white eye gene (ETA and possibly, silver dusting also).

By contrast, with the pied gene and the white gene, the leucism suppresses the color to the entire feather. Even though you get patches of white on the bird, the individual feathers are either white or colored. You don't see (at least I don't think you see) a half-white feather in a pied bird.

The silver dusting reminds me of "tipping" on fur-bearers, where the end of the individual hair is brushed with color.

@DylansMom , can you describe where on the feather the "dusting" occurs? How does it change the pattern of coloration on the individual feather?

 

[new 2 pfowl]

IBBSSP, thanks to contributors to the Image Database:
http://peafowlimagedatabase.weebly.com/black-shoulder-silver-pied4.html


*@DylansMom : Interesting to note that one black wing feather on Texapeafowl's boy at the top...

 

[connerhills]

I don't think this is a silver pied .. It is a strong white showing up in the feathers. A silver pied have all feathers in the train either white eye or white no other color of eyes. There is no must have about the amount of white in the bird. You can not measure it exactly anyway.. If you raise enough of them you can see it about the time they dry off. As they do not breed true you will have some color variations . The first year I raised Silver pied I hatched 12 and all 12 were females and all were silver pied. Good luck with your bird as he will make some genes that will be helpful down the line.. George

 

[Trefoil]

I agree with George about the bird being a pied WE. But I have never seen anywhere in descriptions of silver pied where it didn't state that they had to be at least 80% white. And I believe, perhaps incorrectly, that the "silver sheen" was a refinement to the original description, added later.

 

[connerhills]

Most ,if not all of these numbers are from Brad Legg and if any one knows it would be him. I think it is a generalization and not an exact measurement. He also states what a pied bird is but no one says anything about that. A lot of people have looked at thousands and thousand of peafowl and have seen a lot of difference in birds and it is really difficult to define with in a few percent and use that as a guide line. One way I look at it is a silver pied is a bird with color on white and a pied bird as one with white on color. That will not make any sense to some but that is kinda how I started on them many years ago. If you look at the Bronze on my web site you will see a bird that is 80% white but he is not a silver pied . The silver pied is a result of the silver sheen it gets on the back and has been in the bird always I think. Thanks George

 

[KsKingBee]

Oh, and one more thought...


Can someone post pics of black shoulder silver pieds?

http://leggspeafowl.com/photo/blackshouldersilverpied.htm

 

[Dany12]

I believe what you said here, @KsKingBee is totally true... because silver pied (as I understand it) results (or resulted) from a combination of genes occurring together, including WE.

I disagree with the proposition that ALL IB pied WE birds are necessarily silver pied, as I am not sure that would include all the necessary genes for silver pied.

W ( white ) + P ( pied ) + 2 We ( white eyes ) can be Silver pied but all those birds are not necessarily Silver pied not everyone has the silver ... not everyone has the silvering.

A picture of this genetic is impossible to find on the net ! :
W ( white ) + P ( pied ) + 1 We ( white eyes )
This peacock must have ⅓ of the feathers are white + ⅓ of the feathers are white eyes + ⅓ are with colored eyes.

 

[DylansMom]

He is a beautiful bird!

Thanks, for the correction. That is exactly what I meant to say and wrote it backwards. I get dyslexic when I'm tired.